Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: seastorm on February 15, 2007, 12:35:57 AM
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Hi everyone,
If you have followed my story you will know that I broke up a seven year relationship with my N partner 4 months ago. I have been looking after a big black cat who is magnificent for 3 years. this includes paying several hundred dollars in vet bills ( he gets into fights and gets beaten up although he is neutered), paying for all the food and kitty litter and providing a loving home to him. Now the N's son wants the cat back. I love this cat a lot. I treat him like a king and he is currently my best friend. I do no want to give him back.
I got a call on my answering machine saying that it was convenient for son to pick up cat on Monday. I emailed exN that cat is not negotiable and I wont give him back. I did weaken and say that i would let son borrow cat for a few days but I wont give him back but now I realize my exN manipulated me into this.
I also heard that son was planning to go to Australia for a year. This is all quite confusing.
What is your opinion.
Input gratefully appreciated.
Sea storm
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supervised visitation?
are you confident N's son will return him
falllinnngggg asleeeeeep
Hops
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Hey Sea,
It the cat really the sons cat or was it the family cat? How old is his son?
Love Deb
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The cat was his son's. His son is 26.
I have had the cat for four years. During that time the son had the cat for 6 months. He gave the cat back when his boyfriend moved in with another cat. This cat has been dumped many times. It is too hard on him. He is getting old.
I cant think straight about this. My ex said that I could have the cat when he left.
I am thinking seriously about keeping the cat. The son has not been nice to me at all. He has shown no interest in the cat in four years. Didn't call to inquire when cat had a serious illness.
Sea Storm
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No, Visitation won't work. It is a long ferry ride (1 1/2 hours on the ferry) and big bucks to make the trip. I don't think I would get the cat back. I am pretty sure that my exN has painted a very wicked picture of me to justify leaving for new woman.
Sea Storm
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Sea,
I sit here and read and relate to post of everyone. I don’t feel the hurt anymore but I still remember it.
I have read and experienced real life N relationship just like all of you. It plain out sucked.
I know they have clinical names such as: Narcissist, NPD, Narcissism.
I on the other hand have my own names such as: Asshole, Asswipe, Assholeism.
I know you are hurt Sea he has done terrible things to you.
He is working it? You are right. He is apologetic? Don’t except it. He is not, He is not sorry. Sea read between the lines. He is planning something. He always has even way before you met him. He knows your hurt and that is to his advantage. He is manipulating. They are so freaking good at what they do Sea. He is feeling you out. He actually thinks he can come and visit in a few months. He is working you with your cat.
He is who he was and he will become bigger/badder/better. He is a monster who is not finished eating you up. Sea you have caused him Narcissist Injury and payback is a bitch.
Stay away from this man in person and conversation. You may have to speak to him through attorneys. You have got to stop him in his tracks.
Get rid of him. Simply say Dear I'm not interested in your hardships you are boring me to death now could you kindly Fuck Off and Have a Nice Day. Oh and dear by the way while your having a nice day I'm keeping the cat.
Love Deb
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DebKor:
Of course you are right. And this is what I want to do. How frigging weird was all that. I realized that he had told his kids god knows what and they may have thought I would boil up the kitty and eat him for dinner. There is no use trying to undo this.
That was one great piece of advice. I really enjoy those cursewords. I was laughing as I read your post. Zippety doo dah the sun is going to shine again someday.
I need to hear this regularly as I slip back into lah lah land.
Happy Valentines you feisty girl.
Sea storm
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I am glad I asked for help with this. I am learning really great things.
Sea Storm
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Sea,
What everyone else has said, except here is an excellent twist:
"Oh, the cat has [diabetes, thyroid problems, kidney trouble] and he needs his medication every day. I've just had him in the hospital again but it ONLY cost $2000 this time, thank goodness the vet lets me run a tab, you'll take responsibility for the back bills, of course, when you take him, I'll call the vet right now and give him all your contact information. He'll be going back in for some tests in a couple of weeks. He's getting used to the subcutaneous fluids now, that only has to be done twice a day and it only takes ten minutes each time and he hardly ever scratches me now..."
If they have to do anything, and I mean anything, to care for an animal, they lose interest FAST.
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Storm,
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
You are too much.
CB
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... every word of that is taken from direct experience... just not direct experience all at one time, thank God!
