Voicelessness and Emotional Survival > Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
This and That
Twoapenny:
Lighter, forgive my ignorance regarding guns in the States, but how does it all work? Is there no checking or monitoring of who has guns or what they want them for? I don't know much about them at all other than knowing that here there are certain checks and measures (which I think were increased after a school shooting here in the 90s) and that whoever has a gun has to have a licence, they need to be kept in locked cupboards and so on. I hope that recent situation with the boy making the threat has been resolved now (and that the situation with former boyfriend goes okay for D). I think the scary thing is that teenagers can be so impulsive and although they're nearly adults, they still don't have very good coping skills (in some cases). It's just so scary, I hope everyone is okay now xx
sKePTiKal:
Tupp, in actuality, guns are pretty heavily regulated. Even online or at gun shows - if you're buying a gun, you must fill out a form. That information is then sent to BATFE (Bureau of alchohol, tobacco, firearms & explosives). They cross-reference the personal information with their list of people who have been reported to them, that for one reason or another are NOT allowed to buy weapons. For instance, former felons and anyone with any domestic violence actions/reports against them.
Problems still happen - and people slip through the cracks - because each state has different criteria for reporting people who shouldn't be allowed to buy... and often, those reports aren't made in a timely fashion. This happened in the Texas church shooting. It was the AIR FORCE, of all things, that didn't get this guy's information turned in... so when the form was checked, the agency that says yes/no about whether this person can buy a gun... it said YES.
It's the old data entry problem: garbage in/garbage out.
That's only one glitch. People can and do lie on that form. The gun shop owner has only the person's ID to "verify" who they are. In North Carolina, there is another step in the process. The sheriff must issue a "purchase permit". To get the permit, you will need a notarized affadavit stating you are a person of "sound mind and high moral character". It's kind of an anachonism... and again, it's possible to cheat this too. But the local sheriff really WOULD know if there had been trouble with that individual, if there were any 911 calls related to them.
Now, to conceal carry a handgun... the background check is a LOT more stringent. There is a section where you must provide information if you've been under mental health care - and where, with whom and for what. Any previous legal problems. And all the other categories that can disqualify a person from owning a gun, by law. The sheriff then actually investigates each application and the applicant will be fingerprinted - and those prints will doublechecked against the gun ownership database. This makes it harder to lie. There is typically a waiting period that allows for the investigation to take place, before the permit is issued. It can be a short time, but typically it's 90 days. Longer in some states, and some states set the bar so high, that you must essentially claim and PROVE, that you have an immediate need for self-protection. These permits usually have to be renewed every 5 years.
In NC, there is a short-cut temporary "permit" for victims of domestic violence who are still being threatened actively. So those people can protect themselves, prior to being severely injured or killed even. It happens. Frequently enough, that these cases are seldom headline news anymore.
It gets more complicated than that - but this is the simple primer on what our laws are like. Yes, criminals can still buy a gun on the "black market" - from other criminals. Guns are stolen and then sold. (Mostly to get money for drugs.) And sales between private individuals still happen... but nowadays, the serial number is recorded and unless people are acquainted and friends... driver's license number included on 2 copies of receipts so that the transaction is documented.
So contrary to the internet memes, it's not all that easy to buy a gun in the US. There is a distinct process, that is designed to prevent disqualified people from buying, sellers have to be licensed - online or not; private individuals can only sell a small number before they are required to be licensed; and yet, bad people with evil intent have a lot fewer hoops to jump through. They just need to know somebody who knows somebody who sells guns outside the system. No, they're not nice people either.
Twoapenny:
--- Quote from: sKePTiKal on February 25, 2018, 07:43:37 AM ---Tupp, in actuality, guns are pretty heavily regulated. Even online or at gun shows - if you're buying a gun, you must fill out a form. That information is then sent to BATFE (Bureau of alchohol, tobacco, firearms & explosives). They cross-reference the personal information with their list of people who have been reported to them, that for one reason or another are NOT allowed to buy weapons. For instance, former felons and anyone with any domestic violence actions/reports against them.
Problems still happen - and people slip through the cracks - because each state has different criteria for reporting people who shouldn't be allowed to buy... and often, those reports aren't made in a timely fashion. This happened in the Texas church shooting. It was the AIR FORCE, of all things, that didn't get this guy's information turned in... so when the form was checked, the agency that says yes/no about whether this person can buy a gun... it said YES.
It's the old data entry problem: garbage in/garbage out.
