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Double Jeopardy; A; WTH is the matter with women. Q; What is Men, Alex?

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mudpuppy:
Just got three or four long texts from her. Basically told me what a horse's ass I am.
After considering the last couple of weeks I think I have to agree with her.

mud

Hopalong:
Of course it hurt. A LOT.

I think there will be two tricks, that once you master them, all will be well:

Trick 1.
The implied contract of "I love you" is one neither of you should have signed or blurted or heavy-breathed yourselves into So Damn Fast. Those romantic/religious words can feel like Niagara Falls rushing into a lonely heart. So the triggered sequelae's legitimacy are undermined (you owe me now, you're not allowed to, I have a right to guilt you now) by the fact that it wasn't an authentic contract. It was under duress (romantic duress, lust duress, loneliness duress). For you both.

Of COURSE it hurt anyway that she broke it -- we're just wired that way in this culture, to react to love words like dynamite when we're feeling certain ways or thinking certain ways. But...when he encounters such a dramatically gorgeous vision again, Mature Mud will realize quickly he should not rapidly draft and sign that implied contract until, say, quite a few months of talking and learning and observing and sharing different seasons and situations and meeting each others' closest friends and observing THEM closely --all while perhaps staying out of bed sez the old prude?--are through. Nor should she. MM would have Backed Away Gently when the firehose feelings appeared too soon. Firehose feelings are only firehose feelings--a sign that all is not yet safe for the heart on fire. It WILL be, one day soon.

Trick 2.
The very moment--without any wiggle room, texts/exceptions/persuasions--that a woman asks for or asserts her desire for space/time/privacy/distance/alone-time/rest [Tip: All of these are Nos] you A-lock your jaws shut, B-disable your devices and C-Accept Her No.

Earlier, you said,
--- Quote ---...Regardless, the way to deal with it is to talk about it and make adjustments not run away.
--- End quote ---
"Regardless" = regardless of what she said/asked for/stated/requested. Regardless of what she wanted. "...The way to deal with it" = the way I want her to deal with it. Surefine. But that's how YOU wanted her to deal with it, which was not the way SHE wanted to deal with it. She wanted to retreat/take space/withdraw/think about it by herself. Which means, she had said No.

You don't ask/demand/insist that a woman explain to you, Yes, this is a No. You open yourself to a No being a perfectly fine if disappointing response. You accept her No Instantly after saying, "Okay. I'm going to miss you. Let me know when you want to reconnect." And then you coil up your firehouse and get very busy distracting yourself from analysing/explaining what is wrong with her. Exhausting workouts. Two movies a day. Volunteering directly with humans (very old, very young). Wear yourself out. Keep the faith that whatever happens or does not happen, you will be okay. Have patience with yourself, as the intrusive thoughts appear, gently let them pass and redirect your mind to the movie, the workout, the volunteering. Not to what is wrong with her. (Yes, she approached you first--girls are allowed to do that. You brought out the firehose first.)

It is fine for healthy people to say No to each other when they need to. A No is one of the responses we can give. It is honest, responsible, real. It can be neutral, healthy, and sometimes heart-breaking. It can be cruel but just because your response is disappointment doesn't mean it's invalid for some reason. It's in the human repertoire. It's information, not Being Bad.


--- Quote ---once she asked for space I asked her more than once if she minded if I text her my thoughts and she obliged
--- End quote ---

She asked for space (that's a No). You pressured her (more than once). With a lot of volume of words. Even if she "obliged" with a [weary] yes... you did not accept her initial No.

That's the echo I hear from the earlier infatuation. A firehose fixation and then a verbal, analytical, full-of-logic-and-justifications mountain of pushback and persuasion against her No. I think you want to not work so hard to persuade anyone to love you. You are entirely lovable already. You deserve love already, as you are. You are a wonderful person, Mud. Love is all around. You will intersect with the right woman in the right way and at the right time. It'll be calmer.

I really do understand it all (man, did I do the volumes of words and pressure and persuasion--which thankfully failed but were AGONY) and the pattern doesn't monsterize you, Mud. But it IS a pattern for you, I believe.

Instead of keeping your focus on What is Wrong With Women, which could take you to a long-term lonely place, I think the more you study and unpack and work in therapy on yourself, the happier your chances of a small dusty green garden hose springing to life one day with clean, refreshing and sustaining love.

Look for the little garden hose. Listen for the still small voice within, not the orchestra. That's where sustaining love starts. IMHO.

love to you,
Hops
PS--Consider trying a female counselor, your age-ish. Secular counseling. It does not undermine or disrespect faith (if it does, run). But it might help you avoid unintended mistaken-theology male privilege potholes that do undermine right relationship.
PPS-Book for you: https://www.amazon.com/Love-Western-World-Denis-Rougemont/dp/0691013934

mudpuppy:
Did you read my last comment Hops?
I basically said in two lines what you did in your last comment.

Trick 1. Done.
Trick 2. Done.

However you completely misunderstand the basic problem. Mrs Mudpup and I did fall in love in weeks or less and got married in five months and it was perfect.
My problem isn't that I don't have some homely, frizzy haired, man hating Ivy League therapist telling me what a jerk I am. Nor is that I'm white and have testes and privilege. My problem is I, like a complete moron, wanted to recreate or even expected to recreate what I had with the late Mrs Mudpup.
I now see what a blazing retard I was to do that.

I know it is a very slim hope, but I hope after a few months or even more in which we both heal that this recent girl and I can start over and do it right over a long period of times as just friends and then possibly more. In the middle of breaking up I suggested we sometime go to the same restaurant we had our first date at to have a second first date to start over from the beginning and do it right this time. She thought it was a very good idea then. Perhaps she will again some day.

mud

Hopalong:

--- Quote ---homely, frizzy haired, man hating Ivy League therapist
--- End quote ---

I see now.

I don't think I can help.

Wish you the best, Mud,
Hops

mudpuppy:
Surely you remember I like joking around?

If you'll read over your responses there is almost nothing about the possibility this gal was making me crazy and didn't respond well to very minor relationship issues. If it's going too fast slow it down. She said she wanted to and I agreed we should. If we're too physical stop being physical. Agreed. I agreed with everything she said, but she looked for the very first issue that arose and bailed rather than even discuss working on them. When she broke it off she made a couple of accusations which were patently false and took very little responsibility for anything that happened and was not honest about who was talking about getting married as recently as yesterday.
ALL of your comments were about fixing me.
Do you do that to any of the women who come here with relationship issues?



mud

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