Author Topic: Family  (Read 1813 times)

Me

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 10
Family
« on: May 24, 2006, 01:37:54 PM »
My mother asked me not so long ago why her daughters had such troubles in mid-life.  My word!  It was a question I chose not to answer though. How could I have explained Childhood Voicelessness to a woman who is almost 80 and still manages her own life by what others' think. I know though that she is very concerned about my youngest sister. I understand it, but I just don't choose to delve into explanations with her.  She attacks when she gets uncomfortable and I simply am not going to participate in that.

By way of a divorce from hell I ended a 32 year marriage to a manic depressive who has N behaviors. Freedom is a blessing!  
My first sister is a very controlling person who really wanted to be daddy's son.
My youngest sister tends to be obsessive about her religion.  Jealousy is a problem with her, as well as rage. Right now, she is personifying her rage and probably needs help.

Mother did not ask me about brother who literally has no respect for women whatsoever. If this can be inherited, then it was from my father who did not think women had sense enough to fill a five gallon bucket.

Even after all these years, I find family a tough go.   I have consciously decided that it is best to love from a detached point of view as to behavior expectations from family and love from a distance. This works for me and I live my own life, my way. However, because of a business partnership though, I cannot be too distant for I feel it necessary to protect my interests, but I can insist on our dealings be business-like and not family-like.  

Why am I even posting all this personal stuff? Well it is out of frustration I suppose at the latest event.  Brother, who has a history of lying to get himself out of trouble, has manipulated mother into making him the boss of this family partnership.  Time to insist on everything being in writing again.  Disgusting, but necessary.

When family and business are mixed together, sometimes the best form of distance is found in the boundary of being empowered, self-secure, and knowing you can protect yourself if necessary.  

Mother really wants to understand.  



I am a Divine Design, a miraculous creation of Love, Light,and Peace.

Sela

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1273
Re: Family
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2006, 02:14:21 PM »
Hello Me:

I read some of your other posts and I just want to say........

((((((((((((((((((((((((Me))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Sounds like you've been through some horrible stuff.  :shock: :x :( :( :(

Welcome to the board.

I hear you saying you feel frustrated and disgusted.  That's understandable.

Is it really necessary to stay in business with these people? :shock:

Sela

Me

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 10
Re: Family
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2006, 03:10:47 PM »
Thanks for the support, Sela.  I really needed to talk this out.

Yes, it is necessary at this time to be in business with these people., but it does not involve daily, weekly, or monthly activities. Just have to make sure interest is protected. This can be done from a distance via mail, etc.  I may contact my business lawyer to help in this if the financial reports are not shared.  But it does need to be done as the lying makes me not trust some of them.

Yes, there is disgust on my part and loads of frustration. Odd how you think you are done with the trauma and it pops back from the depts of yourself.

You know, I was raped by the x. Started the divorce shortly thereafter. Had a stalking order. Was dealing with PTSD and fear of him.  Needed brother's testimony and he refused, did not believe the danger I was in, said x was "like a brother to him." Gee, was I not like a sister? x, as are most Ns was a better liar than most people are truth tellers.  He is great at the con so I am not suprised others believed him. x was after money and would have done anything to get it in order to support the woman he eventually married.  (he did not get it)  x threatened me with a gun once and verbally in front of witnesses another time.  Also threatened to kill lawyer if house was taken from him.  Lawyer said he did not believe him, but I think he did.  Anyhow, I knew he would have killed me if he did not get the house. My life is worth more than a big old house.

x kept bags of my underwear. He calls new wife the pet names he called me. She literally has the same name I had when I was married to him, same first name and same middle initial. He wanted a diamond for every 10 years of marriage on a ring adn wants to be married 50 years. His new wedding ring has three diamonds for his first 30 years with me.  Just wanted a wife and did not matter who she was I guess. None of this my family believed at the time.

Brother called my physician counselor during the divorce trying to find out what was going on with me.  Physician refused to talk to him and was appalled.  Now, x was trying to get my med records at the time also, which my state law protected from happening, thank heavens.  I wonder now if brother was going to give them to x.  I asked him once if he had called physican, and he said no. Then I told him the physican's receptionist had recorded his voice adn number and he said, "I was just trying to make sure you were beign treated correctly."

