Why is it so hard to move on...

[Ami]

Dear Gabbenangel,
  The threads on the board are very powerful,now. They are allowing me to heal at deeper and deeper levels. I suspect that you are experiencing the same thing (as well as many other people)
  I want to share what happened to me ,today, at the gym.
  I have been feeling the 'yearning" for a "codependent " relationship. I feel it "calling me.".
  Instead of "acting" on it, I am "watching it unfold ". I am in the "observer mode".
  I was on the exercise bike and I was thinking about what was it that I wanted from this "codependent" relationship. I was thinking about a past N relationship. What was it that met the "yearning "b/c this relationship met the yearning. I ended it before I had any bad fall-out,also.
There were a few interactions that exemplified what I yearned for. One was that this boyfriend said that he loved me so much that he could "wash my hair." He could put me to bed and take care of me if I was sick.
I was thinking that of all the interactions with him,it was these few that touched me in that hurting place that was so burned by my M.
Then ,I started crying b/c what I wanted in him WAS my mother. I started thinking of my grandmother while she was dying in the hospital. She was calling for her mother ,who had died when she was a young girl.
 Getting to the core of what we are yearning for might be a key to stopping the codependent behavior. If we don't stop it, we are continully looking in the wrong place for what we need. In the process, we get more and more hurt as we are left more and more empty.
  I felt like I could not breathe as I experienced this truth. It is very big. When i saw it,my depression lifted.            Ami

[gabbenangel]

Hi Ami,

Yes, it is good to hear that you are processing rather than acting out. That gives me hope and courage. I am at a deeper level of healing too that seems to be progressing each day, at least I hope. At times I want to scream and hit someone or something (I don't though)...the rage at being so rejected by my parents, the burning hurt at having my needs invalidated, the feeling that I was just tossed onto the scape heap, dismissed by my parents when they abandoned me as toddler all keeps coming up and up and the tears just keep flowing...it feels endless though. I went through 4 years of intensive Freudian therapy to uncover this wound and process the complicated grief. Here I am again, more pain, at a deeper level and more intensely, at times excruciating. And now, I am angry at God. I feel rejected by Him, yet I know that was just how I felt in the deepest regions of my belly as a little girl who was rejected by her parents, unwanted....

I opened up to this N...revealed my most inner self and then she cuts me off...slanders me to my faith community....it is pushing these old tapes and rejection buttons all over again but at a new level. I can relate to the observing stage vs. acting out stage. I want to call my pastor and seek is condolence, tell him about her and get his concern and protection, but he is busy and that would be petty of me as well as selfish. Instead, I tell myself why not just stay with the pain, don't take any actions, nurture myself and turn my attention to those I can help and those I care about.

Thanks,
Gab

[Ami]

Dear Gab,
  It does feel like the pain is endless,at times. It really, really does.When I feel this way,I think about eternal life. It is the only thing that touches my deepest despair. Also, I think of Jesus' human side. He experienced all the horrible emotions that I am experiencing---betrayal, abandonment, aloneness.
  I think that the thing that helps me the most ,though, is listening to studies on God's love. I was listening yesterday to Andrew Wommack. (He gives free downloads at his website).He has a "Christian Survival Kit". It has a CD in it about God's love. Andrew was so filled with God's love that he went through Vietnam with no fear. He would have been happy to die at any time and go be with God. This got me out of my "funk"
  However, along with these studies on God's love,I think that we simply have to uncover our pain--layer by layer. When people "get over it" too quickly,I think that they could be "kidding themselves'
  For me, it is one painful layer after another. I do have little breaks of 'peace" after one layer has cleared out.
  I think that we need to "sit" with the pain and let it teach us what it istrying to teach us.Remember that the key to beeing "free" is facing the truth----all of it, as you so wisely said.
   Painful feelings indicate that we have "buttons" which we need to heal or the buttons will be pushed again and again--bleh.
  Share all of it on the board. Don't hold back for fear or embarrassment. I am with you(for one) and many others are too.
                    Love   Ami

