Need some advice

[Gaining Strength]

I have a local college student living with my son and me.  He is very nice and no problem.  He eats dinner with us 3 or 4 nights and has been nice to have around for my son - to a degree.

We met last spring when I was looking for someone to pick my son up from school a couple of days a week and help with homework.  He answered the ad immediately but was not able to help us out at that time because of a previous commitment. I hired another student at that time.

The plan when he came to live with us was that he would help out on Tuesdays and maybe other days if needed.  As it turns out I simply don't have the money to pay for much help at all.

The problem I am having is this - he comes in an out without much notice.  And often comes in and leaves while talking on the cell phone.  For instance it is 10pm on a Sunday night and he just walked down the stairs on the cell phone and walked straight out of the door.  I know he is unaware of how rude it is to walk through someone's house talking on the phone but the other issue is that I have spoken to him about letting me know what time he is coming in at night so that when I hear a door open I know who it is.

When my son and I got home this evening he was outside at his car - but I didn't see him.  He did n't speak.  When he comes down in the morning and walks right past us on his way out of the door, he doesn't speak - not "hello", "good morning", not anything.  A couple of nights ago I was cooking and talking with my son when he walked in the door while talking on the phone and just sat down right in the room talking on the phone while my child and I were talking, fixing dinner and doing homework.

I definitely need to say something but I haven't figured out the best way to approach it.  It seems so obvious to me that it is rude to walk into a house while you are on the phone and just keep going - not stopping or speaking. 

Does anyone have any suggestions?

[Ami]

Dear SS
 My take on it is that the "rules" are not defined. What do you want from him? What are you offering him? Is he a boarder, a  family member, a person you hired to do a service?
 He seems like he is a decent person. It might help to discuss what you plan to give him and what you need from him, in specific terms.   
          Ami

[Izzy_*now*]

hi SS
I agree with Ami in the sense that you haven't explained the boundaries, the manners.

I would suggest no cell phone in a room where others are...i.e. use it in his room, but if it rings while with you to go to another room to answer and talk.

As you said, your son might pick up the bad habits, and note that you allowed someone else to do what he wants to do--the role mode part, and that is the one that will be the easist to explain...that you don't want your son to see this guy's habits and you said nothing.

I too would be interested in the other points of interest.
He has his own room?
Does he pay rent?
Is he 'clean' in the bathroom?
Is he paid 'in kind' for the tutoring he does?
Therefore is anything 'free'?
You cook his meals?
Is he allowed all over the house?

If he pays you for his part, and you pay him for your part might be a better way to transact than trading/deductin.

Just thinking...

Izzy

EDIT in} I rented my daughter's room to a college student and with my lack of boundaries, he 'owned' the TV. I had no proof (inventory book) but I think he ate some of my food, too.

[gratitude28]

Yes, I think Ami nailed it. He may feel it is just like a dorm room, and he might be enjoying his freedom from home, so sees this as 'his" place. I guess I would explain to him that you see your agreement a bit differently. I would tell him that you have respect for him for choosing to become educated. I would explain that this is the reason you hoped he might be able to set a good example for your son as to how a real man behaves. However, you are not a dorm residential assistant, and he is living in a family home, so you expect him to greet you and to avoid using the cell phone in front of you (and others) as it is rude. I am guessing this young man has not been taught proper manners at home, so you will be doing him a favor. Employers expect manners, too, he will need to know.

[Gaining Strength]

Let me try and give a little more detail and be more specific on the type of advice I am looking for.

I haven't taken the time to write out all the points of our agreement and relationship b/c it is immaterial to the one issue at hand.  The nature of the relationship or agreement is really beside the point.  I'm simply saying that I have an issue about this young man walking in and out of the house while on the cell phone.  It's rude and I need to address it with him.  

What I am looking for is some suggestions about how to address it with him.

I'm not looking for advice about a broader issue of rules and boundaries.  I've already taken care of that.  I'm simply asking for suggestions on a very specific issue - cell phone usage.

