Author Topic: Dreams  (Read 8235 times)

sjkravill

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Dreams
« on: May 06, 2004, 05:08:06 PM »
I have been curious...
Does anyone here try to analyze dreams as a way of being atuned to your soul/psyche/ whatever you want to call it... A way of touching the depths of your unconscious?  Maybe to look for healing?

I don't have very many dreams that lend themselves to interpretation. I have had maybe one or two in the last few months.  One of the dreams was relatively coherent, and I was really struck by the bold colors that appeared in the dream.  So, I was looking on line to find what the colors or objects (combination of the two) could mean.  It was fascinating, and lead me to new grains of truth.  

The one I had most recently was actually two or three consecutive dreams that took place in a large dark murkey pond.  In one of the dreams, the dark murkey water was a classroom filled almost to the top with water, where my young mom had (in the dream) gone to nursing school.  I was revisiting her past, seeing pictures of her, talking to her friends....  In the next dream, my parents (when they were young and dating) had tipped over in a canoe out in a big dark lake.  I was only there mentally.  I remembered how my mom used to explain that we would never go canoeing as a family because they tried it once while dating (apparently it didn't go well?).  Wierd!  In the third dream, I was swimming in a huge dark pond in my grandmother's back yard. My cousins were there swimming too. There were trees and ice bergs in the pond.  I never knew what my feet were going to touch.... They would have made a good surrealist movie.

I started asking myself what the dark water meant to me, how I felt about the water... what was I telling myself. How does this correlate with my emotional state, relationships, thoughts....  I didn't come up with anything concrete.  Just a feeling of uncertainty as I sort out my childhood and adult "stuff."  I am sure all of the people and elements of the dream could have been analyzed.

Does anyone here think about/analyze your dreams? Learn anything?  Have any methods or ways to think about them?  
just curious!
peace, sjkravill

Portia

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Dreams
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2004, 06:08:15 AM »
Wow, gotta reply to this one sjkravill. Thanks!

Since I started going on holiday abroad (this coincides with mental turmoil and increasing awareness) I have many dreams (at home) about swimming pools and the sea. Did you ever see the old film ‘The Swimmer’? – about swimming ‘home’. In my dreams I’m always swimming in various pools, trying different ones and my current partner is always somewhere else and I’m going to be late for some deadline – like the plane leaving. But I always have to try out that other pool, or that rocky bit of the coastline….and in reality on holiday, I never get to swim enough and probably feel a bit miffed that I don’t (he likes to drive around, as I do, so I tend to forgo the swims)…..

Funny how writing it makes it analyse-able. It’s probably all about sex and romantic relationships with me, honestly. That sounds trite but heck, I should know.

Water seems to be a biggy - like flying – ever had flying dreams? Maybe water is beyond analysis and goes right back to the original, real womb we were in? Very interesting that in your third dream you’re in your grandmother’s back yard – is that your maternal grandmother? Maybe you can see where I’m off to here? Sjkravill, please forgive me but I know about your H but can’t remember if you’ve said much detail about your parents … have you? Please point me back to a post if so. If not, do you want to talk about your mother and father?

In general some of my dreams are so obvious – screaming at me to see ‘what’s what’ – but others defy me, like a meaning is there but I refuse to ‘get it’. Frustrating. Last night I dreamt about the N I lived with for six months (15+ years ago) – a big surprise because I’ve dreamt about him only once every year or so. In the dream I was attracted to him again – to his neediness and arrogance, wanting to ‘lose myself’ in him. I guess it was my mother. In the dream I stopped and thought why am I doing this, what’s attractive about this - nothing. Maybe I am moving on, maybe when I felt some kind of sadness on waking today, I was doing a bit of dream grieving? Maybe, but I can’t push these things. But thanks for getting me to think about this and write today. It helps! P

sjkravill

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Dreams
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2004, 02:09:00 PM »
Hey Portia,
It sounds like your dreams are about exploring on your own.  Maybe a need to take time for yourself away from the partner and despite pressures of deadlines... I also like your idea that we do work in dreams, like grief, or forgiveness or whatever...  You have a fantastic wisdom in saying "I can't push these things."
What a great willingness to settle for the understanding/ feeling you have for now, and just let it happen, or come.  I am always trying to "push" things...

I have never had, but always wanted to have a flying dream.  This was my first water dream.  I will have to watch "the swimmer."  I like the idea of 'swimming home.'  I also loved your image of water and the womb we are in.  Although, I am not sure I completely understand.  Like the world as womb?  

