Learning Who I Am - A Short Intro

[BlueBelle]

Hello Everyone,

My DH of 20 years has NPD, is unable to work, been classified by the government as mentally disabled and has many insecurities that cause him to be verbally and emotionally abusive at times.  I have tried to leave him twice in the last few years and I always end up feeling sorry for him and take him back in.  
 
The separations have helped him to be more in touch with his abusive side and he tries to curb it when he can see what he is doing.  He admits he is "some what self centered"... but doesn't do much about it.  He isn't always hard to live with, alot of the time he can be quite pleasant.  

He has been worse in the past.  Cheating on me and being physically violent with other people... I know this could someday happen to me if I disagreed with him, so it has been just as effective in keeping me under his thumb.  I was physically abused by my mother and first husband.

It hasn't helped me, living without his problems is so nice even if it gets lonely at times... not that I don't get lonely while I'm with him.  I have learned that I am ok on my own and actually miss my freedom.  I feel like I am just his shadow every where we go together, and he hardly ever leaves me alone.  So I have his company all day long... even at work.  I have rented a large two story building and put him in a studio upstairs so he can be close but not under foot... I can breath at work.
 
The separations have put me in to mega debt and it saves me money to house and feed him here at home... I own my own business and he is legally entitled to support payments from me of $2000 a month.  If I had myself out of this debt and had the support payments I'd be very tempted to just leave him on his own. Despite that he's horriable at being on his own and causes all sorts of difficulties for himself.  
 
Right now I am trying to accept him and be compassionate.  I no longer have an romantic feeling for him. I am trying to establish boundries and it is slow going since he lives in an alternative reality at times and gets nasty when he is shown to be in the wrong.  It can take me days to get over one of his verbal an attacks.
 
I know that I might not be able to make things livable, however I want to try.  At least until I get myself out of debt and can make changes without losing my whole life.  

I have moral conflicts - I feel like it would be wrong to leave a sick person, but I might have to, to save my own sanity if I can't find it in myself to accept his issues.  
 
My background is a mother who also has NPD and didn't allow me a minute of freedom or an once of acceptance.  I really don't feel like I am  my own person.  I feel like no one likes me.  I am quite angry about my situation and I think that spills out no matter how I try to hide it.

Today I started reading a book that is about how to live with a N and how you have to get in touch with your issues and get stronger.  I realize that createing myself as a separate person, not being what other people want me to be would help my situation alot.  I just don't know how to go about it.  I feel alot of rejection from people when I don't act the way they want me to.  I don't feel like I have strong enough boundries and I am extreemly shy and defensive.

Thanks for reading this long post.  I don't know what I am looking for here, but thanks for letting me join.

[Anonymous]

BlueBelle,

Welcome to the board. I think there are plenty of us who can relate to your situation. Having just endured significant chaos and heartache in the upheaval of ending it with my ex-N, I am currently not an advocate of learning how to live with one. Bless you for trying.

Right now I am trying to accept him and be compassionate. I no longer have an romantic feeling for him. I am trying to establish boundries and it is slow going since he lives in an alternative reality at times and gets nasty when he is shown to be in the wrong. It can take me days to get over one of his verbal an attacks.

I question why you feel the need to hang in there. This sounds like an impossible situation and is costing you financially, emotionally and probably physically.

I know that I might not be able to make things livable, however I want to try. At least until I get myself out of debt and can make changes without losing my whole life.

Just curious - what is your motivation for trying? Do you feel sorry for him? Why do you feel responsible?

I applaud your efforts for learning more about NPD. However, as many of the posters have discovered they don't change. It is us who has to change. Keep posting and reading. The more you learn, the more you can make an informed decision about what is best for you; not him.

Best,

bludie

[BlueBelle]

Yes I do feel sorry for him.  It wasn't his choices as a little baby that lead him to what he is now.  Also, even though most N's don't change, he has become aware of his issues and is trying... not at the speed I would care for - nor one would think a normal person would deal with a problem, but at a N's speed.  It feels a little too little and a little too late to me.  But I could be surprised.

But my most pressing problem is the finances.  I have worked so hard for the last 16 years and now I find that if I don't live with him I will loose everything I worked for.  The house, the business and my retirement.  I can live the rest of my life without a love intrest, but I can't eat without my retirement.

