Saturday's session with the pastoral counselor

[LilyCat]

...couldn't think of a great subject line for this.

I am nowhere near finished telling the pastoral couselor the sage. Let's see, I got up to Feb 07 and it went on for another year.

But right away, since it was almost where we left off, I told her about the first time he brought up charges against me, in an "informal" meeting. (I realize I've never given the precise details of what happened ...).

She flipped her lid.

She saw his manipulation and dynamics right away, so we talked about that, but she really gave me a picture as only someone from within the church could do. She said I'd not only been violated by him, but by the church as well and by the two people (my music director and the head of personnel, a lay person). She talked briefly about how this type of situation is emphasized so much in pastoral training now (she not only is an ordained minister, she's taught at three highly respected seminaries), and said the music director and the commission chair both should have had training so that they could deal with this sort of situation. She talked about how the training focuses on going past what the victim might say or do, because often, like me, they protect the abusing pastor.

She was very articulate and very outraged. It really made her crazy. We talked about it quite a bit.

When I told her how he called out to me the Sunday after this meeting, she was ...don't know what the word is, but dumbfounded comes to mind. She said that was a clear sign of manipulation and that he was telling me he had me under his control.

I had used the term psychologically raped, and she said, very seriously, that I was quite right to use it; that I had been, and it was every bit as bad as a rape. She said it's going to take quite awhile to get over this.

I really like this woman. It is so helpful to have someone so articulate, and someone from within the church, particularly from the same denomination. I don't have to explain that part of it to her, and she can explain much to me from the other side. We talked a little bit about the power dynamics of pastors and a case like this.

It was really productive, felt like it went by too fast ... and I've gotten in touch with a whole new level of hurt. I've been very -- increasingly -- weepy ever since. I just want to cry in a very strange and new way. It's not mourning; it's not just hurt; I guess the only way I can describe is to say that it is the crying of one who has been raped. I'm feeling that at such a deep level. Maybe not as acutely or as powerfully as in the months after the first round happened, but in a different way. Very hard to explain.

Anyway, I am so glad I found her. We aren't really into the healing part yet, still telling the story, but I'm getting good stuff from her nonetheless. It is so great to have found someone who exactlly, exactly gets it. (My regular therapist does, but he doesn't have the spiritual background which is so important.)

So, it's very hard, but I know I have to do this. Feeling pretty bad all weekend and today.

Good news, though -- my insurance is paying for her! (Half.)

[LilyCat]

PS -- she said the violations by music director and personnel chair -- and thus, church -- came because they didn't advocate for me; that they should have looked past the surface to see what was really going on.

She was livid about the way that it was set up; said that the personnel chair should have first talked to me before we ever even called a meeting; and that it should have been dealt with in such a different way.

I feel bad about her saying the music director had been a part of this (I told her he remained neutral and didn't say too much); he's been a very good friend for 30 years, and he really hit it out of the ballpark for me during Round 2 of the charges. So maybe when we get to that part we can readjust her position. I hope so.

I was glad to hear her say that about the commission chair, though. She actually is a pretty nice woman, but I've hated her ever since this meeting (never even knew she existed before it, had never met her). I had told pastor this in the letter from which he made his crazy charges; he'd said that I'd made "terrorist threats" against him and her. (This is so totally insane and a sign of his paranoia, that I can't begin to tell you...)

Anyway, I've felt bad about what I've said about her, but now I feel justified, even though she was clearly manipulated by the pastor. Phew.

[Gaining Strength]

What great news Lily Cat.  I 'm so glad for you.

Sounds like she confirmed and affirmed everything you experienced and help you see that you were not responsible and experienced harrowing abuse.  So glad you found her.

I had used the term psychologically raped, and she said, very seriously, that I was quite right to use it; that I had been, and it was every bit as bad as a rape. She said it's going to take quite awhile to get over this.

It may take time but you are on a healing course and that is the great news.

[LilyCat]

Thanks, SS. I really appreciate the encouragement.

[Leah]

Wonderful ((( Lily Cat )))


I had used the term psychologically raped, and she said, very seriously, that I was quite right to use it; that I had been, and it was every bit as bad as a rape. She said it's going to take quite awhile to get over this.

I have used this term, psychologically raped / emotionally raped ....... the book "Emotional Rape Syndrome" by Michael Fox ......... was an enormous help during my learning, understanding, and healing process.

Emotional Rape / Emotional Abuse is a complete inner violation -- intrusiveness by an emotional manipulator.


So glad to know that you are going to be able to continue with your pastoral counsellor.


Love, Leah

[LilyCat]

Thanks, Leah. That sounds like a great book -- I'm going to look for it.

Is that the same Michael Fox who wrote The Coming of the Cosmic Christ? (Probably not.)

[Leah]

Thanks, Leah. That sounds like a great book -- I'm going to look for it.

Is that the same Michael Fox who wrote The Coming of the Cosmic Christ? (Probably not.)

