Voicelessness and Emotional Survival > Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board

sponsor out there? Don't want to get sucked in again

(1/4) > >>

annabelle:
Hi,

Just wondering if anyone has some advice about not getting sucked in to really thinking soon-to-be- ex- N husband can finally change - that he finally gets it.  Just been through an awful weekend with him and this morning he said I was totally right, that he knows he has to change, that he is trying hard, that he might backslide, yahdah yahdah, that he will do "anything it takes" bc "I'm so important to him."  We've been here before, but I still keep thinking now that I told him exactly what's bothering me - exactly what he does, that he finally gets it and will change.  Please help me from falling off the wagon and trusting he'll change.  Thanks!  (Or, might he finally?)  He's had individual therapy, we've been to couples counseling, and I refuse to go to couples counseling any more, bc I do know it's primarily his (narcissism) problem.  I think he will definitely NOT change if he doesn't see a counselor trained in treating narcissists, and Dr. Grossman suggested it would take a few years at least, if a narcissist were to change.

I'm planning on leaving him when I get a job (in a few weeks) but I'm trying to be strong (and fair) until then.

Thanks,

Annabelle

cindy:
I don't know if or when anyone else should leave a relationship.  I hung onto my Nhusband for 8 really bad years as he got progressively worse and worse, all the while alternately blaming me for everything and declaring he would change, stop, etc.  He just got better at lying about getting help and what he was really doing in his 80 plus hours away from home.

Mine, too, participated - kinda - in couples counseling, reluctanly, got the therapist to like him, and didn't do a thing, then would go to the next appointment and say "She's right, I didn't do what you said to do," all this passive aggressive diversion and charm.  Took me forever to get enough, as when I finally kicked him out I was a basket case, he controlled and had taken all the money, he was having an afair openly, and treating me like dirt. Finally, after 16 years total, I quit.

Finally I had had enough, and now, five years later and still with a stalker, I am so happy!  I can't believe I waited so long to do this.  I wish I had done it much sooner, and not wasted years being someone else's excuse for lack of responsibility and indulgence.

But like I said, I'm not saying you should leave.  I don't know.  I see others here are continuing relationships with their N, and it's best for them.

Acappella:
Hi Annabelle,
 
How are you doing?  

I too am living with Mr. N hubby and have been to therapy with him.  I am also looking for work as part of my preparation for asking him to leave (or I will).  

I have left Ns before though this is the first time I understood the cycle had a name.  

Everyone is a bit different and when I look back what it took for me to leave in the other cases was different that what I am needing now.  The Ns I dated were far worse than my husband and I have grown in many ways since dating the other Ns.  I just contacted a boyfriend I had at 16 (25 years ago).  We hadn't been in contact for 25 years.  After the first phone conversation I noticed he was weirder than I'd even remembered.  That same week I started reading about Nism.  I realized he is a full blown raging somatic type.  I am so glad I left him and so glad I am still moving on even though leaving is even harder now that I've progressed to a less intense level of Nism.

The article I posted (see STEALTH RADAR) is excellent for support in recognizing what is truth and what is fiction particularly when an "apology" is made.
 
Thanks to therapy my Mr. N has learned to apologise sometimes. We moved to a new city and he is no longer in therapy and I doubt he will return to therapy and if he does I still can't imagine living with him or wanting to be in a "relationship" with him again.  I believe he has apologised a couple of times sincerely, once or twice in the past three years.  Only when he was in therapy.    Even when he was authentic in his apology he was/is also sincere in his sense of being entitled.  He is too comfortable to change as far as I can see.  

What I am finding helpfull in detatching from my Mr. N:

Understanding why and how I got into this relationship in the first place. (Didn't need this to leave the others though it would have been good for me to understand and perhaps I'd had left sooner if I did understand.)

Having support.

Working hard to feel proud of some of the very things Mr. N has relied on my feeling bad about, having needs and feelings for example.

Letting myself be needy.

Knowing I gave support to Mr. N.  I did my part. I kept my integrity regarding being the supportive person, lover, friend, wife I wanted to be.

Remembering I learned from this relationship and he cannot take that from me.

Not demoninzing him as it only make me less of a human and him appear more powerful.  See "hating the Narcissist" post on other forum for more grusome details.

Spreading out my sources of support so I am never again so dependent on one person's "validation".  

I post also on the NPartner forum (as Acappella) -link is in the STEALTH RADAR post.  

Stay true to your heart, keep speaking up for what you need.  
Echo[/list]

annabelle:
Hi Cindy (and Echo, I'm going to reply to you in the next post reply),

Congratulations that you got out!  

It was so helpful to read about your experience with couples counseling.  My N husband said he wanted to go now (that I told him I want a divorce) and he said that even though he went before, he didn't really try and just went to humor me.  It was also so helpful to read that the N only got worse, and that since you left, you feel you should have left sooner.  This is very empowering for me!  

I know I do NOT want to stay with him and I wonder why people do.  Well, I can't talk, because I have for 8 years.  I guess fear of being alone?  Financial survival?  Kids?  I have kids and all these fears, but I know I'll be o.k. and like you, I can't wait to be "so happy!"  I'm so happy for you!  I've just got to make the big move (literally) - get a job and move.

