No contact - OOPS broke the rules

[axa]

Did something last night which I have advised others here not to do so holding my hand up.

I have posted about my conversation with my son and how we had a nice evening together but I went to bed and was enraged at the nerve of XN's D for working up a friendship with my son.  Anway I called XN.  WHAT I can hear you all saying THE QUEEN OF NO CONTACT MADE CONTACT.  Anyway I did it and it was very useful for me.  We talked for a long time and I got such a sense of him and how he operates, it was very revealing.  Of course he thinks about me every day!!!! and still loves me!!!! He said he could do nothing about his D and her friendship with my son which I disputed since she is his puppet.  Anyway, neither of us can do anything about that but I was warning him that if she hurts my son I will be extremely angry.....  why did I need to say that, dunno but I did. 

He was very sweet (ugh)   saw how I had been sucked in to a relationship with him.  Told me he was not paranoid any longer because he is not dealing with anything emotional, in other words ME!!!!  I asked him how his "re marriage" was going and Oh boy then did the N surface.  He spoke about his xwife(she is now his present wife again) as if she was nothing.  The coldness and hardness in his voice was chilling.  He is living abroad ALONE and she is living in his house, of course this is the sort of semantics he gets up to.  As far as his xwife is concerned I have no doubt she thinks they are married again.  He spoke of her in such disparaging terms, she is getting the abuse for sure almost feel sorry for her.  He said that she was in the house because his daughter wanted her there.... same old line but he also said that his D realises that she is there because she needed a meal ticket........ pretty sad stuff.

He told me that our neighbours abroad ask about me all the time and wonder how I am doing.  He also said he had a new contract coming up but was not sure if he would take it as it was in a pretty remote country.  He said he was sorry for what happened between us, NOT, just that sort of line used to work on me.  He said he is happy now, goes to work, comes home and reads the papers, still fights with his boss but he likes being alone. Like WHAT he comes home every three weeks for a month.   Of course alone means he has xwife at the end of the phone, cleaning his house and facilitating him in bed but making no demands.

Well the upshot of all of this is that I think it was good for me to have had that contact with him.  To hear the way he spoke about his xwife showed me how hateful he is towards women and how disrespectful he is.  Somehow how he uses people became so clear to me.  I think in some ways it closed another door for me.  I don't recommend anyone else doing this but it did give me something.  I am under no illusion that I ever meant anything to him or for that matter neither does anyone else in the world.  And yep I needed to know that AGAIN>

Something else I noticed was how ambigious his talk is, everything can have a different meaning and that was the stuff that nearly drove me demented.

axa

[Hopalong]

2 steps forward, 1 step back, hon.
Don't beat yourself up.

Can you now make a choice to observe yourself for the next few weeks, and take intentional note of how much of your time you spend thinking about xN and xN'sD?

Just observe it?

If you can take this reaffirmation of who and what he is and go Bleahhh, yuck, shudder, and move on...all to the good. If you do find yourself recycling the attachment by thinking about it a lot...that's just support to reestablish NC.

His D and your boy really don't have anything to do with you. It's a little drama. But it could hook you in for a very long time if they "stay friends" in that loose long-term way 20-somethings tend to do.

IMO, you don't deserve that!!!!!

It's New Life for Axa time. How is all the newness going? Where you're living? What classes are you taking and how do they feel?

love to you Axa,
Hops

[Cadbury]

Don't beat yourself too hard about it.... it is very easy to get sucked in again. It is a blip - it doesn't mean anything.

I have to laugh at the similarities of N's.... He still lvoes you, that is what my ex is forever saying in emails (that I mostly ignore!). HE has quite catagorically told the court that the reason I find it hard to deal with him is that I still love him, that is what I struggle with (Apparently!). As for the ambiguity - Gah!! How frustrating is it?!! My ex recently sent me an email in which he says I have to "learn to trust" and that everything he is about to do is for my benefit, it just may not look that way. Fast forward to court - he is now disputing he owes me any money. (Previously he promised to pay). If I trust him, everything will be okay... there are things he needs to do... Ambiguity gone mad!! Why can't they just talk straight?

Anyway, I feel your dementedness and understand where you are coming from, and don't be tempted to finish your conversation (I know how the brooding works on your mind.... ). You cannot finish a conversation with an N as it is all too mad for words

Good luck, take care of yourself!

Cadbury

[gratitude28]

Axa,
I hear what you are talking about ANY TIME I have contact with my mother. She lies constantly. She makes promises that I know are lies. I can see all her tricks now. It seems ridiculous. And I see how she, too, sucked me in - if you can say that of a mother. I stick with as little contact as possible now. And the times I do have to talk to her, it is with extreme caution and eyes wide open.

(((((axa)))))))))

Thanks for posting this as I think it will help others see the truth in their Ns.

Love, Beth

[lighter]

I understand the need to re establish the depth of feeling regarding something like this.  