Please excuse the terrible pun but it never occured to me that these may be "wet dreams"  ... meaning about sex!  If thats the case then the water symbolizes both my fears and desires concerning sex with my H

In the third dream that was my maternal grandmother's back yard. She and I have always been very close.  Hmm... this might be about my mother.  Or her sentiment.  I have not said much about my parents.  I have never really known what to say about them.  I did comment once that I have somehow blocked a lot of memories of growing up. Usually I avoid thinking about my childhood.  I go around thinking my parents are saints.  I really admire and appreciate both of them.  I have a hard time feeling anything but emapthy and graditude for them.  

I am the child they are proud of.  It has always been much worse for my poor younger brother, because he was a little less obedient than I was.  Ever since he was a two-year-old, he'd be damned if he was going to be controlled! I just tried to aviod trouble.

I have memories of feeling criticized, controlled, invisible, and afraid of both of them as a child and adolescent...  I never really validated my experience, but I think this is why I went abroad for a year in high school, why I went away to school, why I ran off and got married at such a young age, and now live 17 hours away.  They are well meaning, and we get a long much better at a distance.  

Actual childhood memories sometimes take me by surprise with the slightest referrence... or they come from intentional digging for why I consistantly react so primatively to certain circumstances now. My adult mind knows my parents were dealing with their own issues, and could not always be responsible with their emotions or childhood and adult stuff.  Consciously, I pin most of this irresponsibility on my mother, but when I think about it my father had his part too.  I think the difference is my father is more self-aware and laid back than my mother.  So, it was easier to relate to him.  In the dream when I was visiting my mother's past, maybe I was seeing her as a real person to whom I could relate....

The dreams still mystify me... but over time small insights come.  Thanks for sharing your dreams and wisdom, helping me think... listening...

Peace, sjkravill

October

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Re: Dreams
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2004, 04:03:56 PM »
Quote from: sjkravill
I have been curious...

The one I had most recently was actually two or three consecutive dreams that took place in a large dark murkey pond.  In one of the dreams, the dark murkey water was a classroom filled almost to the top with water, where my young mom had (in the dream) gone to nursing school.  I was revisiting her past, seeing pictures of her, talking to her friends....  In the next dream, my parents (when they were young and dating) had tipped over in a canoe out in a big dark lake.  I was only there mentally.  I remembered how my mom used to explain that we would never go canoeing as a family because they tried it once while dating (apparently it didn't go well?).  Wierd!  In the third dream, I was swimming in a huge dark pond in my grandmother's back yard. My cousins were there swimming too. There were trees and ice bergs in the pond.  I never knew what my feet were going to touch.... They would have made a good surrealist movie.


peace, sjkravill



The thing that struck me about your posts, is that they are not about your life, they are about your mother and her experiences.  Even the one where you are present, you are in your grandmother's yard, swimming in a deep dark pond.  I suspect that all three murky ponds are your mother's life, and you are swimming around in them, probably wondering what the hell you are doing there, instead of in your own nice clear little pond.

What this tells me is that you are possessed by your mother.  Not in a demonic way, but in an emotional way.  She has told you lots of personal, intimate stuff, not to become close to you, but to get you to relive her life for her, and you are doing it in your dreams, and probably in real life too.

Water is often symbolic of emotion, and in particular powerful emotions.  And as has already been said, it can also be symbolic of motherhood.  In this case, the motherhood it shows you is not a very nice kind.  It is cold, dark, and deep, and has trees (family problems???) and icebergs (rejection??) in it.  And quite rightly, you are not the only one caught in the pool, your cousins are involved, which suggests that your grandmother was the same as your mother, and all her children were affected, and their children, as you have been.  As you rightly say, this is a huge dark pool.  

My own family swims in an equally huge dark pool, so I know this can be true.  Lots of people there, but most of them don't know it.  

I think to help deal with this one, I would try to find a picture of your ideal pond or lake; somewhere really beautiful.  A photograph would be nice, but if not then an imagined image would do.  Perhaps somewhere you have actually been.  Use it as a soothing image when things get difficult, and 'escape' to it.  Or change the image, and use a mountain.  But something that you own for yourself, and you choose who you swim with.

In effect, your dreams are saying, 'this water is yucky, how do I get out?'

Hope this helps.

Cathy

October

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Dreams
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2004, 04:18:54 PM »
Quote from: sjkravill
My adult mind knows my parents were dealing with their own issues, and could not always be responsible with their emotions or childhood and adult stuff.  

