I've done it now...

[Anonymous]

There is a big difference between ACTIONS and REACTIONS.  What you did was a reaction to his actions.  Nothing to be ashamed about in that.

[vunil as guest]

I was reading parts from a book today on BPD it was called "Stop walking on eggshells." It said that there were new studies showing promising results with the use of antidepressants and mood stabalizers for ppl w/BPD. I am thinking that the PD that agrees to this must be actively seeking help.

I'm reading that book, too, in order to understand family members and friends.  Which, it is helping with tremendously, but the big surprise    is that I found myself in my 20's in there, too.  Not big and full-fledged (I didn't yell at coworkers!) but definitely there, especially in romantic relationships.  I was really happy to yell at them, in public, wherever.

And now I do not have it at all, in any area of life.  People who know me now would be really surprised to know that I used to have it.  So it isn't like NPD, I don't think.  It is caused by insecurities and (for some people) traumatic stress, which can be fixed with growing up, life success, therapy therapy therapy, and (for some folks) meds.  

Which doesn't mean people will fix themselves. in my experience, if people have it into their late 30's and 40's and beyond, they are less likely to ever get over it.  I have a coworker who is EXACTLY like the one you describe, but add pathological lying to the mix.  I don't have the nerve to growl at her (I love that you did that!), but I do give her the icy Vunil stare of death.  It basically means "don't give me any bs, bitch, I am onto you."  And she runs away from me now...  Fewer lies to have to listen to.

Sorry if this was off topic....

[Stormchild Guesting]

Right on topic, Vunil.

Yep. The one I was dealing with was at least mid-forties and clearly got far too many 'secondary gains' from acting like a Froot Loop, so there was little or no likelihood of a cure.

You was different. Something in you didn't really find what you were trying, behaviorally, to be satisfying enough to stay with. Hoo-rah, yee-HAH, and other encouraging noises!

[N_Jaded]

Perhaps I should have posted this on Vunil's thread.  But I am also curious to know what are the major differences between the NPD and BPD.  Many of the traits listed in walking on eggshells  of  BPD my NSpouse exhibits.  Could anyone shed some light on this for me? Thank-you.

[Jaded911]

Im not so sure that the behaviors are so much different between someone who is NPD and BPD.  The causes are very much different but as far as their actions, I believe they are very much alike.

I think with people who are BP their behaviors and actions are triggered by chemical malfunctions.  People with NPD, their behaviors and actions are triggered by a lack of or absence of coping mechanisms.

They have medication that can help those with BPD.  To bad they havent come up with a magical cure for NPD.

[bunny]

Many of the traits listed in walking on eggshells  of  BPD my NSpouse exhibits.  Could anyone shed some light on this for me? Thank-you.

They are extremely similar. Here are some general guidelines I use:

Someone with dominant N traits is more likely to be confident, independent, their own neediness is hidden or rejected, overtly aggressive, overtly selfish, particular about who they like/dislike, more aware of what they want and don't want, looking for supplies that feed their grandiosity. Far more fearful of being deflated and narcissistically injured.

Someone with dominant B traits is more likely to be dependent, less emotionally stable, unable to be alone, will go from person to person looking for supplies, not very picky about who they choose, more overtly child-like, more overtly anxious, tends to be unreliable, to idealize someone, get disappointed and devalue them. Far more fearful of abandonment.

HOW I DEAL WITH THEM DIFFERENTLY: With a dominantly narcissistic person, I avoid deflating them. I give them a lot of understanding and ignore a lot of their blustering. With this method many Ns are actually fairly nice to me.

With a dominantly borderline person (much more difficult), I actually try to stay away from them altogether. If that isn't possible, I am very firm, confident, do not show any confusion or wavering, and let them believe I am a "scary" person. I find that setting limits is the most important thing, otherwise they walk all over me and I hate myself for letting it happen.

bunny

[vunil as guest]

They have medication that can help those with BPD

It's possible (and maybe I'll go look this up) that the same meds that help bpd (anti-anxiety and/or anti-depression medicine) might help N's, if they were ever willing to go get it.  I'm not sure.

Narcissism is caused by reactions to deep shame.  The problem is, the reaction works really well, and the shame isn't felt, so it isn't clear the medicine would be able to correct anything.  Maybe a narcissist trying to change would really benefit, because the medicine would help with that super-scary time of admitting they aren't god.

In my experience BPD's "wear" their craziness much more than N's do. They sort of know that they are off, but can't fix it. N's have no clue they are anything less than fabulous.  Even if their subconscious does not have confidence, they have no clue what's bubbling underneath.  I think that's why so few ever get better.

[Jaded911]

The medication used for BPD is used to help balance hormonal and chemical imbalances.  I am not saying that N cant have imbalances, quite the contrary.  There is a defensive mechanism within us all called the "Fight or Flight."  I am positive when my ex got all wound up, he definately showed signs and symptoms of the Fight or Flight state.  

The only medications that I could remotely think of that might benefit N would be those medications that take the edge off.  I can only speak for myself and my situation with my N.  But I honestly feel that if he had some type of medication that would have taken the edge off, he would have not escalated into his fits of violence.  

Bi-polar ppl have a physical imbalance.  Narcis have an emotional imbalance.  Nothing but good ole therapy is gonna heal emotional malfunctions.

[d's mom]

Bi-polar ppl have a physical imbalance.  Narcis have an emotional imbalance.

oop, not to be technical but 'BPD' can stand for either 'bipolar disorder', which is a mood disorder, and also 'borderline personality disorder', which is a personality disorder....

just peeking in to say that

i understand borderline is considered difficult to treat..... while bipolar is very treatable..

personality involves the way one chooses to react to the world, so you have to really be willing to change a lot of deep stuff to get over a personality disorder i think..... bipolar as you said can often be cured with just meds
anna

[Storm]

well caught, anna, i was just thinking the same thing earlier today and totally forgot to say anything.

[Anonymous]

Its funny because I thought my N had bi-polar disorder.  He had many ups and down moods......

Thank you for setting that one straight for me...wink

[dogbit]

Someone with dominant N traits is more likely to be confident, independent, their own neediness is hidden or rejected, overtly aggressive, overtly selfish, particular about who they like/dislike, more aware of what they want and don't want, looking for supplies that feed their grandiosity. Far more fearful of being deflated and narcissistically injured.

Someone with dominant B traits is more likely to be dependent, less emotionally stable, unable to be alone, will go from person to person looking for supplies, not very picky about who they choose, more overtly child-like, more overtly anxious, tends to be unreliable, to idealize someone, get disappointed and devalue them. Far more fearful of abandonment.
Thanks Bunny.  I think this is the best description of the two disorders I have read or at least be able to understand!

[Bliz]

The ex sounds like a combo.  Is that possible?

[longtire]

The ex sounds like a combo.  Is that possible?

Absolutely!  People do not fit neatly into little psychological boxes.  I believe my wife straddles the line here too.  Not that little psychological boxes are not helpful, reality is just inherently "messy."