Perhaps some people would let all of it go for the freedom, I did that before with my first husband and I just don't want to go without and end up living with my N mother again.  Nor do I want to have to live off my children.

If I can't see enough change in mysefl and in N, I will have to go, but I want it to be able to take enough money with me to start over far away and in good keeping.  I've tried sending him off twice being stuck with the mess to clean up.  I get nowhere.

I have to say that nothing has ever made me work so hard or helped me to grow as much as this relationship.  I don't feel like it has wasted my time. I am just so tired.  There's got to be a better way of dealing with hurtful situations than just being angry and mean back.  Even if we aren't ever going to see the other person change.

[Anonymous]

There's got to be a better way of dealing with hurtful situations than just being angry and mean back. Even if we aren't ever going to see the other person change.

I agree, however, taking care of yourself isn't being mean. Feeling your feelings and being true to yourself isn't necessarily a sign of anger.

but I want it to be able to take enough money with me to start over far away and in good keeping.

I can certainly relate to this. Being in my mid-40s and joining forces with my ex-N-fiance was a great risk. I took a hit emotionally and financially. In time, however, I was forced to choose sanity and health. Both had deteriorated significantly during the relationship. I'm wishing you the best on your journey, Bluebelle.

Best,

bludie

[Anonymous]

Bluebelle:

Just for a moment, pretend it is YOU have been told by the doctor YOU are ill and need constant attention.  Just how long to do YOU think this vampire would stick around? What  is going to happen when YOU need help?   YOU are expending your precious energy on nothing.  YOU as a business person should relate to this.  Your SO represents an investment and all YOU have is the bottom line to look at.........YOU know you would have made significant changes long ago to get things back on track.  YOU are afraid.........so emeshed in the N environment all your life........there are many more things frightening than being lonely............abused and dead. YOU must confront not him.......but yourself on why YOU think this is the kind of life YOU deserve?  If it feels like I am poking my finger in your chest........well I sorta am, because life is short.  As you get older the things you thought so important, were not important at all.  There are always resolutions to any problem..........the question is how best to resolve it in your best interests. I say your best interests because that is now how you have to think.  YOU are the only advocate for YOU.  Do YOU see anyone else intervening for YOU?

These are the same tough questions that I had to confront to get out my N relationships.  We as humans are all selfish and narcisstic to a degree, our survivial depends on it.  It only becomes pathological when YOU are expending every ounce of energy on adults, who are quite capable of taking care of themselves, and it is at your expense, your health, your mental well being.  I assure you if he were left to his devices without your help for long periods of time, he would find a way to have his needs met.  It might be through some other unfortunate individual or him getting in trouble with the law.  If it is the latter then you might not have to pay support to the incarcarated.  I am telling you these things as I would tell any other person that I cared about.  My mother never got this wake up call till she was very ill and realized my father was a horrible, calculating N.....by that time it was to late........she passed away as vapor.  The life totally sucked out of  her.  I do not want this as your fate.  Just the fact you are expending such energy tells me what a caring individual YOU are.  YOU DESERVE BETTER.  Patz

[mum]

Bluebelle: Bless you.  Everything you do/have done is for a reason.  What?  To find your purpose in this life. Get all the way down to that, then work your way toward it.  
I have to agree with the previous posts.  There is a way out.  Believe it and you will find a way.  Believe there is not, and you have determined that as well.
YOU need to be what you are concerned about now.  It's YOUR life.  Your post and, it appears, your life, is all about  HIM.  So who's in charge of your life?  
I think most of the people on these posts have been, to varying degrees, in situations familiar to yours.  Take heart in what you hear.
What do you want?
What do you believe about yourself (your core beliefs?) that drives your choices?  
When I stepped out of the anger and frustration of my "story" long enough to adress those things, I found I had some beliefs about myself that were just plain awful (that I had to give it all away, that other people's opinions mattered more than mine, to be "good" I had to suffer, etc.)  All of those things drove me to behave in certain ways, including attracting N's and attracting negative energy in different areas of my life, feeling trapped and seeing no exit out.  Yexpressed that you feel no one likes you, etc....this is the negative self image being manifested outwardly.  
You get what you believe.  If you start believing you can make it (financially, etc) on your own....you will.  You can make things happen for you, so start seeing how wonderful you are (really....not the N crap you have been force fed for so long).
I know so many people (mostly women) who have "lost" themselves to sick men.. and lately I have met many who have reclaimed themselves and look back at the powerless times as another person would.
YOU deserve your wonderful self back.  Taking care of this life you have is the ultimate in love.  Don't worry, you won't suddenly have NPD for loving yourself more than you are afraid fo him or what HE ends up doing.  Being afraid,  feeling guilt or being hurt are not manifestations of love, but the opposite.  Good people do not HAVE to suffer to be good.  Change your mind.  Change your life. You have the power and the choice.
If you choose not to, then that's ok too.  Just know you chose it.
Sending you universal love.