That's only one glitch. People can and do lie on that form. The gun shop owner has only the person's ID to "verify" who they are. In North Carolina, there is another step in the process. The sheriff must issue a "purchase permit". To get the permit, you will need a notarized affadavit stating you are a person of "sound mind and high moral character". It's kind of an anachonism... and again, it's possible to cheat this too. But the local sheriff really WOULD know if there had been trouble with that individual, if there were any 911 calls related to them.
Now, to conceal carry a handgun... the background check is a LOT more stringent. There is a section where you must provide information if you've been under mental health care - and where, with whom and for what. Any previous legal problems. And all the other categories that can disqualify a person from owning a gun, by law. The sheriff then actually investigates each application and the applicant will be fingerprinted - and those prints will doublechecked against the gun ownership database. This makes it harder to lie. There is typically a waiting period that allows for the investigation to take place, before the permit is issued. It can be a short time, but typically it's 90 days. Longer in some states, and some states set the bar so high, that you must essentially claim and PROVE, that you have an immediate need for self-protection. These permits usually have to be renewed every 5 years.
In NC, there is a short-cut temporary "permit" for victims of domestic violence who are still being threatened actively. So those people can protect themselves, prior to being severely injured or killed even. It happens. Frequently enough, that these cases are seldom headline news anymore.
It gets more complicated than that - but this is the simple primer on what our laws are like. Yes, criminals can still buy a gun on the "black market" - from other criminals. Guns are stolen and then sold. (Mostly to get money for drugs.) And sales between private individuals still happen... but nowadays, the serial number is recorded and unless people are acquainted and friends... driver's license number included on 2 copies of receipts so that the transaction is documented.
So contrary to the internet memes, it's not all that easy to buy a gun in the US. There is a distinct process, that is designed to prevent disqualified people from buying, sellers have to be licensed - online or not; private individuals can only sell a small number before they are required to be licensed; and yet, bad people with evil intent have a lot fewer hoops to jump through. They just need to know somebody who knows somebody who sells guns outside the system. No, they're not nice people either.
--- End quote ---
Wow, Skep, thanks for explaining all of that to me, it's a topic that is so alien to me it kind of makes my head explode! You look at some problems and think, what's the answer? It's all so scary :(
sKePTiKal:
Yes, it is scary.
But I look at it this way. There have always been evil people doing bad things as long as there have been humans. I've been studying how the media (tv, radio, internet) subtly manages their coverage/angle of reporting for some years now. I've never ever seen this much trying to divide people, or demean them, or scare the bejeezus out of people. It's like a lot of things are magnified more than they should be and that when you look at all the facts, the context, and gain some perspective... well, things aren't as hateful or violent or chaotic as it seems, given the presentation.
I don't know if they think this will improve their ratings, keep them relevant, or if they really do have a purpose in frightening people and pushing their various ideas/agendas. But I do know how to turn it OFF. And at this point, I'm very very selective even about what I read online.
For me, it's exactly like we've said about Ns. The only way out of their game, to avoid being upset and emotionally/psychologically manipulated is to NOT PLAY. So I don't lend my eyeballs and data to their ratings. This isn't journalism anymore. I honestly don't know WHAT it is.
Hopalong:
Hi Tupp,
My take is that many Americans' obsession with the 2nd amendment is irrational, fear driven, and completely out of whack with the founders' purpose in adding it: for a well-regulated militia. And that many Americans have been brainwashed by manipulative message plus the NRA, which is a terrorist organization in my view.
Think Westerns, cowboys, wars and every sort of macho. Bang bang, cowboy. Nobody NEEDS military-grade automatic weapons and the millions and millions of them littering our country are a symptom of a sick culture.
It's a perverted toxic-aggressive energy that's saturated our society for years (since our genocidal origin) and leads to a lot of stuff (football for kids despite CTE discovery, for example; various unnecessary wars, police brutality, misogyny and rape culture, on and on). I still love every bright and shining ideal I loved about my country as a child. But right now, our ugly adolescence is in painful focus across the planet. We're only 200 years old and are actually an adolescent country.
People from many other cultures come here and are truly shocked by the level of violence in American society. Unfortunately, due to our history and our lax educational systems, we've "normalized" a whole lot of stuff that saner cultures can still examine objectively.
Others' mileage may vary, but I am so so so proud of the Parkland teenagers who are erupting into action, after the adult culture and Congress has abandoned them over and over. For money. From the NRA.
love
Hops
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