Author Topic: What about the love?  (Read 3300 times)

WarriorGirl

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What about the love?
« on: January 24, 2004, 07:11:13 PM »
...I wanna give some of you hope.
   Did anyone ever become involved with someone who was a full on Narcissist, but was worth the trouble FOR YOU TO LEARN TO speak their language, and to get them to their TRUEST self? kIND OF LIKE BREAKING DOWN ALL THEIR BARRIERS AND RAISING THEM AGAIN LIKE A NURTURING PARENT?
   Mine is worth it and if you're interested I'll let you know how he's doing. These people are in a world of pain we can't understand, and maybe it's the empaths among us who have to be the leaders. I am now starting to believe that maybe N's choose the BEST of us begging them to not give up and HELP them have all the gifts and riches we have...any thoughts? Because, WarriorGirl was made by this man, and I made him...but I'm really really really really smart and I think there's a way to keep these damaged souls alive,,,if they believe they're worth it...look, I'm not saying it's possible...but I HAVE to let this man have a shot at a life like the one I enjoy...

Nic

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What about the love?
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2004, 10:10:52 PM »
Warriorgirl,
I suppose i'd give you brownie points for thinking Ns have as many rights as the rest of us, that they are wounded souls, that if they were only aware of what they are doing they would be so much happier.  And of course it takes people like you to save them from their inherited or not unhappiness.
If you are a Phd in psychology and thereby into a loving albeit professional relationship with this man I would dare to say give it a shot.
But then Ns like people who think they should be happier, they enjoy having people around who will feed their need to be heard and valued for who they are..just like Normal people right?...Ns love to have altruistic, love bubbles all around them to better feed off them, that's my opinion.
Philosophically and spiritually and socially, i believe you are right in having faith that true Ns can one day maybe shed that layer of self hatred and self absorption..why not..the problem is that Ns are never really aware of their life sucking ability..they take and do not give, they don't hear you, they size you up..they're not concerned for your health the way a empathic person would be..they want you to remain a well oiled servile machine.
No matter what you say, you never have a sharing and equal relationship with an N.. no matter how good the sex is ( 'cos often it is!) you have a service contract with them..when you rebel or get exhausted or start taking care of yourself ( not both of you for ethereal purposes) they start to think it's time to move on to a more reliable source of supply.  They have no loyalty toward you because life for them is a one way street..they'll shower you with gifts or make you pay all the time because it's not about giving, it's about controlling.  They involve all kinds of people in your relationship..just in case..people start to look at you funny because the N has made sure he's told at least ten people that although you're very nice and caring you do have some major faults..just in case. For an N that's playing it safe...just in case they're found out or it gets too uncomfortable for them, they always have a quick escape route..forever are living plan B instead of what you're living..plan A.
It is the ultimate selfishness borne out of conditioned, inherited, genetically conjured up or whatever..Ns are in it, the " game of life" that is for themselves and noone else..not even you.
They delude themselves into thinking that Love conquers all but deep down inside are terribly afraid that the very love they speak of will demolish them...they must control love, like everything in their world..just in case.
They'll wine and dine you, make wonderful love and promises to you because as long as you're serving them well you are hyper-valued, you have deity status.  Lord help you if somewhere along the way they find someone better ( because they're always looking- come on we've all seen their radar eyes forever scanning the horizon for a sympathy fix!) and they convince themselves that this time He or She is it..then you become the greatest mistake of their life..all the nice things you've done for them and to them are now torture and lies and pure fiction..you didn't help them at all..you just made them worse and now you're gonna pay!  And man how they'll make you pay..you are now enemy number one, you are villified and slandered to anyone who will listen.  You remember your pillow talk, what you thought was great communication, tenderness and intimacy..well! Wake up and smell the vindictiveness, that wasn't muskrat love, it was a year, 10 years, a month, 30 years of information gathering just in case ... the N will rewind his or her tape and playback your most intimate secret and turn it into a weapon of mass destruction..you're cooked!
Ns by some miracle, and it has happened, do occasionally seek professional help..one hopes it's for the right reason that is that they know they are Ns, and not a bogus life crisis for which they're seeking a quick fix!  I have read some articles of reformed Ns, but the one's i've read about have no family, no lover/wife/partner, they've lost it all.  I guess that would qualify as the bottom of the barrel for them.  I have yet to hear of anyone man or woman saving his or her N from themselves.

When you've been burned by Ns all your life and when your existence has been poisoned by such individuals you never want to have anything to do with them again, especially after having wasted a good two thirds of it trying to understand them and make them better.  It is a waste of time. People have lives that need to be filled they are not gas tanks waiting to be emptied by the worst of the worst, who to me have proven to be Ns with all their co-morbid and sordid other pathologies.
Good luck, I really don't mean to burst your bubble but I can't believe your post, are you serious or are you being facetious?
Nic :idea:
All truth passes through 3 stages
First it is ridiculed, second, it is violently opposed,third,it is accepted as being self evident
-Arthur Schopenhauer

Anastasia

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What about the love?
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2004, 09:39:07 AM »
Brillantly said, Nic.  I really enjoyed your answer.  Thanks!

