Author Topic: Help/Advice/Opinion?  (Read 2670 times)

gratitude28

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Help/Advice/Opinion?
« on: April 19, 2006, 11:05:54 PM »
Hi All,
This is my current situation... although I will give you a bit of background (I'll try to keep it short) and I am asking for input on how to deal with htis.
When I was growing up, my parents made me always feel that I was rejecting them. I think, too, that I did to some degree. But looking back I also think a lot of what I was made to feel guilty about was the normal separation of a child from his/her parent. When we grew up, we always lived away from extended family, and my parents rejoiced in this. They detested my Dad's parents and griped about them at all times. (My NMother's family was spoken of only in reverent tones by her and I know from my dad and others, that her view of them is a fantasy view). At any rate, following their lead, once I graduated from College (Iwent to College near our house, but lived on campus), I moved away, got a job in Texas, got married to a military member and have been far away ever since. I also lived in Russia for six months during college. I would stand in line for hours to call them as there were only 5 overseas phones in the whole city. When I would get a hold of them, I would get bitched at by my mother about things like whether I was going to finish my gym credits to graduate. I had no food, was all alone and that is what I got from her.
So... any time I go back to my parents' house, she always has a fit about something or another. One time, when my husband was with me for the first time, she had reverted to smoking after the doctor told her she would get cancer if she continued. I was upset with her. I didn't say anyhting, but made faces when she lit up. She started crying and screaming that I had always hated her. Other occasions, I always get attacked as I enter the door after my across-the-country-or-world trips to get there as to whether I plan to see them at all while I am there or if I just plan to go out all the time. (Inever did go out... wasn't allowed to ... and I have a whopping 2 friends still there). This happens every time. The first time, I told her, "Well, if this is how this visit is going to go, I am calling the airline now, changing my ticket and leaving."
So now I am going back this summer. She has already said, "You can do what you want while you are here. We aren't going to bother you." And, she and my sister are 'deciding where I will stay.' I would like to just go and hang out and relax and have the kids see their family. But they have turned it into this unconfortable thing as usual. My sister assumes I don't want to be with my parents (again, we are talking about how I felt about them in HIGH SCHOOL).
I don't know. It is only for a week, and if I recite the serenity prayer 3,467 times a day, I will be fine. SHould I just stay out of it and let them direct us where they want us to be??????????????
I just can't wait to fly for an entire day to go through all this shit again :)
Take care all and any input would be great!!!
Sorry for the length.
Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

gratitude28

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2006, 11:45:10 PM »
bean, you are right, but I do love my dad. And he adores my children and has hardly ever gotten to see them, much because of this situation.
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

Portia

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2006, 05:51:36 AM »
SHould I just stay out of it and let them direct us where they want us to be??????????????

Hi Beth. Quick answer: Nope. :D

You’re an adult and have the right to direct your own life, and those of people you’re responsible for.

You can decide to make the best of this trip, by concentrating on the good aspects: seeing your Dad, your Dad enjoying seeing your kids. You can decide that your mother is unfortunately a sad, irritating, angry woman who you have to tolerate. A bit like tolerating and dealing with the fish bones if you really like to eat trout – they won’t disappear or melt away so you have to manage them….

What your mother and sister say to you or about you is not the truth about you. If you believe that…….they can’t affect you so much. If either of them say things that make you angry and are outdated ‘images’ of you, you have the choice of how you respond…..laughing it off, factually correcting them, shrugging and saying “okay that’s what you think but I don’t think that”…

You can plan now what you want to do during the week. You can ask your mother and/or sister what they want to plan, and you can negotiate with them, say what you want. Saying what we want is not first nature to us…..and doing the asking can be scary…but hey! It’s allowed. I find it suits me best by email: then I can state my position clearly and give them time to respond as adults, instead of shouting me down to my face, like children. (I can also get angry with them without showing it to them.)

ANewSheriff

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2006, 08:08:15 AM »
Beth:
Quote
And, she and my sister are 'deciding where I will stay.'

This does not seem okay.  You should have some input on where you will be staying.  Perhaps you might suggest to your mother places you would find appropriate, ask your mother where it was she was considering, and see if there is a middle ground you can meet on with this.  If not, tell her frankly what your preferences are and where you will be making arrangements. 

Another thought that comes to mind is renting a vehicle so that you are not trapped or reliant on anyone for your transportation. 

It sounds like you are going to have to figure out where your boundaries are and how you are going to respond to infringements on those boundaries well ahead of your trip.  Perhaps laying some of the groundwork by phone or e-mail  before you leave will help you in making this leap.

ANewSheriff 
Change the way you see the world and you will change the world.