Peace, sjkravill



Just a thought on this one, sjkravill.  I have huge problems of my own, dealing with my emotions and depression and god knows what else.  There is a lot of childhood stuff there, and it is not easy to keep going.

As you say about your parents, I am not responsible for what happened, and I cannot change what happened.  All I can do is deal with it as best I can and continue to walk the path I have to walk.  Very hard.  

However, I am always, absolutely always, responsible for what I do in relation to my daughter.  That is what being an adult is all about.  Being hurt and damaged does not absolve me from looking after her, and meeting her emotional needs.  Sometimes I think she will never know how hard it is for me to keep going day after day, asking how her day was at school, and buying her little surprise presents, or letting her have friends to tea when I want to not see anyone ever, and I feel empty inside, as if I can't care and can't love.  Then sometimes I think it is good that she will never know those things, because that would only load her with guilt for having a happy time when I was so unhappy.  So depressed.  (Seven years of clinical depression so far, and counting.)

If your parents were not able to make this distinction, the responsibility is not yours, and was not yours when you were younger.  It is theirs.  Absolutely it is theirs.  It does not (necessarily) make them bad people, but it might well make them bad parents.  

We were taught to make excuses for our parents.  Change the people around, and imagine yourself doing or saying what they did, and a child of your own, or one you know, on the receiving end, and you will find a different picture.  This is the only way I found for changing my perspective on things that I thought were ok.  It was ok done to me, but anyone try it with my daughter, and they had better watch out!!!!!

Anonymous

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Dreams
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2004, 07:21:03 PM »
Hi Cathy,
Wow!  You have so much insight for me... Where to begin?

First, I want to say, I am dealing with different intensities of depression for the past two years. My depression is mild to moderate right now.  I admire your great strength and courage, and your responsibility with a daughter. How very difficult it must be. It sounds like you are being a wonderful mom inspite of the difficulty of depression.  How lucky your daughter is!  She will never feel responsible for your happiness, and she will never feel guilty about her happiness.  

You are right, parents are responsible for being parents.  Children are not responsible for their parents.  This is a difficult concept, for children who have been given too much responsibility, to grasp.  

My mother's life is a bit of a mystery to me. You have sparked my thinking!  I was hesitent to say she was an N, but I just realized that there are N tendancies.  Yes, you are right.  In a way, I am possessed by her in some ways.  I want to please her, and I want not to upset her.  She likes to control things and to live through me.  It's as though she never figured out that I was not her.  Unlike her, I did not like shopping, I did not like the clothse she picked out for me.  These things always hurt her feelings.  She liked making my decisions because she knew I would thank her.  She knew what was best for me.  I wanted a very small, inexpensive wedding.  But it was though my mother were planning her own wedding again.  I just let her have it.  It was easier than arguing with her.  It was elegant and beautiful.  I try to understand my mother.  I try to have a peaceful relationship with her, but this is done either at a distance, or at the expense of living my own life.  

I have always had difficulty accepting the bits of my mother that reside in me.  I have wanted to be different from my mother.  And when I realize I am like her, it frightens me. It is like swimming in a dark, cold lake.

My maternal grandmother, I have always adored her!  I have always felt that she understood me in a way my mother did not.  In comparison to my father's family my mother's family is perfect.  It is only now that I realize there is a certain way things should be done in my mother's family. There are subtle favoritisms, which must be hurtful to my mother.  I think I care about my grandmother's approval more than anyone else's in the whole wide world.  So, yes, I am swimming in her back yard.  I am swimming in a family history.  As I think about my mother's siblings, and the cousins, I realize there are some N tendancies in who each of them is. Controling perfectionists, and controling rebels.  Extremely subtle, but powerful nonetheless.  We (the family) are all in the pool, but most of us don't know it.  

Thank you for your insight in helping me to continue to work with this dream and frame it in different ways!

Peace, sjkravill

DenmarkGuy

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Dreams
« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2004, 06:10:18 PM »
Wow-- how wonderful to find a discussion of dreams here....

I have found dreams, and dream analysis, a wonderful insight into the "unfiltered" psyche. My therapist during the latter stages of my former marriage (to a BDP/emotionally abusive person) suggested that I started keeping a dream journal-- because (she said) dreams are symbolic of what our subconscious is saying, without the "safety filters" we wear during the waking hours. This was almost 10 years ago, and I have been keeping a dream journal ever since. I have found tremendous healing in dreams-- although the "danger" with dreams is that they can be pretty "to the point" and may present us with truths we are not ready to look at.