Late life care for critters is definitely not for the faint of heart... but you know that too, I'm'a preachin' to the choir.
Show an N an expeNse, and watch them ruN for the hills! :twisted:
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Hey Sea,
I'm glad you laughed that is what I was hoping my colorful words would do.
Your such a nice person and although your feelings were hurt you would never ever hurt anyone else.
Your very sweet and that is something to be proud of something that is rare in people our days.
You are doing just fine. You are moving ahead and not going back. You just glanced back that is all.
The difference is now when you glance at that horrible moster person there is a whole team of people standing behind him wavng their arms, Noo,, Noooo.. that is us.
I guess we are like that Verizon wireless commerical. We go everywhere with you we are your support team.
Love Deb
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Deb,
I LOVE that image of the whole board standing behind an N that one of us has drifted off into trance about, waving their fellow VES member away, away, go bacccck!
Thanks much for this.
It says so much about how this community functions and what power it has.
Hops
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I'm thinking having our N's be the cardboard cut-outs that tip and fall with a poof of smoke in the Verizon commercial. :o
While we all stand triumphant on our feet!
Thanks all for helping me!
Sunny
Love cats--gonna get one to replace my N soon! :wink:
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Thanks for your support all you great people.
The cat thing plus finalizing the separation and getting money from bank for payoff has really opened up old wounds. I ended up talking to exN and this was hard. He said that he didn't sleep with the woman. However, he has moved to Calgary. He does not know anyone else there. So the old mixed up feeling came, the ones where I am being lied to in all probability.
I would be so much better off if I could get angry and hate him more.
I need to go back to no contact. I still have this feeling of wanting reassurance that it wasn't as cruel and heartless as I thought it was. But it was. Only when I talk to N he says that I am completely wrong about my perceptions. And there it is again. I am a crazywoman. Poor him.
I am in danger of slipping back. He is mighty good at manipulating me. I feel scared. This sounds pathetic. I feel very lonely. My daughter called and we had a lovely talk for more than an hour. We have mended the gap that had developed. We have been alienated from each other for a few years. She felt like I became a different person with N and now I am getting back to who I really am. This is so affirming for me. She lives on the other side of the continent.
I feel like I have let you guys down by contacting N. I was afraid to tell him that I might take him back in a year. All I did on the phone was cry. I am way too traumatized and vulnerable to talk to anyone who can do me harm. So there it is.
He is seriously looking for work in Calgary. It is booming so apparently one can get jobs easily. I know that this is a lucky thing for me. Life takes over and one starts building a new life. I think that is what he will do.
I am not there yet. It is exactly 4 months since we separated physcally.
That is not so long. If I still cry my eyes out over it all every other day this is a big improvement. Also he is not the only reason I am in rough shape. I am doing therapy and my issues started long before N. My mom was an N big time.
My job gave me secondary trauma and I was on stress leave before he left or I threw him out. My boss was an N too. Four other people in my position went to arbitraion over her wrongful accusations of incompetency and they WON. Howeve, the board could not fire this boss and they could not afford to pay her out so they said she had to stay. So I am the fifth person. She gets someone in her crosshairs and they are doomed. She piles on work and then uber manages the person. She demands reports and then criticises them and requires five ediits. The list goes on and on.
Basically, I think that God wanted me to get out of that job and out of my relationship. I needed to rebuild my whole life. This is a big job and not for sissies. I am going to reinvent myself with integrity. I am not going to work somewhere that I don't believe in or do things I don't have conviction about. If I lose my house so be it. Right now though I am curled up in a ball of insecurity. However, I believe in doing things even though I am afraid.
thanks for listening. I am keeping the cat.
Sea storm
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Oh, the Naming of Cats! I vote for "Greebo". He's a fictional character in Terry Pratchett's novels who just happens to be a cat.
Here's why he has my vote: http://www.lspace.org/books/whos-who/greebo.html
Enjoy the picture. Wouldn't'ya love to toss that sweet little fluffball into your N's lap a few times. eh?
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Sea,
Is there any way you could go on a trip?
Could you visit your daughter?
Sometimes the physical removal of travel can be such a help for regaining emotional distance.
You are so wise to say you need to not be in contact with people who do you harm.
I sometimes resorted to private reminders such as, HE HURTS ME, posted on ALL my telephones.
I couldn't go into a "fugue state" and lull myself back into trance and make the call without intentionally stepping over that boundary.
