Where does N come from?

[mum]

I just got off the phone with one of my sisters.  We have a large family and for the most part are pretty close, emotionally.  
There is one brother, however, who shows some pretty intense narcissistic behavoir.
We have all noticed this.  It is never surprising to us (but sad) that some of us who live 2000 miles away have seen our dying mother more than he, who lives a mere 3 hour drive from her.
He will say he is going to visit her (usually on his way to or from something else he has to do) and then "can't get to it".
It is his loss, really.  Even in her current state, my mother seems to accept this about him.

So I am now curious: where does a narcissist come from?  Is it learned?
Did his experience, birth order, early childhood (I wouldn't know about that as he is 12 years older than me) cause this?  I think my mom would have been a bit N had she not had dad for a husband, actually.  So I wonder, where does it come from?

[mum]

I should probably add that this N type behavoir is not limited to his relationship with his mother, as then we could say it's between them.
He was a horrible husband to his first wife, and frankly, I'm not sure how his second one can stand him, except that he is good looking! (how rude, I'm sure there is more than that).
I remember so many times where he has taken family sharing times to be self serving and distant...it would fill a book, really, and what is sad is that every one of his 8 siblings have similar, regularly occuring experience with him (when we even see him).

So, any ideas?

And I guess I ask, because my children have an extremely N dad and when they exhibit normal selfish teenage behavoir....I just wonder.....

[mudpuppy]

I've got just about exactly the same question mum.
I hope someone has a good answer.

mud

[GOLLY GEE]

perhaps an overvaluing as karen horney
of some of the defense techniques that
children have to resort to from an onslaught
upon their spiritual being...
and why different children get different onslaughts
that are not always immediately obvious to all...
is an interesting part
plus the past lives of most kids...
occasionally there is a newby
like me
an angel who desires to be more effective
and thus choses to be born gasp
as a human oh my
what was i thinking

divine energy
now mind u gives a newborn
a shellacking of innocence
which if the parents and society
properly nourish strengthens the child
when its  previous karma becomes active
as it matures..
say at the bar mitvah

but when parents do not respect the divine
innocence given to all new borns
well then it can be more difficult to deal with
the old karma when it comes more into the open..
but even then the onslaughts can be turned into lessons

briefly narcissism has to do with unhealthy self-image
and can be mixed with unhealthy assertion...
and some other mixtures
that is somewhat treated i think
in npa theory by anthony benis
tho he gets kind of goofy at points
if i have time i might try to help straighten him out..
u know slay him in the spirit or something:)

[Anonymous]

Deleted by Richard Grossman:  contentless taunt

[Anonymous]

I read one scientific study that espoused some support for the theory that there are certain innate personalities that have a predisposition to N behaviors.  That's NOT to say that N is innate any more than people are born alcoholic; only that certain personalities adopt N behaviors (or fight them) more than other P types.  The author was a psychologist.

[wildrain]

I beleive that N's run in families and it is like any genitic condtion
I say this because i have a N mother,grandmother,brother and older daughter that all are the same (All show typical N behavior) The all have patterns and they all behaive in almost the same way. I am in a N relationship that i am trying to get out of. I have been around N's all my life. Toxic and draining.
wildrain....

[bunny as guest]

Reasons I think some siblings are N, some are not:

-- Sibs are unique individuals with different personalities.

-- Early interactions with parents influences siblings' developing brains and neural systems. Siblings' early interactions with parents are unique to each child, so they have different emotional reactions to things.

-- Parents have unconsciously projected specific emotional content, feelings, etc., onto different children. Some children carry the bad projections (scapegoats); some are drafted to "take care of" the mother. Some siblings get their parents' own parents projected onto them. Children who can't withstand the projections tend to become enraged (unconsciously) because they were exploited. Sometimes they get N-ish as a defense against all the intrusions.

bunny

[write]

my nh's mother was very sick throughout his childhood and ultimately died when he was 15. She adopted a way of idealising her children whilst keeping them at an emotional distance. She never hugged or kissed her kids, and set them goals instead, particularly trying to tell them how they should behave if she died.
I'm guessing she thought she was sparing everyone more pain when she died. But my h grew up with a sense of superiority to everyone but no knowledge of how to get or keep people close except by showing off or being grandiose. Physical affection made him uncomfortable and any ayyempts to talk about feelings he would crush.

Then he became a top guy in his field, and received loads of praise all the time, and that just became the way he lived, wanting constant attention and special treatment.

For a long time people around him gave it too, espeially me, I thought he was amazing and smoothed over all the social relationships he trampled with his insensitivity and arrogance, ignoring my own unmet needs in the marriage for years.

He never changed until our son started showing the same traits, and he went into therapy.

Even now I'm always attracted to people with extraordinary talents or intelligence- and a lot of them turn out to be narcissistic.

I don't think this explains how n's form in every case, but it was the pattern in ours.