Not Seeing Filth??????

[gratitude28]

My sister seems to be coming out of denial. She told me she had lunch with Dad one day and they talked about how filthy my parents' house is. Apparently, it is even worse than I have seen - and that was pretty bad. So we are talking the kind of house where a health inspector would take out the animals and condemn it. This year my Dad got pneumonia, and it is obvious the house contributes in large part to him getting sick. My Dad told my sister that when my mother "retired" she did so, saying that she wanted to be able to take care of the house and things. Of course she does none of that. My sister is worried now about having her baby and taking it to that house (I know how she feels - I went through it when my kids were little).
My sister asked, "Do you think she can somehow not see the dirt and grime?" Seriously. Can any of you explain this???? How can you live in a house full of hair and animal vomit and dust and grease? Does anyone here have any explanation???? I am at a loss.
Love, Beth

[Hopalong]

Beth...

Have you ever explored whether there is any sort of health department or elderly social services intervention you could instigate?

I am so sorry.

love,
Hops

[Izzy_*now*]

Hi Beth

To answer your question, ......to me it appears like total denial and an "I don't care + lazy+ outright depression + who's going to come anyway + I can do whatever I want to do + i don't have to do things to appease anybody + my girls hate me + so what the hell + it ain't a crime + if it's dirty enough they won't come+ if they love me they will clean it for me + anything else that is totally crazy!

That's is so sad!

Izzy

[Ami]

Dear Beth
 I saw s/one on Oprah who had a house like that(worse, probably). It was emotional issues, as you probably know. I can be messy,but never went down the animal arena.          Ami

[Hopalong]

Hoarding is a mental illness.

That's why I was thinking of a social services intervention...

love to you Beth,

Hops

[gratitude28]

Thanks guys.
I think out of what you listed, Izzy, there is: people don't like me for how I keep house. I only have people over when they are invited and I can clean it then (hah). Total laziness.
If anyone starts to help her clean, she gets really upset. My sister keeps trying to find a way to "help" and I have explained it just won't happen. She will never relinquish that "control" and my dad is too embarrassed to get help. He told my sister he is so tired from working and he just can't do it (besides I know that my mother won't let him do anything either).
Yes, Ami, definitely emotional issues - and I have read there is some OC associated with hoarding.
Gosh, Hops, I just don't know if we could have any kind of help for them. I think my dad would fall apart from the embarrassment. He is a neat-freak and has his little clean spots in the house, but they are being encroached upon as the mess grows.
I wish I had an answer.
Love, Beth

[Izzy_*now*]

Hi Beth

I have a number of people who like me, but one problem is that I smoke...............................so many allergies these days that they cannot stop in for a minute, or come in and go straight to the balcony.........................so I sometimes meet them downstairs in the lobby and that is just not cozy... comfy.

BUT.....
I still smoke and I need the comfort, because I have NO comfort otherwise,....no one who touches, no one who hugs, ...NO ONE,,,,and a cig is my comfort. I'm not complaining here...I just had to go back a bit and say why!

Now I expect that sounds sad, and it is, but I have learned to put myself into my own shoes and live with it!

I have a cleaning person coming on Thursday. She will likely say--------"This looks OK. What should I do?..... except she already knows about my ceiling liight fixtures.-----Now if I work really hard, I can have the place spotless before she comes!!!!![/i]

Ain't that the way???? Well--before this episode of my broken leg and the weakness that came from it, I could scoot out of my chair to the floor and clean beneath the sink (messy spot.) Now I can't because once on the floor, I cannot get back up to the chair.

But in the chair I can dust and polish and clean at my eye level, so a Hired Cleaner does 'above and below' now!

(There was a time when I was about 32 yrs. old and worked and had a gal come in once a week. I was feeling cheated as she appeared lazy. Paralyzed legs and all I crawled up onto the counter, and grabbed things so I could stand straight and see the top of my cabinets. I wrote my name in the dust.

Then, I was there and asked her to check up there and she felt awful...I had her clean that day but she was fired at the end!

Well that's my story and I'm stickin' to it!
I was never that messy with my cleaning when I was a teenager.

Grouchy
Izzy

[gratitude28]

Iz,
I always cleaned before I had someone come to clean, too. Kind of silly since that was the point in having the person come Wow, I can't believe how you got around to clean even hard-to-get-to spots. You are a super woman!!

CB,
It is just so hard to deal with. As a child I was devastatingly embarrassed. My husband does not ever want to go there again, but my dad would be so sad if we did not stay there (we are supposed to also have our heads in the sand). I have avoided the whole thing for a long time because we don't have the money to go up there right now anyways. But my parents have a ton of animals, and when they go out of town, they have to get someone to watch them. The last person was absolutely disgusted (my dad told my sister) and will not come back. NM just makes up an excuse about why they don't want to house sit and goes on like everything is normal. NM can come to my house and spot a speck of dust in the sink. But she can't see that there is a half-inch of dirt on the corners of her kitchen floor. I know there are people who go the other way (and I know they are just as sick, but somehow it bothers me less that my family's brand of craziness). I think part of her 'not seeing' is that she buys new stuff every day and thinks that people come in and see her "things" and are jealous and that takes precedence over everything else.