[bunny]

Hi Bluebelle,

It may be that right now you need to keep living with your H due to pragmatic circumstances. If that's the case, here are my ideas of making the best of a bad situation.

-- Be in therapy and have a support system of those who understand how difficult it is.

-- Develop a very thick skin so that his verbal attacks become less meaningful and more like hot air that you can ignore.

-- Create a separate life. Live as though you are housemates with your own lives. Don't let him intrude much into your life, don't let him control your life, get some firm boundaries.

Hope this is in some way useful...

bunny

[Samantha!]

I have similar problems. I have to deal with my Nparents, mainly with my Nfather. I live in his flat and I have to save money to get out here. Moreoever, I live in an awful country named Germany, where there are no public daytimekindergarden for kids and I am dependent on my father for bringing my son in a private daytimekindergarden in another town and I even can afford 2-3 times per week. If that country would not be that awful, I would have less problems. So I am dealing with an Ncountry and my Nparents.

1. I already found a job in another country and I found there a daytimekindergarden for my son. My bfriend already moved there. Allwe have to do is to get a bigger flat, save money, buy new furniture and then get our stuff from Germany and go.

I think you have to make a plan what to do. That is what I did. To continue to live with an N who is abusive is worse. It is tired making and is as other posters already said, ruining your health in the long time.

And as Patz said, I agree your Nhusband would not help you in the opposite. He would be not sorry for you. And even if he is menatally ill, no cause to act abusive. You had an abusive mother, you want to have some happy years in your life, hmm? Get that guy out.

The first thing you do and that you just got to do, make an appointment with a divorce attorney. Get info. Get info what to do to get rid of your husband. Collect samples of his abusives behaviour.

Why it is not possible to seperate? Because you would have pay him money? Support money? Find a way to hide all your assets. Put money on accounts in other countries. Maybe you can sell your business for some time or find a friend who is willing to take over the business for some time until the divorce. Find a way to keep your money. If he is that worse, find a way to put him in a mental hospital for some time.

If you do not try to get rid of him soon, it is likely that he will get only worse.

My 2 cents, Samantha

[serena]

BlueBelle

I hate to sound cynical or calculating but if I were you I would 'save, save, save'..........

I would set up a secret bank account and siphon off any funds you could.  I understand you don't have dependant children?  

I would also seek legal advice as to the position you would be in if you left your N husband?????????????

Please let us know how you get on.

[Kaz]

Have you had any legal advice concerning what would happen if you did divorce him? You really need to know exactly what your obligation to him would be.
Secret bank accounts, siphoning funds and hiding assets is what my exN did; it could back fire on you and is morally wrong.

[BlueBelle]

Thanks everyone for all of the replies.  I will truly think about all of them.

I am already court ordered to give him support and he is waving it while we are together.  He knows that my business is behind in rent and taxes and if he were to demand payments I would lose it all and he'd then have to go back to court and they would asses me alot less support.  It's all very sticky and there is no way out except for me to become disabled.

I do plan on saving money for my future in cash someplace I know he won't look while I am paying up the debt.  All of my contracts for rent and payments, students December '07.  

I have heard all of the horror stories about how some N's snoop, but he isn't that way.  He honestly thinks he's got an invincable lucky star.  He has had alot of other business things goe terriably wrong because of his head in the sand reality.  Before his laywer got hired I moved nost of the assests twice and he didn't have a clue.  They did however use my tax records to decide what I owe him, even though the breaking up process was so difficult on me emotionally my business went down by a third that year.  

Anyhow - I'm stuck for now.  I really want to work on becomming my own person.  This is a problem I can see I have had all along with everyone in my life.  I even do it at work... different for every client I see. If I knew myself and felt secure in myself I feel I wouldn't of ever gotten into this situation.

Thanks,BB