Daddy died six months after the divorce started.  Over protests, pleading, etc from me, sister and brother invited x to sit with the family during the divorce.  He ate with family after funeral I am told.  Oh, I was there, but I have no memories from the time I got in my car to go to the cemetery nor do I remember the meal at the house. Mother the other day told me x sat in the dining room with family and I was in the kitchen with the children. I have no memory of it which shocked us both.  I guess trauma causes memory loss and x being there did traumatize me. He kept touching me during the service...patting on the shoulder etc like he was concerned. But those of us who know the manipulation tactics of controlling Ns know it was pure intimidation. 

After daddy died, the family planned this partnership. They did not tell me about it, and actually lied to me when I asked about things. THis lying happened more than once.  AFter it was set up, then I was told I could be in it if I wanted.  This registered as more betrayal to me. I have asked them why they did that, and got answers like "you were in a divorce trauma and we wanted to protect you" and "we know you do not like family partnerships and prefer to live your own life".  Well, they were right on the second one.

Love has overcome attempts at parental alienation and children and I are fine. However, they do not understand the extent of what their mother went though and do not have the ability to listen. I do not push it either. They have years to learn though.  I know what I went though and know I survived. I am all that needs to know.  It does help here though talking about it to people who understand. 

Getting the letter from the accountant that brother will be moving into the general partnership position does not surprise me really.  I am still disgusted though because it brought up some old feelings. 

Silver lining:  Being general partner makes him accountable legally.  This is good.
                  The emotions which surfaced are minimal compared to what they have been.  This is the best thing for it indicates to me how I have healed. 




I am a Divine Design, a miraculous creation of Love, Light,and Peace.

Sela

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1273
Re: Family
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2006, 04:21:25 PM »
Hi Me:  ( :lol:  that makes me giggle 'cause it sounds like I'm talking to myself.    :shock:  They say that's ok too, as long as I don't answer myself. :?).

Wow!  You have been through a lot eh?   Too bad you couldn't just get your share of the business stuff and go it alone.  Or would that be something you would want?

I just wonder because these people sound like a bunch of weirdos and I don't trust them to rip you off......sooner or later.  It seems safer, maybe, to sever business ties/dealings with them asap, maybe?  I don't know.  Just what I was thinking.

Quote
x kept bags of my underwear

What?  To wear himself or make her wear them?   :shock: :shock:  Wait!  How would you know?  Silly questions there.....sorry Me.  That just takes the cake ....doesn't it?

He's attached to your underwear......after 30 years.
He's got a fettish for those undies.
He just can't part with them.

She has the same name/initials as you?  :shock: :shock:
The ring thingy?  :shock: :shock:

He's waaaaaaaaay too weird.  I can't imagine what you've endured while married to him.  Thankfully you're free now!!  Way to go!!

And your nutso family!  You protested and pleaded and they invited HIM ALMIGHTY to eat with them.  He is part of their family, I'd say.  You're not.

Count your lucky stars!!!

Your brother sounds like someone who wanted to talk to my therapist and demanded the address/phone number from me.   :shock: :shock:   I was told I was "too secretive" and "paranoid" when I wouldn't give out the information. 

Hogwash.   People like that have no respect for anyone else's privacy or personal boundaries. 

I think you're much better of ......the less you are involved with them.  So sorry ((((((Me))))). 

Quote
I survived.

Yes you did.  And I'm glad you're reaching out here for support and to talk.  Talk away!  Especially if it helps!

Quote
The emotions which surfaced are minimal compared to what they have been.  This is the best thing for it indicates to me how I have healed. 


Have you mourned the loss of a "normal" family  and "normal" marriage do you think?  (the one's you didn't have but could have had/should have had/wanted to have??)
 
Have you expressed all of your grief/feelings?

How do you feel these days?  (less emotional.......you said ......but does that mean you're "controlling" your emotions more or that it feels like they've disippated?

Only if you feel like saying. 

I'm glad you feel you have healed thus far.  That indicates you're moving.  So much better than stagnant or stuck in one place eh?

 :D Sela

ANewSheriff

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
Re: Family
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2006, 05:03:05 PM »
Me:
Quote
When family and business are mixed together, sometimes the best form of distance is found in the boundary of being empowered, self-secure, and knowing you can protect yourself if necessary.