Love, Beth

[Ami]

Dear Beth
 Your last post touched me . I am going through a similar thing with my parents,but over different issues.  I could never even KNOW  my story, to myself, b/c it was so forbidden to even think the truth.
 I have grieved for several months . I have felt the pain that I repressed ,as a child. The pain can kill a child ,so they repress the feelings. I had memories,but they did not have feelings.
 I would not have been abused in a long term marriage and have lost my son ,if I had any family refuge(even emotional)
 I see that my F has a nice guy personna ,but does not care very much .
 He is cold,inside and as I got more truthful, the real him came out.
 My M, as an N, wanted to throw her hate on me b/c she finally had a weak vulnerable person,who had to take it.
 They did not care what I endured b/c they never cared about me.
       Ami

[Gaining Strength]

Beth - does your mother display signs of OCD?  What you are describing sounds like an outcome of OCD to me.  Is there hoarding as well?

[gratitude28]

Ami,
You really have been through too much. I hope you can continue to move away from harms you and become stronger. It is so hard to identify feelings and emotions for us, especially when we were never allowed them.

SS,
Yes, she hoards in a HUGE way. Their basement is so filled with things that they have no idea what is down there. Likewise, they have every magazine they ever bought, toys from when we were kids, makeup my mother bought years ago.

[Gaining Strength]

Beth - try out this site from Mayo Clinic for helpful information:

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/hoarding/DS00966

[Izzy_*now*]

Hi Beth,
My cleaning lady comes tomorrow evening, after her work.

I realize that whenever I had the idea of calling someone, and begun the "cleaning for the cleaning lady" process, I did it all (that I could and left the rest) and was 'satisfied' enough not to call someone.

This time, she sees it as is! Her name is 'Twila'......  'Catherine Twila _____'

All I have done was 1.) pack one more kitchen garbage into the green bag and will take it out tomorrow: 2.) I started another green bag from my bedroom and desk waste basket....all 'dry' stuff': 3.) I finally found a container that looks good (came from Swiss Chalet with chicken, mashed potatoes and separate containers with gravy and vegetables included) and put my makeup utensils in it, as my vanity was strewn with pencils and lipsticks. etc. plus bobby pins.

So everything else is all the same as from my last cleaning of, and at this point I wouldn't be ashamed to have someone stop by for a short visit.

I am thinking of her as being someone who will move a few things so that my not being able to stand anymore will be less of a nuisance. I will tell her the same so that if I never call her again, she won't feel....."I worked liked a  bi*ch for that crazy woman and the Bi*ch never called me again!

After this I expect I can try to sell a pink 2-drawer filing cabinet, a 2 cup coffee maker I never use, and a mixer, (on craiglist) as I don't use it either. I think the test is supposed to be if you don't use something for a year, you don't need it. It's been SIX years for the appliances, and when she puts my folders from there to my big desk (room now with DVDs gone)...more space inside bedroom closet too.

That doesn't mean that I don't keep looking around to see if there is something else I ought to do.

xx
Izzy

When she leaves it will all look the same except cleaner. Then a coup;e of years down the line I will call her or someone else again!

Love
Izzy

[gratitude28]

SS,
That is an awesome link. I am going to pass it along to my sister as well. It doesn't change the problem, but it does help with understanding it.

Izzy,
You are doing what meets your needs, and that is great. I also do the "year" test, although I have a few things that certainly haven't been used for more than a year. I guess I retain a bit of nostalgia (especially for things I bought in other countries). I wonder if that nostalgia is what makes the hoarders hang on - that they think it will somehow bring the good feeling (possible an imagined feeling ) back. Does that make any sense???

Love, Beth

[Overcomer]

My husband lived in a new home when I met him....sparsely decorated...........neat.......but filthy.  Rings in the toilet.  STove thick with grease.  Floors dirty....he does not see filth......his new truck is filthy.  He smokes in it and there are ashes EVERYWHERE.....the windows are thick with smoke.  And this is REALLY gross....he just doesn't wipe himself well...........his is skid mark guy!!  This makes me not like him even more because I think his hygiene is not good.  All around filthy.  I guess his mom was a neat freak so he rebels that way........in ways I realize he is stuck.......

My mom and dad....beautiful home but stacks in certain places.  Most of the house if fine but the kitchen and laundry room have stacks of stuff and the garage.....mom is kind of a hoarder.  They have a VHS circa first generation...............time to sell at a garage sale or throw it away.......but they store it!