If one thing posted wouldn't work, I'd do more.
Write in soap on my bathroom mirror. Put a note on my dashboard (driving's a great place for fugue-ing), in my purse, on the inside of my doors, wherever and however many it takes.
There is no reminder/prompt/crutch/affirmation/billboard I wouldn't use again if I ever needed to to keep me away from an N.
I sure don't judge you for slipping, hon. BEEN THERE.
Maybe it would help to try to bust out of your isolation some. Even a volunteer activity. Some busy group where you'd be occupied with your hands and have pleasant people around you, get focused on something else a few times a week.
You feeling any better now? SO glad you're keeping your kitty.
love,
Hops
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Don't feel bad sea, I can't even seem to get out the door in the first place. And I beat myself up every day for it. Long for the time when I can decide whether or not I wish to speak to him.
Glad you and your daughter are working things through. Mine are only in early teens and pre-teens, the worst of that might be yet to come. There are 4 of them (girls). I am afraid they will blame me for a separation and act out. Hope you two work it out, I know she loves you.
Namaste,
Sunny
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Sea,
When all else failed and I felt lousy. I always put this song on. Got me going! I don't sing well although. Wonder by my neighbors really moved?
First I was afraid
I was petrified
Kept thinking I could never live
without you by my side
But I spent so many nights
thinking how you did me wrong
I grew strong
I learned how to carry on
and so you're back
from outer space
I just walked in to find you here
with that sad look upon your face
I should have changed my stupid lock
I should have made you leave your key
If I had known for just one second
you'd be back to bother me
Go on now go walk out the door
just turn around now
'cause you're not welcome anymore
weren't you the one who tried to hurt me with goodbye
you think I'd crumble
you think I'd lay down and die
Oh no, not I
I will survive
as long as i know how to love
I know I will stay alive
I've got all my life to live
I've got all my love to give
and I'll survive
I will survive
It took all the strength I had
not to fall apart
kept trying hard to mend
the pieces of my broken heart
and I spent oh so many nights
just feeling sorry for myself
I used to cry
Now I hold my head up high
and you see me
somebody new
I'm not that chained up little person
still in love with you
and so you felt like dropping in
and just expect me to be free
now I'm saving all my loving
for someone who's loving me
Love Deb
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Hi sea,
I didn't get to read through all the answers, but it sounds like they are trying to take away yet another something that you care about.
I am sorry you have, again, somthing to go through and deal with.
Try to stay centerd and keep your lovely (bad!) cat!!!
Love, Beth
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Yes, it is another visit to hell for me. I cannot stand to hear his voice as it is too painful. I always really liked the sound of his voice. I don't like to imagine him in Calgary.
I think that if I stop communcating with him then I am admitting that I don't love him anymore. This is screwed up. What's love got to do with it. Or that weird bondage and discipline merrygoround that I call love.
I went to the Hospice trainging tonight and I felt good being in a group. No one is cold to me and it feels nice. They are a group of very good people. I like the discussions. We talked about touching to show we care and how hard it is to have an elderly parent who won't accept medication for osteoporosis. She has lived on a big farm all her life and she won't show anything that she perceives as weakness. Meanwhile, her daughter is a slave to her because of this pride. Good to look at how others struggle.
I also learned that there is someone who has the job of getting people's lfestories before they die. This is for their family. That sounds like a nice occupation.
My cats name is Moka which is so insipid. I like the name Frank but it is not epic enough.
Tomorrow I am going out for dinner to an old friends. We lived on the same island during the 70s handlogging and without electricity etc. We have many good memories.
I am forcing myself out into the world. I figure eventually I will get a life.
Also I think I need to volunteer doing something I love to do. I got through the two hours of hospice training without crying. I have to factor that in.
I learned that the symptoms of grief are the same as for post traumatic stress. I found that helpful and it normalized what I am going through. I often feel as crazy as a bat.
That song is great and I have sung it plenty. It is a good kick ass song and good for the kitchen aria. Best sung with umbrella in hand.
Love,
Sea storm
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Sea,
What everyone else has said, except here is an excellent twist:
"Oh, the cat has [diabetes, thyroid problems, kidney trouble] and he needs his medication every day. I've just had him in the hospital again but it ONLY cost $2000 this time, thank goodness the vet lets me run a tab, you'll take responsibility for the back bills, of course, when you take him, I'll call the vet right now and give him all your contact information. He'll be going back in for some tests in a couple of weeks. He's getting used to the subcutaneous fluids now, that only has to be done twice a day and it only takes ten minutes each time and he hardly ever scratches me now..."