WarriorGirl

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What about the love?
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2004, 12:50:39 PM »
...man that was a great response. Here's the thing:
   My N is a direct connection to literally dozens of people who are "normal", and mine is such a sociopath that if I don't just give him what the hell he needs to survive, I never see my friends again and am dismissed as the crazy one. You all, friends, know how that is. By the way, have you cats noticed that a lot of these Ns of our generation (30-40) BEGIN TO ACTUALLY LOOK LIKE SATAN? Any one else notice this? I send my love to all of you, and of course I was not being facetious. I just wanna let him think he's got some sort of control, albeit gentle, so that I can have the freedom afforded people normally if there's no devil around.
   BTW, are people mad at me here? I am a soul sister of all of you, I hear someone is unwelcome on this board and since I am relatively new I thought perhaps I'd offended some of you also recovering...I'm just really really new at this...I went through all the research to find out what the hell had actually happened to me AND IT BROUGHT ME HERE.
   I am your typical attractive, successful, athletic, babe and a half...I sh** you not I am one hot girl (hence my N went after me...duh...they hunt as close to Nirvana as they can find, ya da ya da you know the drill...you KNOW that wasn't a brag if you know an N yourself)...MUTHA NEVER EVEN SAW ME!!!!!
   What a waste. Damn. I'm cute.
   Anyhow. I read books on alcoholism to see if that was the cause of his "emotional unavailability". Alcoholism alone wasn't QUITE right. Got books on abusive relationships. Wasn't THAT quite it either, what had happened to me, although...holy cow. THE SONOFABITCH WAS ON EVERY PAGE!!! It was harder than anything I've ever had to go through, getting through that book (WHY DOES HE DO THAT: INSIDE THE MINDS OF ANGRY AND CONTROLLING MEN...Lundy Bancroft, I think???...anyhow...)...
   Then I put it together. THE LACK OF ANY SORT OF EMPATHY WAS THE THING THAT REALLY CHINKED IT INTO PLACE FOR ME.  This man doesn't even exist. There's no one in there. He makes shit up as he goes along. He has no past and no future. There's NO-ONE there. But still he controls with his ridiculous, childish outbursts...ugh. You've been there. So I am just wondering...anyone else just GIVEN them what they want, ONLY SEE THEM IN PUBLIC WHERE THEY CAN'T LOSE IT ON YOU, ya da ya da...guys, I want my "peeps" around me...some tips please? How do I let my friends know what he's been doing to me, and to THEM...using them to create ambient abuse for me????HEEELLLPPP!

Anonymous

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What about the love?
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2004, 03:32:52 PM »
only you can decide whether to continue your life with your partner, and whether the pay-offs are worth the pain and problems.
Depends on your particular needs, and how difficult to live with he is.

I have a friend whose depressed narcissist husband seems to meet her needs- for money and social contacts and a superficial good life- but then he's very insecure and she's definitely the boss...his narcissistic behaviour is more of the whining withdrawing type. His grandiose gestures are irritating rather than devastating- though taking the child away on holiday without telling her would have given me a lot of concern; she was confident he would return safely and they did. I'd be livid if anyone took my children away like that.

I doubt your friends will understand or see your side though. Most people have little understanding or interest in psychology and even if they listen they'll ask you if it's so bad why not just leave.

Best thing to do is probably find a good therapist you can discuss these issues with, and work out why it is you want to stay, snd if it is the best decision for you.

rosencrantz

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What about the love?
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2004, 06:27:05 PM »
Hi Warrior Girl - I'm sorry that you too feel that people might be mad at you.  I'm sure they are not.  Someone is lurking on the board rocking people's confidence - it usually means there's an 'N' about causing subtle havoc somewhere.  Yuk!  Just ignore it and it will go away.

Nic - Wow!  Have you come on several lightyears in the past months.  Congratulations.  Wot a post!!! :-)

Warrior Girl - you understand your situation very well - yes, you'll lose  friends and a social situation if you rock the boat - but aren't you worth it?  If you don't rock the boat in order to find better love and more loyal friends and a more secure social base, you'll lose much more in time - your self-esteem, your integrity, maybe even your sanity.  Is it worth it?  Go on out there, cool cookie, live your own life, not his.

Good luck
R
"No matter how enmeshed a commander becomes in the elaboration of his own
thoughts, it is sometimes necessary to take the enemy into account" Sir Winston Churchill

rosencrantz

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What about the love?
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2004, 06:30:17 PM »
PS You're also right about the man in your life - the pain and what you need to do to reach him and enable him to lead a great life.  But a) you'll get destroyed in the process b) he won't let you succeed anyway.

Even the best therapists shrink from taking on true 'N's'.

Right analysis - wrong solution.  ;-)
"No matter how enmeshed a commander becomes in the elaboration of his own
thoughts, it is sometimes necessary to take the enemy into account" Sir Winston Churchill

rosencrantz

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What about the love?
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2004, 06:37:03 PM »
PPS I suppose you could give them all a copy of the same book.

Seriously, I found my way into keeping relationships which my N was trying to scupper by sticking it out and believing in myself - and challenging very carefully and gently but persistently when people tried to dump the blame on me (the 'you're too sensitive' type).  And letting go quickly (it was ultimately more productive) if anyone seemed resistant to the truth.  It may take years. And you may just have to accept differing opinions about where the truth lies - but you can still retain the relationships.  Just don't let your N provoke paranoia in YOU!
R
"No matter how enmeshed a commander becomes in the elaboration of his own
thoughts, it is sometimes necessary to take the enemy into account" Sir Winston Churchill