Author Topic: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...  (Read 3548 times)

gratitude28

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What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« on: January 08, 2007, 10:33:12 PM »
The narcissist is besieged and tormented by a sadistic superego which sits in constant judgement. It is an amalgamation of negative evaluations, criticisms, angry or disappointed voices, and disparagement meted out in the narcissist's formative years and adolescence by parents, peers, role models, and authority figures.

These harsh and repeated comments reverberate throughout the narcissist's inner landscape, berating him for failing to conform to his unattainable ideals, fantastic goals, and grandiose or impractical plans. The narcissist's sense of self-worth is, therefore, catapulted from one pole to another: from an inflated view of himself (incommensurate with real life accomplishments) to utter despair and self-denigration.

Hence the narcissist's need for narcissistic supply to regulate this wild pendulum. People's adulation, admiration, affirmation, and attention restore the narcissist's self-esteem and self-confidence.

The narcissist's sadistic and uncompromising superego affects three facets of his personality:

1. His sense of self-worth and worthiness (the deeply ingrained conviction that one deserves love, compassion, care, and empathy regardless of what one achieves). The narcissist feels worthless without narcissistic supply.

2. His self-esteem (self-knowledge, the deeply ingrained and realistic appraisal of one's capacities, skills, limitations, and shortcomings). The narcissist lacks clear boundaries and, therefore, is not sure of his abilities and weaknesses. Hence his grandiose fantasies.

3. His self-confidence (the deeply ingrained belief, based on lifelong experience, that one can set realistic goals and accomplish them). The narcissist knows that he is a fake and a fraud. He, therefore, does not trust his ability to manage his own affairs and to set practical aims and realize them.

By becoming a success (or at least by appearing to have become one) the narcissist hopes to quell the voices inside him that constantly question his veracity and aptitude. The narcissist's whole life is a two-fold attempt to both satisfy the inexorable demands of his inner tribunal and to prove wrong its harsh and merciless criticism.


This is by Sam Vaknin. My main question here is the wording of #2 in that I don't understand what he means by "boundaries." Do any of you have ideas?

Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

Hopalong

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Re: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2007, 11:07:42 PM »
Hi Beth,

I'm guessing he means that because an N can't realistically look at his/her own natural gifts and limitations and either be healthily happy about them (gifts) or, with maturity, realistically accept them (limitations)...they're constantly flowing back and forth from fixating on what they pretend are "gifts" (grandiose fantasies) or "limitations" (horrible self-loathing). There's no realistic or humane sense of what they are, either positively or negatively...and that truly is what boundaries are. Boundaries of a self actually hold, contain the self. Ns have very weak ones or they couldn't be so deluded.

That help?

Hops
« Last Edit: January 09, 2007, 09:30:35 AM by Hopalong »
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

moonlight52

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Re: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2007, 11:13:48 PM »
Hey Beth and CB123 and Hops

Could this be about self awareness ??????

It is hard to judge others and how self aware one is or is not.......

I have made this error myself judging others self awareness

how much a person is self aware and can really look within with all faults and learn to come to terms within.....and still hold love

But maybe here the indication is a persecutor within that never stops.

I do wish for anyone not to be burning within from pain or bitterness and for everyone to find a way to peace and love .

This I truly pray for with all my heart...

moon

gratitude28

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Re: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2007, 11:54:15 PM »
All of your answers make a ton of sense (in fact so much that I feel kind of doltish :) ) Yes, I totally see what you mean about the inability to appraise oneself. Funny, then those of us go the other way almost... I am so critical of myself that I can never be at peace. In a way, that is almost just as delusional.

Kisses to all of you. And thanks... for being here.
Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

moonlight52

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Re: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2007, 12:03:45 AM »
 P.S HEY BETH WHAT DO I KNOW ....i KNOW YOU SURE DO MAKE ME LAUGH and thanks for you being so wonderful....I am working on a lot of self doubt but today was a good day.....

Finding a balance within THIS IS GOOD....(NOT SO EASY FOR SOME) :oops:
This self esteem is to be found within there is the place when others views of you are maybe not the most important ........

Finding the peace within which may mean forgiving self or others AND learning and growing....
What ever the perspective is just holding the love within for self and for others .
That peace and love can only be found within .........the choice to hold love or bitterness ........

Forgiving self is a gift to others and visa versa. :D
good thread

love

m

moon

gratitude28

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Re: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2007, 12:07:53 AM »
Moon,
You are sounding really good!!!! It is so nice to hear from you.
Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

moonlight52

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Re: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2007, 12:14:20 AM »
Hey Beth

 I can not spend all my time banging my head on walls.... :lol:

 I just can not go on in fear and have made a stand not to live in fear.....

 so how is that  hubby of yours doing?????? ah to be young again

and be able to stay up late those daze are over for me......

I bet cha you are a riot to party with... 8)

love to you Beth darlin

m


moonlight52

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Re: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2007, 12:15:25 AM »
nite nite
m

axa

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Re: What does #2 mean?? I understand most of this...
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2007, 05:53:18 AM »
Boundaries.  My experience of XN and boundaries was that he saw me as an extention of himself.  If I did something good it was as if he did it.  He really believed this.  He has no sense of separetness.  When I challenged him it was as if some part of HIM had lost control.  Once in a restaurant he ordered food for me.  I told him I did not want what he ordered and could choose for mysel.  His response was but I like that food.........

When anyone "close" to him achieved anything it was as if he had been the achiever.  It is really weird.  He would suggest that I TELL others what do do, not taking into account their needs/time restrictions etc he just never got it that other people were not an extentin of him.  Its very sad in some ways because they are constantly frustrated by anyone who will not co operate with them.

XN had big problems with authority figures.  These were the people who said NO to him, again how could they.  They were saying to him I am seperate to you, it was so unbearable for him.

Does this help

axa