PS---Ever since I had that revelation in the gym----I feel like I cannot breathe. It was so big to see one of the keys of codependence------YIKES

[gabbenangel]

Hi Ami,

Something just hit me...Jesus suffered in a way that I cannot even fathom...physical brutality, betrayed by people He loved and was close to, falsely accused, slandered, and convicted of nothing yet He suffered the worst form of persecution there was for the times.. the cross was state sponsored terrorism. I always say to God "Christ, but you do not know my pain"...and NOW, I realize that I did not know His....nevertheless, I suffer and Christ knows.

I too think about eternal life when I am in this suffering pain...it is the hope of the paschal mystery..."new life." Or in our case, a new perspective, we have to give-up vice, which won't fit through the narrow gate and take on virtue so that we can be dressed properly for the banquet.

Gab

[reallyME]

My Nmom is the queen of "withholding".  If you disagree with her or do something she disapproves of, she completely zones you out.  In my Nmom's case, it's not exactly total silent treatment since she will speak-----just not to you.  She'll speak to others in the room or occasionally to the person she is upset with....but it is usually necessary small talk required to get what she wants.

I experienced this very thing from X way back when.  I was a guest in X's home and X talked to the children, the mother, the husband, but totally ignored me for weeks, other than occasionally asking if I wanted to go somewhere with them. 

This is the first time on this v board that i've seen someone tell about this.  I know about being ignored, but nobody ever told about how they were ignored, yet N talked to others in front of them and around them.  Isn't that a WEIRD FEELING???UGH

[Ami]

Dear Gab,
 As I empty out the pain(layers of it), I have room for  God's love. I think that we need a two fold approach. We need to take in God's love. However, we need to face the truth of our lives and empty out the pain and lies.
  Some people try to "perfume" over a swamp. IOW, they just push down the pain with some cliche from the Bible. Then, they are in "denial" of what is within them. I don't think that "pushed away" things stay "down". They come up to haunt us.
  So, I think that you are on the right track with both approaches-----Gab.I really do.
  We have to be careful not to feel guilty for having real pain and real abuse.We have to not feel guilty that we are still hurting even though we have God. Do you know what I mean?                  Ami


(((((((((((((((Gabbenangel))))))))))))))

[gabbenangel]

Hi Ami,

yes, I know what you mean. Just before I read your post I had a thought...it was about growth...and it goes like this:

There will come a time, while in pain and distress, when we can no longer reach out to others, all we will be able to do is look into ourselves and reach up to God.

I like the idea of perfume over rotten substance..it is a good description of what this particular N in my life was like... looks spiritually fit and seems kind and then they forgets to put their perfume on and you accidentally get a whiff at their insides, you smell their toxic layers.

Living a true Christian life means giving up and letting go on so many levels. It means having the faith of a mustard seed and actually DOING the will of the Father, not just pretending like going to Mass or praying when everyone can see you. It mean trying and striving. It means owning my weaknesses and faults, admitting when I am wrong and full of crap. The thing is, that when you exercise courage, you become courageous, when you exercise honesty, you become a person of integrity etc.. But in the beginning, as with any weak muscle, we have to start and persevere.

Love,
Lise

[Ami]

What a pretty name--Lise.
 Just keep facing the truth----of everything---you, your past,your pains,your fears,your needs and God's love---- and we have a promise to be free, Lise.    Love  Ami


(((((((((((((((Lise))))))))))))))))))))))))

[gabbenangel]

Thank you Ami -

Peace and blessings....have a great weekend!

