Ns and lying

[spyralle]

Lies from ex N...

I love you...
I will always be fathful...
If you lend me 25,.000 I will not run away and steal it from you.....  I could never do that to you (said with tears in his eyes)
You don't suit anything....  even though I think you are beautiful...
I want to marry you...
Your behaviour is unacceptable so I will not take you out with me and my friends.....  This is not because i want to chat up other women !!!!!
I don't really want you to give me half of your house...

And from my mother....
You have satan inside you...
You will drive me into a mental hospital...
You should only ever wear trousers....
You make me ill...
You will grow up to be a dirty woman with dirty children...
You are a sloven..
You are the lowest of the low..
You are a psychiatric nurse because schizophrenia is demonic...
You will have no friends...

Those are just the ones of the top of my head.... 

Spyralle x

[mum]

H&H,I have been reading your posts regarding your "dad" (and mom, actually) and I don't think I have ever told you how AMAZING and WONDERFUL you are. I really don't know how someone so beautiful grows from that kind of toxic soil......
You are inspiring. You have reminded me again and again that we are who we are because of everything we've been through and many times the toughest things can bring forth strength and grace beyond compare.

[Plucky]

Spyralle,
yikes!  your mother said all that!!!!!   Well at least you see them clearly as the toxic lies they are.  May she rot!
Plucky

[pink]

Spyralle, OMG, that's so terrible!  And amazing how much it reminds me of what my friend's N mother always told her. (She just told me yesterday how she still hears those tapes inside her head, at age 58, even though her N mom hasn't said many of them for years, like, "You're just an ugly fat girl that no one will ever care about.")  It's so criminal...!!!!!!!!

Something in this thread reminded me of something I learned quite recently about my grandfather (who passed away when I was a toddler). His wife, my grandmother, had 3 children, all of which came out with terrible, terrible psychological problems -- one being my N mother, another being my N uncle and another being my other uncle who was a scary pervert (now gone). Anyhow, I lived with my grandmother for a while and she told me about when she met my grandfather. The day she met him she asked if he was married and he said, "The sun has never risen on a woman I would marry." Everyone in the family -- as far as I know (because I no longer communicate with my uncles or mother) -- has always believed that my grandmother was the only wife he ever had. Well, I was playing around looking up the genealogy of the family, and lo and behold, my grandfather WAS married before -- and had EIGHT children with his first wife before he married my grandmother (who was nearly 30 years younger than him)!  Speaking of lies, how's that for a "whopper"?!!

And it's such a juicy bit of "family gossip," 'tis a shame I don't have anything to do with anyone on that side of the family anymore. Well, at least I got to tell my brother.

[Hopalong]

Dear Bean,
Could your Dad be any relation to James Frey of A Million Little Pieces?
Been a big scandal lately about Oprah and Frey... your Dad's lies remind me of his.

But I guess all lies are alike, really.

Salon.com had an article on the Frey fray a few days ago...what's even more fascinating to read are all the Letters.

Hops

[Plucky]

Lies by omission:  my father allowed all of his friends and acquaintances to believe he had only one child, my sister.    I always wondered why I was kept in the house all summer on our visitation with him.    On the very rare occasion I was out, whenever we met anyone he knew, and he knew everyone, such a popular, nice guy!  I kept hearing, "I didn't know you had another daughter!".    When I was older, I was frequently taken for his date!  He had to rush to correct the person before I heard more than I should.  Yuk! 
Plucky

[spyralle]

You always make me smile Plucky X

My dad told the same kind of lie.  Well both of them did.  When I was thirty two I found out that my dad had been married before, to a bigamist...  She had been married to someone who had gone off to war and then she married my dad.  they had two children and then her first husband came back.  apparantly she left that day with the two children and that was that...  it was never spoken of in my house and my brother still does not know.  i only found out as my dad was dying and started to ramble about the past so my mum had to tell me.  Maybe that explains why my father didn't really want much to do with me.  Certainly explains why I was never allowed to create my family tree..

Spyralle x

[darky]

hmmmmm interesting post! my frequent n mother lies:

"i dont care what people think"   "when you were growing up, my house was clean and run like clockwork"   "i never lie"  "i never say anything i dont mean"  "i always accept the consequences of my actions"   "when you were little, you had free run of the house, to make as much mess as you wanted"     "you never went without anything" (material no, love yes, until i was 12 and earning my own money, then i was buying my own clothes, school uniforms, and school lunches)
"i forgot why you had a brainscan"  "i never get myself into debt, i live by my means"   "i have always loved you, and always will"   "i am not selfish, i always put others needs first, people do not ever think of me and what i want"     "you have no reason to feel insecure"   "i never apologise, because i dont say or do anything wrong"   "if people take me the wrong way, then thats their problem, i dont have to justify myself to anyone"  "i never smacked you around the head"   "i treat you all the same" 

[Portia]

Was that Chinese post (now deleted) links to a ‘girly’ site? Or something else? I installed my ‘Chinese’ (sic) language stuff just to look at it. It didn’t help much! Ah well.

