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chocolate and the delete button and Ns lack of remorse

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flower:
Hi everyone,

 Just in case anyone is curious,  I haven't gone off the deep end nor am I afraid of posters or trolls nor have my feelings been irrepairably hurt.  I thank the poster who cared enough to ask me. Hugs (((caring board member))))  :)

 I had some strong  chocolate, a delete button and felt like moving on in my process of healing. I saved my threads and they might have been saved by others which is okay, but the whole process of deleting was cathartic.  I'm  moving on from where I was and still want to be mutually supportive, but I need to put some clothes on my soul.  :lol:


By chance if some registered user that was involved in a particular thread didn't get a chance to see or read a response I sent to them in particular I will try to pm the specific post to them, if they so desire.


Last night I got to thinking about remorse and the N. Do Ns feel remorse  *ever* in their lives - even as a child? Is there some time that they make a conscious decision to turn off their empathy or  has it never developed?  :?: Or were they just not interested?  Persons with Aspergers/high functioning autism have problems with empathy and interpersonal behavior but can also be very moral and ethical and are willing to learn. What gives the N the excuse to not try or care.  Smells suspicious  to me. Like Ns are persons with Aspergers gone bad.

My nmom said a odd thing to me once. She gave me no religious training. But once she said in a sassy tone for whatever reason I can't remember  - it seemed off the wall, "I used to save up all my sins during the day and confess them at night."  Of course she has never admitted to wrong doing though in real life.  

 Makes me wonder if there  are two roads a person can take who didn't get the empathy thing. They can either obsess on train schedules or computers and master "things' and be a nerd or they can obsess on getting their way and putting themselves first and master maniputation  and be a bully.

flower with chocolate stains on her metal petals

Anonymous:

--- Quote from: flower ---Last night I got to thinking about remorse and the N. Do Ns feel remorse  *ever* in their lives - even as a child? Is there some time that they make a conscious decision to turn off their empathy or  has it never developed?  :?: Or were they just not interested?  Persons with Aspergers/high functioning autism have problems with empathy and interpersonal behavior but can also be very moral and ethical and are willing to learn. What gives the N the excuse to not try or care.  Smells suspicious  to me. Like Ns are persons with Aspergers gone bad.
--- End quote ---


The N was being abused/traumatized as a child so they were mainly trying to survive. They didn't learn the right kind of empathy but they learned how to 'understand' people in order to get supplies. They didn't think there was anything available to them beyond supplies. If they turned off their empathy it was for survival purposes. The N is a sick person who desperately needs help. Unfortunately they are the least likely to seek it. And they probably couldn't be helped much.




--- Quote ---My nmom said a odd thing to me once. She gave me no religious training. But once she said in a sassy tone for whatever reason I can't remember  - it seemed off the wall, "I used to save up all my sins during the day and confess them at night."  Of course she has never admitted to wrong doing though in real life.
--- End quote ---


My guess is that she was trying to manipulate God, who was like an abusive parent to her.



--- Quote ---Makes me wonder if there  are two roads a person can take who didn't get the empathy thing. They can either obsess on train schedules or computers and master "things' and be a nerd or they can obsess on getting their way and putting themselves first and master maniputation  and be a bully.
--- End quote ---


I don't think it's that simple but you are right in that people have different survival and adaptation behaviors.

bunny

Singer:
Hi Flower,

I can relate to your sense of moving on. I had a "moment of truth" of sorts a couple months ago and stopped posting for awhile; had to crawl into a mental hidey-hole and sort some things out.

I don't believe my NMother ever felt remorse for anything, even as a child, which is kind of interesting now that you've brought it up. She tells stories about her childhood and being reprimanded by teachers for making fun of children of backgrounds different than hers. But the point of the stories were to demonstrate how "spirited" she was and how she stood up to those who reprimanded her. She truly believes to this day that her superiority to those children was obvious and the teachers were denying it out of political correctness (although it probably wasn't called that in the 1930's), or stubbornness.

I think her family history might have contributed to her lack of empathy, both by way of genetics and because the history was based on tales of former grandeur and wealth lost to the unscrupulous. Failure was always blamed on outside forces; and on those who were evil and jealous. Which was usually anyone other than the person who was telling the tale. They had no loyalty to each other most of all.

Which makes me wonder why I'm here telling tales on them.

Aaacccckkk....back to my hiding place!

Singer

Anonymous:
Interesting subject

On remorse... I have seen my N feel what appears to be remorse.  But it is not out of empathy to those he hurt.  It is remorse because a moment of honesty damaged his perfect self image.  He realized he acted horribly, and was more concerned with the fact that he acted like his father =bad than with the fact he hurt his wife.  In other occasians, he appears remorseful because he has lost his N supply.  He feels a desparate need to get it back.

I don't know if my H feels empathy. Sometimes his motives are still quite hidden to me. He can say the right words, even reflect my feelings (as I have trained him to do).  My own requests have made it more difficult for me to detect motives.  I am in a place right now where I am not sure how much motives even matter, if behavior actually changes for the long term.

On Autism... interesting you should mention it.  When I first began describing my husband's behavior to my therapist, she said this was highly autistic. N does not have any form of autism that we know of. However, narcissistic behavior is vary self-involved, thus having characteristics of autism.  

Thanks Flower for the interesting thread

Moonflower:
....

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