I so understand and have empathy for this, Me.  I, too, live in the world of the family business.  My family is very disconnected - no phone calls on birthdays, no social gatherings, and no intimacy.  If it were not for the family business none of us would probably ever speak to one another at all.  That is the common bond for a mostly antisocial crowd. 

I did learn after beating my head against a wall for many years trying to fix and reconnect people that did not want to be fixed or reconnected that it was best just to back off and set some good boundaries as you mention here.  And, I agree with you that in order to have boundaries that do not move, we must find a place of empowerment and security.

I can feel your frustation.  I am glad you are here.

ANewSheriff     
Change the way you see the world and you will change the world.

Me

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 10
Re: Family
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2006, 05:43:58 PM »
Thanks for the replies!  Nice to know others out there understand the subtle manipulations which go on with emotional abuse. 

To answer Sela's question, yes, the emotions including rage and grief have disapated. Took longer to get to the rage, but I did.  Just some occasional left over pieces which float to the top occasionally.  I am getting a PhD now and writing a book which is giving me great joy!  I have remade my life.

For a while, I had mourned family though, for I lost what I thought I had.  But, re-read that last sentence...what I thought I had. What I had was an illusion.  I now have another truth.  What I sought from family but did not find, I now find within. Loosing some of these attachments was like being drawn and quartered emotionally, but it was well worth it. This is a lot better. 

My best girlfriend called the other day telling me of some of x's antics lately. He is just as manic as ever. I listen because it has taken her long to process also.  She lives 4 blocks from him while I moved to another town.  You know what?  We were howling with laughter. Oh boy, that was nice!  Healing!  I know it is a thing of my past now.  Yes, as I said, occasionally something surfaces, but not often, and it is not hard to deal with it.  x is my children's father, and for their sake, I don't want harm to come to them from him. They are balanced, married, and self supporting, so I don't worry much. x though did marry a board certified card carrying N, so if the marriage does not work, there is going to be fireworks.  

The thing is, I am now just these last two years recognizing family stuff.  Brother particularly.  If we had not grown up together, I would not have known we were even kin.  I am seeing that the controlling sister triangles...in other words, she talks to a third person about you.  The other sister is in deep trouble now.  She does need professional help but will not go due to her religious views.  I try to tell myself that brother had the same parents his sisters had, thus, has some inner work to do.  This takes the edge off, but I still have rather separated myself from him and his.

The business stuff is temporary.  Will not last forever. And if brother does not handle it properly, there are legalities which will be involved which have nothing to do with me.  It will be well worth my time to wait that out.  Legally, I have to.  When it ends, that does it for me.   :D
I am a Divine Design, a miraculous creation of Love, Light,and Peace.

Hopalong

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13621
Re: Family
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2006, 06:13:36 PM »
Me,
Excruciating.
Betrayal by your blind mother AND N-brother. And no comfort from your sisters. And them tolerating the ex who raped you?????????????????????? Your brother was no brother.

The "charms" of Ns are so horrifyingly successful, so very often. Otherwise, wouldn't the Net be absolutely chock-a-block with forums like this one? And it's not, which is in a way quite scary.

I can imagine the drawn-and-quartered emotional passages you have been through. What a triumph your differentiation and professional and personal accomplishments are. Bravo.

BTW, I recognize the bizarre substitution-of-one-for-another, approach-women-as-generic-creatures thing. It gave me the deepest creeps when TWO Nbfs gave me (put together in hindsight with other exes of theirs) the exact same gifts they'd given other women in their lives, used the same lines...etc.

Glad you're here.

Hopalong
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

gratitude28

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2582
Re: Family
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2006, 10:55:31 PM »
Welcome ME.
I want to go back and reread yourpost and write to you more, but I have to get some work done right now. So I just wanted to say Hi and it's a nice place here and we look forward to hearing your story.
Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

moonlight52

  • Guest
Re: Family
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2006, 11:22:30 PM »
Welcome Me, Wow what you have endured and I bet you are a very compassionate person having gone though it all.But now understanding the manipulations makes one wise as well.Me,you said "it took longer to get to the rage "that just shows how gentle and
kind you are .And now you and your girlfriend can even laugh about n ex that is so cool.But the lying and the betrayal of family members
I understand this pain ,I think we all do.It's so creepy.I admire your strength and how you are healing from all this emotional abuse.
Love and Light
Moonlight

Me

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 10
Re: Family
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2006, 04:31:19 AM »
You know, in reading your kind posts, I had what I feel is a deeper insight. 