Ultimately, a dream only makes sense in the context of the dreamer's life. "Outsiders" can interpret the symbolism, and perhaps find patterns, but we have to find our own "meaning."

Water, in itself, symbolizes the psyche the and subconscious, the state of your unconscious mind. A pond would suggest a "contained" issue(s), something that's being held in a limited space. The fact that the pond is murky implies negative emotions-- and more literally that your emotions are "unclear" or "muddy." Common to all three dreams is the darkness of the water, which again is a symbol of emotional states. Here the implication may be about "keeping things in the dark," and fear of the unknown-- which sort of matches up with "I never knew what my feet were going to touch." The icebergs are a VERY unusual dream symbol but they imply a feeling of not having used one's potential and strengths. These dreams are very strongly about your mind and "inner work" you're doing, or needing to do.

If you're interested in dreams, I can also suggest a dream analysis community online, where I sometimes post my dreams for analysis-- the people there have been very insightful.

--Peter

Learning

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Dreams
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2004, 11:17:36 AM »
Hi Peter,

Your post is very interesting.  I also have very vivid dreams quite often that I try to analyze.  I would be interested in the forum you mentioned or any other resources that are helpful in interpreting dreams.

Thanks!
Lisa

P.S. Hi Sjkravill, how are you doing?

sjkravill

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Dreams
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2004, 08:51:25 PM »
Godag Peter,
I can speak Danish!
Thank you for your dream insight. I have beel slowly learning more about analyzing dreams, and sometimes find it quite revealing... There are layers and layers of meaning.  Sometimes, it is obvious, and sometimes mysterious.  It has been helpful for me to recognize my feelings.

Hi Learning,
I'm doing ok... in the midst of a transition right now.

Anonymous

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Dreams
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2004, 07:08:32 AM »
Can anyone here suggest an respected book on dream interpretation?

DenmarkGuy

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Dreams
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2004, 02:28:21 PM »
Quote from: Learning
Hi Peter,

Your post is very interesting.  I also have very vivid dreams quite often that I try to analyze.  I would be interested in the forum you mentioned or any other resources that are helpful in interpreting dreams.


Lisa, here's a link-- you'll (probably) need to set up a GoJabber account first (free and easy) so you can log in:

The Dream Inn forum

Also, as books go, I'd recommend something like "All About Dreams" by Dr. Gayle Delaney which is NOT a "dream dictionary," but more of a lesson in understanding the underlying structure of dreams.

Goddag sjkravill! Not often I bump into anyone who speaks Danish-- yes, dreams have many layers; lots of exploration.

--Peter

Learning

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Dreams
« Reply #11 on: August 27, 2004, 11:22:38 AM »
Thanks Peter!

Sjkravill-I'm glad to hear you are doing ok.  I hope your transition is going well and I hope to hear more from you. :)

Lisa

onlyrenting

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palmreading
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2004, 02:08:03 PM »
Hi, I was reading the post on dreams and thought about the palm reading I became intrested in when I was very young. I was also very intrested in dreams and there meanings.
Plam reading helps me even today.  I can look at a strangers hand
and get an idea what they are about.
I have been able to accept myself on things I can't change and understand my strengths.
I had problems with my mother and often wanted to understand myself so she couldn't undermind who I was.
anyway my N husband needs to use the computer so will write later.

onlyrenting

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dreams-endless running from danger
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2004, 10:00:50 PM »
Hi, I happen to be reading a book about narrsisstics called man's aggression by Gregory Rochlin. (this is a break down of the dream)

I used to have this dream when I was a kid and never knew what it meant.
I guess I was angry at the hurt from my mother.

due to a possible narsisstic attack and the denial of hostility in the dreamer.

in the dream you're in danger endless running from something near to your being destroyed.
your efforts to escape are on laden feet. devalued ineffectual and stripped of powers, all the aggresive intentions are held by the assailant

the nightmare is brought in full understanding when we recoginize it as a particular or special vehicle of violence, It carries the unconsicious wish to be destrictive.
the nightmare thus confirms the depth of the prohibition against aggression toward those with whom we are intimate.
this is an unconscious wish , so often manifested in everyday life, carried into sleep, turns the dreamer into a victim and gives the nightmare its terror.

I have just read this by chance and maybe it will be of intrest.