****If anyone reading this is staying with an N spouse, could you share why?  Maybe it's something I haven't considered.  Like I said, although I know I do NOT WANT to stay with this man, I'm just trying to make sure I shouldn't.   Thanks!  and thanks again Cindy.

annabelle

annabelle:
Hi Echo,

Thanks so much for your support and suggestions.  How are you?  It sounds like you've figured out some great strategies for dealing.

How's your job search going?  Do you know that you're definitely leaving?  I wish I had left after 3 years - after 1 year I was set to go, but got sucked back in.  First 2 years of our marriage sucked.  The next 3 years were good, but we had the distraction and gift of having 2 kids.  And, the past 3 years have sucked.  With my N getting worse and worse - more aggressive, less apologetic, more irrational, demanding, self centered - he runs his own business and has been saying "Just give me 4 years and all your dreams will come true - you'll never have to work again." (I need to work bc I like it very much - hello?  He doesn't get this.)   And, "If you stick with me for the ride...." blah blah blah, and, "It has to be about me for the next 4 years."  I almost bought into this self-centeredness but I know he chose his being an entrepreneur because of his Nism - rather than the other way around where he doesn't have to concentrate on himself bc of his job choice.   Meanwhile, I've worked full time while getting an advanced degree part time, while being pregnant with, nursing, and taking care of 2 kids.  It was and is, STILL all about him.  

And............. ***warning, about to vent, vent, vent.........***, he's got hang-ups on order, organization, a bad temper in which he's broken chairs, etc. etc. in front of the kids, and he doesn't stop yelling or terrorizing the place in front of them.  He's got obsessive compulsive traits - I have to:  pick up the soap instead of just touching it with my fingers to wash my hands, and spin it around ("so you don't just leave germs on the soap), I have to keep the kitchen sponges filled with dish detergent ("so the sponges don't smell") - (I mean, WHO smells sponges anyway?!)  I have to shake my hands after I wash them so I don't drip around the sink ("could get under the chrome of the sink and ruin it").  I have to shut my dresser drawers all the way without anything hanging out of them, I have to shut the closet doors all the way ("otherwise the hinges will become weak and the door will warp"), I can't use chopsticks for Chinese food or a spoon to help me eat my pasta (and I'm part Italian!) - because these things are too pretentious and bc he can't handle the sound of the spoon on the fork, I have to cut a bananna a certain way, I have to fold the (wet) towels up after using them rather than spreading them out ("folding them creates an air pocket" and even though less surface area isexposed, "they get drier better"), I have to keep my OWN clothes IN MY Dresser neatly folded, bc "what example does this set for our kids - we have to teach them the same thing."  He used to mock me for chewing too loudly - his N mother does this trick EVERY time we sit down to dinner to humiliate either her sons or her husband - I mean for God's sake, chips and raw carrots are meant to crunch - I swear the woman's like a conehead or a non-human the way she eats potato chips - NO crunches, and one at a time, chewing in the back of her mouth so as not to make any noise - which causes its own noise which is gross, and which my N does as well.........I digress more and more, but I haven't told my story and this is a way to purge.  So, if I don't listen to him - i.e. "Could you please wash the dishes in the sink before you finish putting the sauce on the chicken and putting it in the oven, because I don't have any room to wash my hands" - this when it will take me 2 seconds to stick the chicken in the oven and 10 to wash the dishes, and I want the chicken to be ready for supper ( and why can't he wash the damn dishes?) ............. so, I keep saying no to this "request" and he pushes me out of the way, throws the barbecue sauce across the kitchen, bangs the fridge so hard he breaks the bar on the door, yells, says, "I'm going to use the kitchen, you get out!"  in front of our crying kids......

oh yes, and when I'm driving in the car, I have to put my sunglasses back in the overhead compartment if I take them off rather than leave them in my lap bc I'll just be putting them back on in a few minutes when it's sunny again - (of course this is for my own good, so my sunglasses don't get scratched or broken).  Ironically, he ends up throwing my sunglasses across the car and breaking them when I don't comply)  He's thrown my stuff off my dresser bc my dresser top has been too messy, poured orange juice on the counters bc they weren't clean enough, and besides all this humiliation, violence, demands, he is not "there" when we're together.  Stares into space not saying anything during dinner, always has the t.v. on, etc. etc.  Acts like I'm bothering him.  Oh yes, and another thing, when I was nursing my 2nd baby when she was still a few weeks old, he demanded I get up from my lunch to put away the cold cuts ("right after you use them put them back in the fridge so they don't hang around"), and when I said I'd do it in a second, I was so hungry from nursing, and so tired frrom sleep deprivation, etc. he threw a fit.  I could go (and have gone) on and on.  I do feel hate for him, but also feel so sorry for him - that's probably the worst part of planning to leave.


Feeling sorry that you're going to "hurt" your husband.  I think he can feel hurt, bc obviously he's so miserable with himself and life, and misery is an emotion.  But, if I stay with him, I will be hurting (and so will my children) everyday for the rest of my life.  I feel so strong now that I've decided to leave, but I haven't actually left yet, so I'm not congratulating myself yet - I'm scared of the emotional outfall and confrontation and of hurting him (and I do have some self esteem, just feel so sorry for him)

You've only been in the marriage 3 years although I'm sure it feels like 50 for you - congratulations on planning to get out so early!  Good luck with your job search, stay strong, it seems like you do have more awareness and insight with regard to relationships with significant others, from your experience.  So help yourself now - you've sure helped so many others on this board, including me!  Thanks Echo!  Take care of yourself

Annabelle

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page