Voicelessness and Emotional Survival > Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board

Going NC, at least for a while

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Redhead Erin:
Yes, I think LC is the way to go.  I am trying to get my horrible crippling mortgage restructured.  I know the law is on my side, but also I know how long that can take.  Until it comes through, I still can do with a little financial training wheels.  Honestly, she uses me so badly, and treats me and Ted just like hired help, I no longer feel bad about getting "paid" in the form of allowance, groceries, gas money, or Kiddo's college fund payments.  But I am sick and tired of getting jerked around. 

I occasionally have clients and photographers who cross my boundaries, get on my nerves, and other wise drive me batty.  Funny thing is, I have NO PROBLEMS saying, "I am not happy with your behavior.  If you don't change your behavior, I will leave."  So I have told myself that as long as a need to see her (because she has the money) and she insists on treating us with less consideration than she treats her house cleaner or lawn service, then I should treat her just as I do any client.  With customers, photographers, and clients, I outline my expectations (I don't care if they are listening; I feel I have done my part), I stick to my expectations (And if I make any concession I have already planned it in advance) and I ALWAYS get paid.

This would be a really, really great way to manage this situation, if only the stakes weren't so emotionally high.

sKePTiKal:
"... if only the stakes weren't so emotionally high"...

This is something that you, yourself, can control you know. It takes practice, effort, work - and the kind of forethought that you've put into deciding how you would treat your mom, if she were just another client. We all make mistakes in this area - even after years of practice - but it's still worth the effort for each and every success one experiences.

Now, ahem! For a slightly cheeky observation:

why should a woman who's obviously bordering on - if not completely - abusive to you... regardless of BIO-relationship... be treated any differently (or affect you so deeply) than any almost-stranger client? It's not like you have a responsibility to maintain the appearances of a relationship, when the cost to you is higher than you can or are willing to bear, correct?

That said: this is a really dicey topic - a den full of snakes, emotionally - and of the people I know who've gone through that den, we all have chosen different "terms" or conditions of "truce". What ends up in those terms, I guess, is what you can live with... so there's no one right answer for everyone. I made my cheeky observation only to give you another way to think about it... not to suggest that it's "the one" answer for you. You'll find your own...

... and from your last post, it seems you're pretty well on your way!

Redhead Erin:
The stakes are so high because she is SO GOOD at making me feel guilty.  Hell, after 40+ years of training, she should have accomplished something . . . .

The big theme in my childhood was that I had no right to stand up for myself. Not to her or any one else.  Two of my strongest memories form childhood were 1)a paper-reut customer turned two big dogs on me and stood laughing in his doorway while I beat them off with newspapers, and I got in trouble for calling the police and 2) after I had lost a bunch of weight on some diet and looked really good, I was horribly berated and shamed for wanting an egg and toast for breakfast on Easter morning, instead of eating a bunch of sticky pastries with her.

As a dancer, one of my biggest breakthroughs and the key to my ability to keep working, day after day, year after year, is my ability to protect myself, both physically and emotionally.  I remember as a little girl watching my Grandmother handle people.  She never raised her voice, never swore, and always got her way.  She simply laid out her expectations and insisted they would be met.  I handle clients the same way.  It works like a charm. 

It is harder with my mother because
1) she is my mother. You aren't supposed to treat your mother like a client.
2) She knows me really well and is really really super-extra good at pushing my buttons
3) years of conditioning have made me so I now regularly abuse myself and slip into self-loathing mode as soon as I see her or hear her voice.
4) I have been trying for years to treat her with "Christian Charity" and kindness, because I believe that is the right way to treat people.  In a way, it is hard to change over to a "businesslike" relationship because it violates one of MY personal moral standards
5) it is hard to just give up.
6) I am terrified of my son treating me like that in my old age.  After all, what kind of example am I setting for him?
7) And yes, for some bizarre reason, I feel I DO have some sort of obligation to her, although I cannot understand why.

In short, she has trained me well.  Shoot, and I thought she was no good at discipline. 

Hopalong:
I understand your list, Erin--almost every one spoke to me personally, reminded me of the decade with my mother and how at times it was realizing I was a frog in a pot of slowly-heating water, and other times, Cinderella, and other times, a damaged and manipulated child, and other times--the grownup in the room.
Add in the hook of the terrible economy when you have financial need and it's hard to untangle. I especially relate to #4.

I think, fwiw, there's a key in one of them that will solve all of them.

#3.

If you get enough therapy and especially, study and practice and take training in assertiveness (this isn't self-defense or how to manage other people), and especially, find a community experience in which you can build close trusting healing relationship (iow, liberal religion even if you're agnostic; women's support groups where you are who you are without judgement; group therapy in addition to individual).

You can cure #3.
And then all the others, you will have answers to because proportion, values, fears, compassion (for self as well as others) will arise out of the practice of healthy assertiveness.

Healthy assertiveness is not anxious or angry. It is calm and strong and peaceful.

I truly believe someone who's been wounded in the ways you (and I) have...cannot simply "decide to do it." I believe, from watching and doing over the years--that assertiveness training is the key.

Hope some of that helps a little.

Don't hurt yourself. Don't debase yourself.

Are you maybe in some way rolling all fear of judgment/rejection into one person? Her?
You've figured out your own ways of having confidence and dignity in your work...maybe she's the repository for all the parts of you that are still afraid of being unloved, or proven "bad."

You're a good person.

love to you,
Hops

Nonameanymore:
NC has been liberating to me - am NC for 16 years now.
They don't stop, at least mine didn't. First she gave me some space, then when she realised I wasn't going back, she harassed and still does at least once a year (with more than one ways).
You have your own family and some good role models from what you share. The first obligation is to yourself and your own sanity.


Good luck with whatever you decide!

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