[Gaining Strength]

Gratitude - You have got the point when you write:
he is living in a family home, so you expect him to greet you and to avoid using the cell phone in front of you (and others) as it is rude. I am guessing this young man has not been taught proper manners at home, so you will be doing him a favor. Employers expect manners, too, he will need to know.
This certainly reflects my feelings but I would like to find a way to convey this message without the judgment in it.  I don't want to use the word "rude" for instance nor the word "manners".  For the most part his is very polite.  He comes from a very difficult background, was raised by his grandparents.  He is on full scholarship and does an incredible job of finding work and getting involved with boyscouts and getting involved with his church.  I do want to point out that walking in and out of the house while on the cell phone is rude without using that word. 

It is so obvious to me that such behavior is unacceptable and that is why I don't know how to politely and non-confrontationally address it with a thoughtful young person who is oblivious to it.

[ann3]

SS,

I agree with what you're saying & I agree with what others have posted, and, IMO, I feel you are over-thinking it.  IMO, you're doubting yourself because you feel he's rude, but you don't want to use the word "rude".  Why not?  "Rude" describes how you feel & it's not a bad word and based on what you've described, he is being rude.  So, what is your fear of the word?  I don't see a problem with the word.

SS, you are a gentle, sensitive person.  How about taking 30 minutes, write down your thoughts, your speech/presentation and then speak to him.

IMO, if you don't say how you feel  ("I feel yr being rude, insensitive/disresepctful when you..."), then you are not being true to yourself, not owning your truth.  I know you will not be mean to him, but you will express your feelings in a calm/compassionate way.

However, be prepared that he may move out (which may be a good thing) & you may need to find a new student.

SS, I think this is a really good learning experience for you.  You previously mentioned that the young man who was your son's "big Brother" was also "rude" to you, disrespectful in that he failed yo give you advanced notice, right?  So, I see a pattern here.

Let me go a bit farther, but with love:  We ACONS have been raised to be doormats.  Do you feel that you're experiencing a bit of doormatitis with this kid?  If yes, then, IMO,  telling him how you feel & setting boundaries in a calm, compassionate manner is one of the best growth experiences for you at this time.

xoxo,
ann

[Gaining Strength]

I'm not doing a good job in conveying my point. 

I definitely have an issue with the cell phone situation but it is just a minor point that needs some adjustment.

I don't want to use the word "rude" because it is an emotionally loaded word that works against my purpose here. It gets ME roiled up and I don't want to be irritated when I talk to him. He is not a rude person and is not aware of how his behavior affects me.    Any issues I have raised to date he has  responded to quickly.  I am trying to figure out a way to  ask him in a polite, kind, nurturing, supportive way.

I do know that we can be in the habit of being doormats and it is definitely worth looking out for.  I don't think that is the case here however.  In fact, I'm trying to find the right way to take care of my needs in this situation and I actually did take care of myself with the Big Brother issue. In that case the young man was assigned to us and after 3 or 4 outings I found his behavior unacceptable and asked for a replacement.  I actually felt very competent in taking care of myself and my son in that case.  My biggest frustration with the Big Brother was that the person at the organization kept balking at replacing the guy.  Now that was frustrating and I lost my cool in dealing with him but eventually did get a termination of the first assignment.  I don't feel like I was a doormat in that situation at all. 


telling him how you feel & setting boundaries in a calm, compassionate manner is one of the best growth experiences for you at this time.
That's exactly what I was thinking and hoping for some specific suggestions.

[debkor]

Hey SS,

Oh boy this is right up my alley and with my own kids.  Are they Rude, they sure are.   My D will come through the door turning the door knob, carrying books, and the cell phone growing off the side of her head, just yakking away.  Eyes down trying to balance and keep everything from falling on the floor catch a spot to throw her bag on not even aware that there a big human standing there that looks like her mother, for she is oblivious, like you say to any other thing but her conversation.   Sooooo...what do I do....I do a BIG hello my day was good thanks for asking and how are you.... And the shock! What?  or an   I'm on the phone mom...with shock, an attitude, and a wake up....She was being rude.  She knows it when earth gets in contact with whatever space they are into.  and gets embarrassed but  *gets the hint*.  They really don't like being rude or get called on it either.