Ya, it's bad.... really bad.  

Not good.  

Nothing good.

It can evaporate over time and sometimes it's reassuring to be reminded.

There's never any peace though and maybe that's the danger..... if we need some closure or peace, then we're in trouble.

I think you're past needing closure or making peace.... I think you know there isn't anything better than what you already have.  

No contact.

I believe you strengthened your conviction and came away without doubts, which is a good thing.

If you were doubting your perceptions and wondering if you did the right thing.... that would be soemthing else altogether.

I think you did just fine...... kinda scary to pay such close attention to the details, eh?

[Ami]

Dear Axa,
  This is just me and I could be wrong. Behavioral  therapy has the patient  keep making contact with the" feared "object until you have no fear anymore.I am NOT saying that NC is not the answer with abusers. I think that you need NC for a period of time so you can get some distance. However, what I am saying is that sometimes inching closer to your abuser(like the snake in the museum) could allow us to see with NEW  eyes. The abuser could lose some of his (her) power over us ,perhaps.
  Please, understand that I am saying that it could be a useful technique at the "right" time ,only.. However, we have to be very careful b/c we ARE dealing with "snakes" and they are more cunning and crafty than we are.
  Just a thought.I don't think that you  neccessarily  made a "mistake", Axa. It could be a healing step for you. It sounds like it was ,to me. As Hops says, we shall see how it plays out with you as  time goes by before we can see the final answer.                        Love    Ami

[axa]

My wonderful beautiful friends

I feel good - doing a little happy dance.  Not that I ever doubted he was an N but boy its good to have it affirmed.  Feel no guilt am sure I did the right thing.  It is 10 months down the road and I got a taste of what it could have been like if I had not left.......... so glad I did.  Oh I think he thinks he left me!!!!!!

Lighter

I know the closure has to come within me and seems like the gaping hole is getting smaller and smaller each day  When I was speaking to him I had a sense of you guys being in the room and that was comforting.


Cadbury,
Why can't they talk straight.......... simple because they are Ns and always fishing always trying to destablise, its a good way to set the virus going in your head so that you are trying to make sense of what they say.  There is no point just like your x they are a bit dumb really they don't get the bit that after leaving an abuser the victims do see what is going on.  Its like they rewrite history.  I have no doubt XN has twisted our conversation in his head at this stage.

Hops,

I think you are so right, as usual.  I will observe myself over the next few weeks and see how I am.  I had gotten to the point where when he would come into my head I would observe the thought and out loud say "thinking" it worked.  

ABout the newness......... its great.  It is ironic that I ended up in XN's home city though.  In fact I park my car outside the house he lived in as a child weird or what.  Anyway, I love it.  I love my course.  At the moment I am taking classes in Dynamics of Conflict, Conflict and Identity, Latin America and the conflict and torture that went on there.  It is interesting in that we do a lot of work on victims and how victims see themselves etc, breaking the cycle.  I just love the classes.  Made some nice friends, a few Yanks in the class.  There is so much reading to do it is incredible and my poor old brain is struggling with retaining anything but I trust it is going in there somewhere.  I have a big essay to write over the next few weeks so that should be interesting and a major CHALLENGE.

I have been good around getting exercise every day and that taking care of myself is proving to be powerful work.  Most days I ask myself how I am and the answer so far has been I AM HAPPY.  

How about you? and the business? I do hope it is going the way you want it to.  I think of you so often.

Once again thank you all for the marvellous support I get here

A happy axa

[axa]

AMi,

I think that was some of what was going on for me.  I am not afraid of him.  My only fear about him ever was that I would have a breakdown if I stayed around his madness and badness.   I like your analogy of the snake......................ssssssssssssseems like you are right there.  I have a life now, it was hard won and intend making the most of it.

Hugs,

axa

[Bella_French]

Dear Axa,
That must be so frustrating, having xN's Daughter invade your life via your son. i think I understand more about your conflict with your son now, having read this post. It must be so scarey feeling that ex N and his puppet daughter could be influencing your son, and it would be a worry that he would somehow become like `them' or harm you bu proxy. It realy is a legitimate concern, in my opinion.

I'm glad that you were able to rekindle your good feelings about each other last night though:) That must be a weight off your shoulders, Axa.

As for the making contact with the ex-N thing, you seem to know what you're doing, and that NC is a big no-no. Its amazing how easy it is to slip up, huh?

X bella 

[lighter]

Axa:

I've had the sense that board members were near, listening with me.

It's so centering, so comforting. 

(((Axa))) 

[axa]

Bella & Lighter,

No regrets about contacting Xn but back to the No Contact rule again, which is easy because it is what I want.  I am so glad to be free of him and to have a real life again.  Having that bit of contact with him reminded me so much of the reality of being with him, the lies, crazy making, the smooth talking pathetic old bastard.  YES to life without Ns.

axa