MarisaML

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2006, 03:26:17 PM »
God bless your heart!  And I mean it.  I feel sorry for you that your own Mom is an N.  My mother-in-law is one too.  And I used to get so mad at husband at the way his family treated me.  And he used to let them.  But now I'm feeling more sorry for him than ever.  How horrible it would be to have a Mom like that.  My Mom is now passed away but she was a good Mother.  Not perfect, but who is.  But I knew she loved me.  My husband is now starting to come to terms with his family members being 'different'.  And I believe he's hurting.

But back to you.  Don't let her abuse you.  Don't take it.  It's okay to let a few mean comments go.  But don't let them run over you or your family.  It's not worth it. 

Hopalong

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2006, 04:34:42 PM »
Gratitude,

If it's doable,
HOTEL HOTEL HOTEL
(And if you can, kidnap your Dad for a play session in a park.)

I'm so sorry it's the way it is with her.

Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

gratitude28

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2006, 08:18:10 PM »
Wow, thank you all so much! I don't think my guilty conscience could do the hotel thing. But I think I am going to insist that we stay in one place (my Dad's house). We can visit others from there. Just having my kids with me means that there will be beautiful spots in every day.

My mother has hardly contacted me at all... I think she is not looking forward to having to 'deal with me' again. She has to put on a good face for Dad. I think I will call this weekend and pray that my Dad is home so I can find out what is really going on.

Another nice thing about the trip back to America is that we are staying with my in-laws in Texas. My mother-in-law is the mom I never had. She loves me no matter what I look like or what I am going through. I never knew things could be like that before her. I thought that she was the exception to the rule as far as parents go:) Now I know that people DO have parents that loved them just for being on Earth! I planned the other trip to be inbetween my time in Texas, so that I have loving family time on either end of it!

I liked the fish bone analogy!!!!

Thanks you all again so much!

Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

Portia

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2006, 07:26:36 AM »
Hi Beth

I think she is not looking forward to having to 'deal with me'

Negative useless tape playing in your head, or accurate idea of reality? I don’t know! Does she really think this?

Do you think that you have to be dealt with (i.e. are you really a ‘bad’ person, someone who has to be ‘put up’ with, tolerated?) (No. :D)

What if you decide to think “I bet she’ll be really nice to me” and if she isn’t…act surprised, ask her what’s wrong, shrug it off, enforce your boundaries “I am upset, if you say that again, I shall leave for the day”. Nobody will die. You have a right to basic human respect.

Boy am I glad you have your lovely MIL. Yeah, it’s a shock to discover that ‘normal’ people and normal families do really exist, but well…..they do. And that’s great.  8)

gratitude28

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2006, 08:51:41 PM »
Portia,
You are right.
 I never know if what I assume/think is a negative emotion I put into my head now or something that comes from her. I talked to my parents this weekend (thank goodness my Dad was home... it's so nice to talk to someone sane). I told them I wanted to just stay with them and not be moving around from place to place. Of course my dad, being the kind person, said "Gee, and did you think I was going to be unhappy that you want to stay with us?" He is so excited to see the kids. Of course we didn't get to talk much as my mother kept overriding. I was saying to them that I was tired from working, running worund to soccer, doing errands, etc. My mom was like, "Maybe you need to think about quitting your job." Of course she would never say that to my sister if she said she were busy and tired (she's a doctor), but my job just isn't important, apparently. She makes so many insinuations that I can't get my head straight over what is real and what I think she is inferring. The one that pissed me off most lately was this... I was talking about the fact that my boss is nice here at my job (I usually have dificult bosses, so it's a nice change... plus he knows I work really hard.) She comes out with, "Is he married?" Why the hell would you ask that? As usual there has to be something underhanded going on... I can't just be a nice person working for a nice person. So I do get to running the negative tape in my head... both my own and for her. I try to delete these thoughts, but sometimes it is hard. How do you all get rid of the bad thoughts?
Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

Portia

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2006, 06:54:14 AM »
Hi Beth what a nice response from your dad! Did something in your voice or the way you said it convey the idea that you thought it would be a problem? Maybe and he picked it up and reassured you? I think that’s great. On the other hand, maybe that’s the way he deals with your mom, day in day out. He presumes everything will be a problem for her and is used to placating that? Just been reading your back posts…and I’d say your mother is intensely jealous of you and pretty disturbed.

"Maybe you need to think about quitting your job."
I think she gets vicarious kudos from your sister’s job. She can brag about it to others (“of course she’s a doctor…”). She hides her envy of your sister because she gets admiration-by-proxy through her. It’s a pay-off. Sick. She’s probably scared of your sister in some way too. Maybe she’s scared your sister will tell her straight that she’s an envious interfering old biddy with nothing to show for her life (in terms of job achievement)? So she sucks up to her.

She makes so many insinuations that I can't get my head straight over what is real and what I think she is inferring.

What is real is your life. What she says is all garbage. Sorry Beth.