Lise

[Ami]

I am slowly "moving through' the waters of codependency. I think that codependency is the reason that we "got stuck" with an N or can't move away from one.
 I have been making myself observe the "yearnings' that could lead me to an N relationship. I see that I got 'numb"(from my M). I zoned-out b/c there is just so much pain that a person can take before they get numb. When you get numb, I think that you lose the connection with yourself that makes you feel "real'.So,it is like you are "underwater". You don't feel life unless it is at a high volume. That is where addictions come in. Addictions(like codependency and others) have a high enough volume to "make you feel.".
   The answer to overcoming codependency might be to get "real" and feel life on your own. Then, you would not need s/one else to "amplify" life for you.
                             Ami-     

It is similar to what Bill said about not living our own lives so we glom on to s/one else and live vicariously  through them-----this deserves a BLEH- wouldn't you say?                  .                                                                           

[alone48]

Wow, this thread is so thought provoking. I never realized how many other people suffered the silent treatment. My father never spanked us as children, never raised his voice, but if you displeased him he could go weeks on end without speaking to you. Not only the silent treatment, but acted as if you didn't exist. Since my mother died when I was five, this was especially devestating. That's how I became "the good child"> I would do anything not to get the silent treatment.

I think back early on when I met the crazy N. We were discussing positive traits that we believed we had. I had said I thought I had a good sense about people . A look came over his face, which I thought was odd at the time but didn't understand it, and he said that he believed he was very intuitive as to what people needed and expected of him (therein lies the mirroring?)/ Hindsight is so wonderful. I should have run then instead of staying four years.

[Ami]

Dear Alone,
  Your post REALLY helped me. I remember that look of "Wha?"in my M eye's--many ,many times. I wish that I had known about N. My M has been in therapy since I was a little kid and no one ever told her what was wrong with her. She told them.
 That blank look is really scary. It is a "no one is home" look.
  I remember that I told my M how I would love her to send me a piece of jewelery from her so I could wear it and think of her. She bought me a nice necklace that was exactly my favorite thing. HOWEVER,I realized much later that she had to be 'told" to do a loving gesture and tlold every step of the way 'HOW" to perform the loving gesture ---rather than figure it out herself.So, when I got it,it was like I created the whole"loving gesture"myself and she acted it out---bleh.
  This is just one example .
  Thanls Alone. I apppreciate your posts very much.                Love   Ami

((((((((((((Alone48)))))))))00

[alone48]

It also was like a deer caught in the headlights look, "ph my God, I've been found out". I will say he recovered quickly and that is probably why I didn't place more importance on it at the time. It's amazinf noq rhR I  am alone how easy it is to recall so many of the incidents. I now can see things the way "a normal person probably would have". The halo effect is gone and I have taken the blinders off. But as I said before I still have moments or weakness, I just pray for them to pass. Thank you so much for your kind words Ami.

[Ami]

Dear Alone,
  It is 'normal" to still yearn for the person. They filled the emptiness in your heart when they were "good". They promised to love you deeply and unconditionally and it did feel that way, at times. Then, they became your biggest nightmare.
" When he was good, he was very,very good,but when he was bad he was horrid"
 For me, when I fantasize about the good times, I try to put cold water on my face(figuratively) and think about the bad times.It helps.
  During the bad times, we have the self esteem of a dog. We feel so badly about ourselves and it hurts so,so very much. If we start fantasizing about the good times, we will go down a "bad" path. Before we know it, we will be calling or accepting calls. Then, we will start the whole cycle all over again.
I try to remember the  time that my M victimized me and then blamed me for being a victim--bleh. Have one particularly painful time in your mind and revisit it when you get "weak". it might help, Alone.
You sound very insightful . You will get through this.Keep writing and sharing--particularly when you are "weak".               Love  Ami

(((((((((((((Alone)))))))))))))

[wiltay]

It was all smoke scream like you said....   Gab, that was such a poignant 'Freudian slip.'    You ought to read Dr. Grossmans (the sponsor and creator of this very board) "Little Voices,"  if you haven't already.  (It's on this website some where, let me know if you can't find it).  IMO, most if not all of us on this forum are LVs.  It's the only reason we can become infected by Ns as adults.  Also, I'm willing to bet that every single one of us has at least one N parent.  Future Ns and LVs are MADE by Ns.  My F was an N but it took me awhiile to see it. 

Bill