If they have to do anything, and I mean anything, to care for an animal, they lose interest FAST.
I was also thinking of something along these lines :). They say possession is 9/10ths of the law, and you've had the cat and taken care of it for several years. If the cat is still HIS and you provided the service of taking care of HIS cat for several years, you have some compensation coming. What's a kennel charge these days? So show me some money son, and you can have the cat back... And I sure wouldn't let him "borrow" the cat for several days.
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I am seeing that I have been taken advantage of. I really must smarten up. I will take this advice and it is now my mantral No money, no kitty, no money, no kitty. Also, kitty has bilateral lung deformity with diabetic shock syndrome and needs meds each month.
I am realizing that I have problems with being a codependent and this sets me up to be a sucker. I need lessons in clear, no crap, don't mess with me attitude. If anyone is good at this (((((((Deb000000000 feel free to speak up when I sound too slack about things.
Thanks all xxxxxxxx
Sea storm
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Sea, I am confused. Are you now thinking about giving the cat back to the N? That's what I 'hear' in 'no money, no kitty' - that you'd give the cat to this creep if you got cash? I hope not...
... but I am a totally wigged out animal lover, and I would never ever surrender an animal to anyone who had abused me, or whom I'd observed abusing anyone or anything, even in the slightest degree, for fear of what that person would do if I gave them a small, helpless, furry hostage to abuse in my stead.
So I am probably reading something into that phrase that isn't there. Sorry! And best of luck to you and that beautiful big cat.
((((((((((Seastorm & Kitty))))))))))
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Based on some cases I've seen on "People's Court", "Judge Judy" etc., since the cat has been in your possession for so long then the cat is YOURS! Tell the N to take a flying leap off a cliff somewhere!
If he's dumb enough to attempt to take you to small claims court, one of the first questions the judge will ask is "when did you leave your property there?" He will have to truthfully answer "four years" plus you will have your documentation of vet bills, etc. for the last four years. In the eyes of the law, N has abandoned the "property" and therefore no longer has a valid claim.
Just my opinion.
Bones
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Sea, I am confused. Are you now thinking about giving the cat back to the N? That's what I 'hear' in 'no money, no kitty' - that you'd give the cat to this creep if you got cash? I hope not...
Seems to me it's just a good way to bluff the N. Watch them lose all interest in the cat as soon as money comes up in the conversation.
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Sea - the cat is yours. he was abandoned to you. You are confused because your boundaries are not yet firm. N's run over boundaries like bulldozers and then blame the "weak" boundary for not stopping them. Sound familiar.
From Kell's post on Co-Narcissism:
Children of narcissists tend to feel overly responsible for other people. They tend to assume that others’ needs are similar to those of their parents, and feel compelled to meet those needs by responding in the required manner. They tend to be unaware of their own feelings, needs, and experience, and fade into the background in relationships.
The cat is yours. He was abandoned to you. Take CB's advice and say anything except, "the cat is mine." Say it is inconvenient for you to pick the cat up or something else and say something different each and every time. Give him the run around. He is trying to manipulate you. You are confused only because your boundaries are weak. If your boundaries were not broken by the N bulldozer and the N parent before him you would say, "Go jump in a lake."
What are you afraid will happen? Try to answer that question and then step back and see why it isn't so.
Every morning before you get out of bed, say three times out loud, "I am glad I got that N man out of my life. I am better off without Ns in my life." You don't have to believe it at first but before long you will believe it and it will set you free.
I'm counting on you to try. your friend - gaining strength
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I am keeping the cat with a clear conscience. He is off getting himself beaten up by the neighbourhood bully cat as we speak. Spring must be here.
I would not sell this cat for a million dollars. He is so magnificent and we love each other. I will not bore you with his beloved eccentricties. He is a manx cat and this is so darling, big tufts between his toes.
I think taking the cat was another mean thing to do. I was really upset about losing him. I felt guilty and that he belonged to Ns son. Love with no responsibility is pretty pathetic.
Thanks for all the help. I love to hear what you guys think.