She would never ever do this in someone else's home.  But this on is hers and sometimes they forget or don't pay attention to others..until...you let them know...it's rude to not even say hello.

As far as the coming home and calling me when.  No I don't do that SS.  She is in her 20's and she does not have to let me what time she will be home because sometimes she does not know.  She is an Adult.  Now if she was to not come home.  Stay out at her friends then she has to give me the courtesy of a call. 

She has also dropped yakking away while I was doing homework with my son and it was really annoying.  I stopped and said...excuse me can you take your conversation in your room it's distracting me with what I was doing.  Off she went..with an attitude..till she came out later....she knew it was rude.     Sometimes you just have to Right in your Face....HELLO....GOODBYE.....you have a growth on your ear...your phone....Earth to You...Earth calling....

Sorry SS....ah...college kids..and those damn phones..

Good Luck...maybe give the *hint* before the talk may work...let him figure it out for himself that he is being rude.


Love
Deb

[Hopalong]

Goody. Haven't had a chance to write one of my fantasy dialogues in ages.
Hope you'll tolerate this one, dear SS, and toss what's useless!

" Hi Joe, do you have a minute?
Sit with me for a sec, I want to tell you about something.

I know this is generational, and I definitely know what a nice young man you are.
I'm really pleased you're in our home, and I think it's going to be a good thing for all of us.
But there's one small thing I need you to change. It may surprise you a little, but I know you can handle it.

It may seem silly, because I know for your generation it's probably never an issue...but I need to let you know that I really don't want you to walk in or out of the house while talking on your cell. Or into a room. When you make or receive a call, I'd like you to step into another room or outside.

And when you come through the house, in or out, say Hello! Just Hi and zoom on by, that's good enough.

The phone thing and the greeting thing may be old fashioned, but for me, they're essential courtesies.

That's it! I just needed to let you know that I want you to do that. Okay by you?

Thanks!"

[Gaining Strength]

Thanks Debkor and Hops - I can do both of those.  I'm sure he will respond well.  Early on I noticed that the carpet on the stairs was taking a toll.  I asked him to take his shoes off when he walks in the house.  He never needed a reminder.  I'm sure he will respond well to kind words on this issue.

[ann3]

Wow, Hops, that's good.

It's calm, compassionate, non-jgdmntal, clear, to the point & assertive.

SS, I also am learning, trying, to ask for what I want in a calm, compassionate, non-jgdmntal, clear, to the point & assertive manner.

I think Hops nailed it.

Good luck, SS.

[gratitude28]

Sorry SS, I got cut off while I was writing and couldn't get back to you right away.
I don't think you have to hurt his feelings or be confrontational. Ho wabout something like this:

Jim, I am so glad you are here to be a good role model for Johnny. He gets to see a person who is working towards a goal and becoming a positive influence to people all around him. Sometimes it hurts our feelings when you breeze through and don't say hello or goodbye. We are used to greeting one another in the house. If you don't mind, could you also limit phone calls to when you are not running through the house? We are really happy to have you here and want to let you have your own space, but it would be nice if we could all set some rules - us too. Is there anything we can do to make you more comfortable?

Then you could open it for discussion and it doesn't seem an attack on character or anything of the sort. Sorry if I copied what someone else had to say - didn't get to read through the replies yet. Today has been a Monday of all Mondays for me.

Love, Beth

[Gaining Strength]

Thanks Ann, Grat and Ami.  I think I'll have a chance to talk to him tomorrow.  I'm sure he will be glad to comply.  I was really more concerned about how to approach it kindly and not reactively.  These suggestions are helpful and I will give it a whirl.

[teartracks]

Hi SS,

I haven't read the entire thread.   I think Hops offered up a first rate model for a dialogue between the two of you.  Maybe you could punctuate it by telling him that unless it is God caling.  he should excuse himself and do his phoning out of the hearing of you and your son.   

tt