The one that pissed me off most lately was this... I was talking about the fact that my boss is nice here at my job (I usually have dificult bosses, so it's a nice change... plus he knows I work really hard.) She comes out with, "Is he married?"

Yeah this would have had my anger right up there. Because if nothing else – it has nothing to do with what you’re talking about. It’s like running over your conversation, your story, your voice, with a steamroller. It’s like “oh you’re having such a good time are you? well I’m going to get the attention back here missy and say something that will bring the conversation right back to me”….kinda thing.

“Is he married?” bleurgh. Pass the sick bucket. In reading your posts I see loads of sexual projection acting-out on her part – accusing you of sexual behaviour when it’s a projection of herself. Nasty stuff. I suffered the same type of thing. It’s so confusing and so crazy-making. I’m sorry Beth. You’re mother’s a nutcase. I think “is he married?” relates directly to her own dreams and wishes and disappointments. She wants him for herself. If your Dad heard this, he probably thought it was an attack on him. She was (1) being jealous of you having a job (2) jealous of you having a nice boss (3) jealous of your nice boss actually being nice to you and probably goes into some manic overwhelm of “It’s not fair! I want all that for me!” and says……”is he married?”.

As usual there has to be something underhanded going on... I can't just be a nice person working for a nice person. So I do get to running the negative tape in my head... both my own and for her. I try to delete these thoughts, but sometimes it is hard. How do you all get rid of the bad thoughts?
 
Realise that none of this stuff is about you. It’s all about her. It sounds like an attack on you and it looks like it….and it feels like it to you….but really, she can’t touch you.

Who’s saying you can’t just be a nice person? I know the feeling…still thinking that my mother’s view of me matters at all, or has some bearing on the reality of who I am. It doesn’t. She knows next to nothing about me and I guess the same applies to you and yours. You know that you’re a nice person or maybe you just need reminding of it a lot…

Beth is great!  :D You’re a caring, thoughtful, compassionate person who’s survived a dysfunctional family. You are not part of them: you’ve become your own separate person. Thank goodness. :D

One trick is to keep your own thoughts to yourself and know that you disagree. Remember, everything she says or does is directly about her, it’s not you. Even if it’s at your expense, say, trying to make you look foolish in front of others….it’s because at that moment she is feeling very very foolish and needs to pump herself up. She’s a sad person. Maybe if you can look through the attacks you’ll get a glimpse of just how sad (pitiful) she is and why she’s jealous of you?

That’s another trick - to concentrate on the other person and their motivations for doing what they do. When you can do that, they stop scaring or upsetting you so much. It works for me but it’s not easy when someone is trying to punch you because they hurt. Any help? Make any sense? 

Hopalong

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2006, 09:28:55 AM »
Wow, Portia.
This is a perfect primer on how to deal with that kind of NMom.

Beth, we swapped Moms. Or maybe they're related.

I second Portia except I couldn't have summed it up so well.
It's NOT you and the "bad thoughts" aren't you either.

The needling insensitivity and hoggishness would put rage in the mind of Mommy Theresa.
Don't bash yourself further for having "hateful" thoughts about her. Just get to work on the "assignment" of practicing curiosity, detachment, analysing her motives from a nice clear mental distance. You'll get so you can do it right in front of her. Nobody can read your mind and what goes on in there belongs to you. You're entitled to own your own thoughts: angry, indifferent, curious. All of them.

Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

gratitude28

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2006, 08:50:44 PM »
You guys are so wonderful. You really made my day. Portia, you are wonderfully insightful. How did you become so wise? You are right, and much of this I know in my head now. I think I am just trying to deal with the fact that she is not the mother I made up in my mind for all these years. You know, maybe it's a good thing that I have an alternate idea of her. Maybe that's what kept me from being like her. And, Portia, thank you again for pointing out the statement my dad made. You are so right. I had never thought of the fact that he picked up on that.
Thank you thank you thank you!!!!!!!!!
Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

Portia

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Re: Help/Advice/Opinion?
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2006, 05:48:35 AM »
Beth, thank you, please give yourself lots of praise and credit for your own wisdom.

You told the board and I told you back, that’s all eh? You did the hard work.

It amazes me how writing things down clarifies our own thoughts, gets them out of our heads so we can look at them in an observer role, sort of.

Managing our own reactions and thinking about what’s motivating our mothers is a darn hard job! Would love to hear how you get on, if you want to tell us. Take care! :D

edit in
Hops when it comes to summing up I think this

Nobody can read your mind and what goes on in there belongs to you.

is a prize winner. :D Reading you it flashed up to me “so this is what they call a boundary is it?” Not allowing the old ‘triggers’ to set off the same mental chain-reaction – that’s a boundary? (I have trouble sometimes understanding the terminology.)
« Last Edit: April 25, 2006, 10:25:31 AM by Portia »