Darky, these stood out to me, for my reasons:

"you have no reason to feel insecure" 

Dontcha just love those ‘you feel/think’ statements? Bad programming indeed. ‘What you think or feel is wrong, only I know how you think and feel’. How can you get to trust your own stuff?

"i never apologise, because i dont say or do anything wrong"

Classic. There’s no arguing with this. No arguing, no talking, no nothing. Just silence.

(((((Darky)))) you had it tough. I’m glad you’re here.

[darky]

omg bean im peeing myself laffing at his one "we dont have to keep up with the jones's" you wanna know why??? because we ARE jones's, honestly!!! jones is my maiden name hahahahahahaha!!

and as for treating the same! well, my mother looked after my nephew for a week when my sister gave birth to her second son. my mother couldnt have my 2 boys for more then 12 hours when my daughter was born. in fact, it took me ages to convince her to have them at all. her attitude? well, "when you were born, fathers didnt come in, i was dropped t the door, i did it, you can do it" hours after i had my princess, i asked mother if she could watch the boys just for a few more hours as me and hubby had not had time together since the birth as the birth was late in the evening. she said "back in my day, you got on with it, i didnt choose for you to have this baby its your responsability, you made your bed go lie on it!

oh and all the time we were growing up, my mother said she had taken out a policy so when we turned 18 we have have a few quid to help us get our foot in life. i turned 18, policy matured, did i see it? hell no, my mum and dad went to america! (im from uk) had a great time and didnt as much as buy us a stick of candy lol.  when my middle sisters matured, she got a car and she got it because life was hard as she had a baby when she was 17. my youngest sister got thrown out just before hers matured, and what did they do with the money? they went to america again lol.

[Moira]

Hi Spyralle! Just read this thread and saw your post. Boy can i identify with what you said- esp comments from your mother! Maybe we are siblings! Hee hee! Like many others here, I used to fantasize i really must have been adopted...soooo...maybe we are related! I wax idiotic! Anyway...my mother used to say to and about me: "All my other children have real talents....you are stupid...you are crazy and will always have to live at home with our father and me....you will never be able to live on your own, go to school or hold a job ...you are fat....you are amoral...you are going to hell...you are a slut" etc etc. I am left handed, dyslexic, have a mental illness( just like dear old mom- I'm bipolar as opposed to her Nism), broke away from my church as a teen, have been married more than once, have had long term live in relationships, have a university and college degree, have a career and am a professional X 20 years, etc. ironically, spyralle, I too am a nurse working in psychiatry! Ya do what ya know, eh?! hee hee! I've also certainly had more than my share of N men's bullshit. " You are my soul mate.....you are the most beautiful, smartest, most loving woman I've ever been with, I'm a lucky man, You are the ugliest, oldest, most miserable, pathetic bitch I've ever met...I'm an idiot. You played me...You used me..You are the liar....I'm calling your psychiatrist to have you committed to the psych ward because you keep accusing me of things I don't do...so you are the crazy one" blah blah!!!! On a good day I can look at both my Nmother and ex Ns as tortured people who were raised with either abuse or abandonment- or both- and are damaged themselves. i do now believe that my mother did love me to the extent she was capable of and to the best of her ability given her own childhood betrayals, abuse etc. i don't see her as evil anymore! Validating to read other's experiences- and painful too. Hugs, Moira

[dandylife]

"I just need 1 hour a day because I love you so much."

"I don't get turned on by other women ever."

"When you don't hold my hand it must mean you don't love me."

"If you don't put a towel up on the shower stall for me it means you don't care about me anymore."

"When you put the armrest up between us on the plane it means you hate me."

"When you go for a walk without me, you are thinking that you want to break up."

It's not really lies, you see. The person is telling you their belief system. They really believe these things. It's also called magical thinking. Logical beings can pick out the illogic of it. But in the throes of BPD or NPD, these folks are not coherent of reality. They truly believe. Therefore they can argue, debate, and LIE until blue in the face and totally believe what they are saying. They can convince other people. "Wow, I was passionate, wasn't I?" Yes, but totally off.

It's part of the diagnostic for NPD.