No, LilyCat ........ not the same person ........... Michael Fox Ph.D - Emotional Rape Syndrome


The book you mention is written by a Matthew Fox .... looked it up on amazon.com


Leah x

[LilyCat]

Oh right, Leah. Been awhile since I looked at it. Well, at least I didn't ask if it was Michael J Fox, the actor!!!

[sKePTiKal]

Lily...

in some ways, simply telling your story to someone who cares, whounderstands the criteria of behavior expected from the church and it's personnel is HEALING. She's validating your very real, very normal human emotional reactions to the situation. I've found that once I am really HEARD, and the story's told in full, much of the pain and other emotions lifts or drifts away.

Sure, there's more work to do! And maybe specific things to help heal... but I believe that for some of us, just telling the story to someone knowledgeable and compassionate seems to be the single-most important "therapy".

[LilyCat]

Phoenix,

I think you are very correct in that. At first I was in a hurry to get through the whole story and done with it in 4 sessions (what she initially suggest clients do, then re-evaluate), in great part because it is very expensive.

But then I realized no, I need to slow down and take as long as it takes to go through the whole fifteen months with him; that, as you say, there is tremendous value in simply telling the experience. I'm going to relish it. (The telling of it, not the experience.)

And, as you say, when we talked about the actual meeting in which he first initiated charges, it was of great help to speak with her and get her insight. She has the experience and knowledge and credentials to bring the church into it. She not only completely gets the power dynamics and what he should or should not have been doing, and the church structure and organization and approach to things, but because of her background she also has the authority to hold the church accountable, which she did on Saturday. It was very helpful. When she said I not only had been violated by him, but by my church (unknowingly; he manipulated the people involved and I gave him the silver platter to do it with), that hit home very deeply. I hadn't thought of it in that way before.

All that is something a regular therapist can't do.

I have a lot of spiritual questions for her, too, and am looking forward to getting into that end of things.

Anyway, thank you so much, Phoenix. You have such a gentle and soothing tone to your writing; it's not just what you say that helps, but how you say it. Thank you again. Will keep you posted! Can't wait until I get to the part about him kissing me at church -- AND the other woman AND the illegimate child. She's going to need therapy by the time this is all over!

xoxo

Lily

[LilyCat]

[color=beige]"After the first meeting he held to discuss my "harassment," (i.e., he was harassing me, in effect), I was really confused and didn't know what was up because I felt so violated. In all the craziness and confusion, I found myself asking him to forgive me, and wanting his forgiveness -- when in fact he had horribly abused me. I already knew about reaction formations at the time, and I knew what I was doing while I was doing it -- so it was interesting to watch it unfold. I knew what I was doing yet I couldn't stop it. I was full of rage at him but couldn't handle it, so I did this instead."[/color]

Ugh!!! I just posted this excerpt in Izzy's threat about her therapist, and it then made me tremble and a little sick to my stomach. On Saturday she (pastoral counselor) spelled out more specifically his acts of control and power ... and as I wrote this, I realized that my asking him for forgiveness was not just turning rage into something else, it was submission. It was feeling dominated and controlled by him, and really not asking so much for forgiveness, as leniency. Asking that he, in effect, continue to include me in his life.

Oh, that just makes me so sick. And disheartened. The seeking forgiveness bit is actually a huge reaction to his control and intimidation and manipulation and power moves.

Oh. (To repeat myself...) See? This is what happens. I start looking back at it and it still brings up new and deeper feelings. It's the power thing. As I become more aware of how it was his primary motivation and how he used it on me, it makes me sick. I hurt, terribly. And sometimes shake. (Post traumatic stress disorder). And sometimes get very very angry.

Groan. There's a lot to work out with this. She's right. It's going to take some time to work through it.

I hate him! (Not really.) He had no right to do this to me. He's affected my trust in my long-term therapist, with authority figures ... I have almost no belief in pastors any more ... and he's really impinged my ability to trust men, which was bad before all this happened.

I am so angry at him. And I feel sort of like a deer caught in headlights -- because I just can't believe this man that I knew and trusted for 10 years, and was so fond of, did this to me, and that I don't matter a speck to him. I'm just a piece of dust or a cat toy that he played with.

Gives me shivers.

That I handed myself to him on a silver platter -- gave him SO much material (told him about my vulnerabilities) to use against me makes me even sicker. I did it to myself.

Nonetheless, he was the professional. He was supposed to uphold his position, and instead he used it.

Ick.

[Ami]

Dear Lily
 I hear your pain about your own naivte. It really, really hurts. Part of what our N parents did was to MAKE us serve them . It was close to criminal when WE had a need such as the need for our own respect.
 Lily, I get everyone on the board understands the feeling of being fooled and loving s/one"too much", to our own detriment, to our own destruction.
 My heart hurts for you b/c I have seen how I am like a little abused puppy. I will do anything  for a drop of love.
 You are not alone. I understand and I am sure most people ,on here, do ,too     Love   Ami

((((((((((Lilly)))))))))))

[LilyCat]

Thanks, Ami. That's very sweet.