Sea storm
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Sea Storm,
So glad 'big cat' is staying put ....... oh but, shoo off that bully cat :(
My big fluffy cat has little tufts of soft fluffy fur between her toes, and, licks my arm each morning to greet me.
We love each other heaps. She follows me everywhere round the house.
Enjoy the love from your big soft puddy cat.
Leah x
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(((((((((((((((Purrrrrr))))))))))))))))
Sea storm
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Moki is magnificent and must not be denied his wild wild ways. I am tempted to keep him inside but he begs and begs to go outside. He is desperate to go outside. I live in the country and cars are not a problem.
The last cat I had was a white persian/himalayan mix and she lived to be 22. Several times I had to resue her from tall fir trees. She was an outside cat too but she seemed to be able to take care of herself better than Moki. He has been declawed (front claws). I assure you it was not me that did this to him. I talk to him about it sometimes and he lets me know it was really horrid. Soooooo he gets beat up sometimes.
Sea storm
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Hey Seastorm... Moki was a fierce and very loyal Maori warrior chieftain! Not a bad name for a big, magnificent cat.
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Ahhhhhhh this is most suitable then. Very good news. I will whisper in his ear how auspicious his name is. Although he has enormous self confidence except with strangers, then he makes himself into a noodle and slinks under the couch ( about 2 inches). Is he not brilliant?
It is good to see where this topic went from start to finish. It evloved into frolicking and laughing. What a good place.
Sea storm
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Sea,
Also he is not the only reason I am in rough shape. I am doing therapy and my issues started long before N. My mom was an N big time.
You posted this a ways back in the thread. I just want to say that you, like me and like many of the people here, are going thru immensely painful change: Not only were we hurt and burned by our N, but (1) many of us were shocked to learn that the person who burned us was an N, and (2) then we see that we became involved with the N because we were raised by Ns.
So, these realizations are REALLY shocking. Now, we have to (or choose to) review our entire lives and try to sort thru the mess.
It's exhausting and depressing, yet, for many of us, we would never go back to the days when we were unaware of the Nism in our lives.
So Sea, I just wanted to acknowledge the enormity of your stuggle and tell you you are doing so well moving forward.
dazed
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thanks very much Dazed
Glad you picked up on that. I speak tentatively of working on issues with my mother. Her contempt is never far from me. i realize the impact that she had. I can see why I was easy pickings for anyone who appeared to love me. I had no idea what real love felt llike. So this is defineately a hard time for me.And yes, I think it is high time that I dealt with these issues. There is no going back. I think if I did my health would break down completey. My body was telling me I needed to change my life but I was afraid to. So life just spun me on my head, picked me up by the hair and turned me inside out. Thak goodness I found this site.Thee are so many fellow travellers on this journey. Without support I dont think I could stand all the revelations of lies, betraal and abuse.
I cant blame my exN for all my pain. Some of it was there just waiting to be awoken long before he came along. That is hard for me. I want to make him responible for my pain. In the end I am an adult and I wast to carry it myself and look at it and learn a better way.
Sea Storm
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And yes, I think it is high time that I dealt with these issues. There is no going back.
Right on, (((((((((((((Sea)))))))))))), right on!!!!!!!!!
The truth hurts, but we can't (we CHOOSE not to) go back.
Love, dazed
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Dar Dazed
Somehow I missed your poignant response or it didn't register with me at the time. I find that I am quite fuzzy headed sometimes or that I dissoiciate and am not really present. This is an old coping mechanism.
I really apprecitate how you reached out and offered acknowlegement and support. You are so right about how hard this passage in life has been. What a phenomena. After four months I realize just a little, that in this horror show is also the chance to get things right in my heart and soul. There are old wounds that must be healed. I have opened up the door to working on my relationship with my mom. I could never do that before.
When they ask some people if they know in their hearts why they got a terminal ellness often those people will say that they know and it doesn't surprise them.
I don't have a terminal illness but I do have a deep psyhologicial woulnd that was destroying me. Strange as it may seem, the N opened to door to my healing.
Love,
Sea storm
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Strange as it may seem, the N opened to door to my healing.
Stormchild,
Mine did too, if it were not for his final betrayal ... I would still be 'trapped' in a vacuum of emptiness ....... whereas now, four years on I am here ..... healed and restored ... having found ME at last.
Set free ... free indeed.
So thankyou xnh .... thank you so much.
Leah