I had wondered why my family had not believed me during the first 7 or 8 months of the divorce.  Now, con-x was doing his royal thing of course which went something like this:  "my poor wife is  really having emotional trouble.  I just want the best for her, just like I always have." Meanwhile he had thrown away my clothes, put his new girlfriends clothes in my closet and was actively dating her while stalking me, sending me flowers, etc. You can imagine how it went as well as see though the con adn manipulation, but my family could not. This type of thing happened to other people, not our family.  Appearances, remember?

Anyone who has had this level of emotional abuse during their adult life and childhood is going to have emotional overload of one kind or another.  Minimally, they are scared, frightened. Emotional abuse as you know robs you of the sense of self so you can be an extension of another. So, it is hard to function from a perspective of wholeness.  My family had seen this in my reactions, but did not understand it.  So when x continued his con, they immediately would believe him, who is not emotional in his presentation, and I who am terrorized in my situation would act as a normal terrorized person would act.  Makes sense, doesn't it, especially when you filter in their the belief which came from mother that people who show emotions have great problems.  The only one who truly understood the problem was the psychiatrist I went to who said after hearing my story, "The person who is crazy is the x, not you.  Go live your life and don't look back except to understand.  But, if you ever think about coming back to this man, come see me first, for I know then you will need help."  Good advice which I took.

Now, perhaps it may be possible that brother relates to x so much because he is like x in many ways.  Had not thought of that before. x still calls my mother, who hates to talk to him now as she slowly has understood.  But she does talk to him, saying it is because he is her grandchildren's father.  Stupid reason, IMHO. But it is her problem, not mine. On some level, perhaps she is afraid not to talk to him when he calls.  As I said, it is her problem now, not mine. If he so much as looks at me, it is a violation of a court order which I will persue to the fullest exent of the law.  Besides, if he does that, his new wife will demolish him in some way. 

Something else I have just seen while reading your responses and my posts.  My family all these years has known me as insecure, a person who was dependent on the actions and support of others as well as a very emotional person who had panic attacks.  I was the revolving door when the children were little, trying to give them a normal life and making every thing work well for them. Well, I lost myself in the process. However, that was the person my family knew.

Now, though, I am totally different.  I consider myself rather empowered. From my current perspective, all these things were a soul lesson for empowerment which was what I came here to learn.  I know my strengths, and I know when it is OK to be vulnerable in life.  I have not only moved out of the state for half a year, I am a different country.  Everything from family business goes to my own business attorney for it is important to realize what you know and understand, but it is more important to recognize what you do not understand and get support/help in that area!  My family not only does not know this person who I am now, but being a co-dependent bunch, they cannot relate to independence and empowerment, especially in females.  Guess you could say in their eyes, I am the odd man out.  That is great with me.

Sometimes, in some ways, you simply have to cut the family ties.  I am in the process of doing this. Perhaps I already have.  Yes, it hurts sometimes more than others.  Yes, it is the right thing to do.  Yes, it probably is a more normal, funcitoning way to relate to these people.  Yes, for a while I had to deal with guilt at being myself; this was the hardest one, but I got over it nicely. Yes, part of me mourned my perception of family, but the spiritual part of me finds a higher form of love which is very rewarding. 

If there is one thing I would say to others who have had these experiences it is this:  You can get over it by living each day within the presence of your wholeness. All previous experiences are your history but they do not determine your worth.  Emotional abuse is an experience which was designed by others to determine their own self worth. It is not a definition of yourself for only you make that perception. 

Once I found the above truth, I was on my way to joy, freedom. and abundance in the way I could create it. 

Talking to everyone here, just spilling my guts out, has given me profound insight.  Perhaps I had to see it objectionably.  Perhaps a higher power has directed me here.  Doesn't matter really, for the loving hugs I got here are very special.

Blessings to everyone who has been voiceless in their life.  May we all roar now with joy!


I am a Divine Design, a miraculous creation of Love, Light,and Peace.