Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: axa on December 14, 2007, 07:28:12 AM
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I went to bed last night relieved that the day was over. I always feel anxious and sad around the time of my daughter's anniversary but having cried, laughted, talked etc. I felt able to take myself to bed and sleep. But you know what, I could not. This board was on my mind and that is why I am writing this post.
In my recovery over the years I became aware of my need for drama in my life. I am convinced that this was part of the reason I ended up with XN - the highs and the lows. It allowed me relive my experience in my FOO. I received so much help on this board and through others comments and support I was able to look at this part of me. I have found the conflict that has gone one here recently very familiar and choose to not engage in it. I believe at some level I am almost hard wired for drama and feel that the way to deal with this is to find healthy adventures/drama - e.g. a rollercoaster. It does not involve any emotional fallout for anyone. And that is what I have to say on that subject.
I assume that this board is representative of the three D world. This leads me to believe that there are people on here who post, or lurk, who are Jewish, Muslim, Athiest, Agnostic, Christian, Hindu etc................. It always interests me that no one seems to feel a need to bring their beliefs onto this board other than some of the Christians. I think whatever your belief that is your business, dare I say between you and God. I respect your right to believe whatever you choose. If I feel a need to read the Bible, Torah, Koran I will seek one out. I live in a part of the world where Christians from different faiths have been killing each other for decades, the bible in one hand and the gun in the other and respect long vanished into the mists of time. Justifying their actions because they each know the Truth.
My understanding of Voiceless is that it is a safe place where those who have been abused by Ns came come and receive support, encouragement - a place of safetly. In the past it has been for me.
Please feel free to comment but I am not interested in engaging in discussion about this post.
axa
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Axa, it's kind of hard to comment if we're not supposed to discuss your post, but all I am going to say is, it is very sad and wrong that any followers of Christ's NEW TESTAMENT (not old per se), would be killing each other. I do not agree with that nor would I join them in it.
At some point I'll be talking more about what I stand for.
~Laura
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ps. by the way, my relationship with my Lord, is PERSONAL, NOT PRIVATE, and I'm not sure where "christians" come off saying "It's MY private belief and I don't have to share it"...please someone, show me THAT in the Bible.
~Laura
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axa,
That's a very sensible post, thank you.
Janet
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The only life question that one really needs to ask is this ....
.... does the characteristic behaviour of the person professing their OWN faith belief MATCH the teachings of THAT faith belief ??
For example ...
"By their fruits shall you know them"
In reality does the person walk the walk ?
(words can be a multitude of things)
That's my life guide.
Love, Leah
Thank you (( Axa )) for my voice here and now.
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Hi axa,
I live in a part of the world where Christians from different faiths have been killing each other for decades, the bible in one hand and the gun in the other and respect long vanished into the mists of time. Justifying their actions because they each know the Truth.
This type war isn't exclusive to Christians. In Darfur for instance, it is between Muslims. The Arab Muslims have conducted a war of ethnic cleansing against the black African Muslims. I haven't seen them thumping the Koran with their guns, but they mught as well be. I'm not condoning the behaviors of either the Christians you speak of or the Muslims. Just making the observation that no particular religion has the market cornered when it comes to violence and outright war.
Do you suppose these wars are in part driven by a collective cultural craving for drama?
tt
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Axa,
Thank you for your very sensible post.
I believe Axa meant that she was not going to discuss the post further in the thread, not that others couldn't carry on the discussion.
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I believe Axa meant that she was not going to discuss the post further in the thread, not that others couldn't carry on the discussion.
Yes, I think that is what she was saying.
tt
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Izzy posted ....
(A new translation in Britain, I think it was, had printed "Thou shalt commit adultery" and shipped out the bibles. I don't know the outcome of that, but just one word changes the meaning.)
Dear Izzy,
I have the details of that here on file, and also in the 'history of the bible' resource book, what happened there was,
it was an error in the Printing at the Printers.
Certainly gave me chuckle at the time of reading about it.
Love, Leah
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Izzy, that was a lovely post, and I agree with much of what you said. There are some topics that are better left in private or in the proper forum.
Izzy, your last comment made me chuckle.
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As I recall, some people pointed out that this is a board which family members may be around and that they asked that it be respected that it may not be in the best interests of their family members to discuss the subject of s-x here.
Which is understandable.
Leah
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Just another note, that there are at least 3 countries represented here, Canada, USA, England, so some people would not fit into a Political debate re USA.
Thank you Izzy
As I would really struggle to engage.
Leah
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For many Christians it is our faith in God which we believe has been the key to our survival and healing. Is it improper to discuss that key to our survival and the place it has in our lives? I hope not.
I see a great deal of this type of discussion and very little proseletyzing so what's the problem?
Hindu's, Jainists, Zoroastrians and atheists are just as free to discuss the role of their faith (or lack of same) in their journey and I expect there would be no problem if they did.
In fact there was a time when there was considerable discussion by some folks of the role Bhuddism and new age ideas played in their lives and nobody griped.
If we can talk about some in-law or head shrinker or shyster helpng us seems to me we should be able to talk about our Creator helping us too.
mud
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Hi Mud,
Is it improper to discuss that key to our survival and the place it has in our lives? I hope not.
I hope not too.
I personally find discussions about other beliefs stimulating and interesting. My observation is that most Christians remain at a kindergarten level when it comes to defending their hope in Christ. But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:KJV
I think one of the key words in this verse is 'asketh'.
I think one of the hallmarks of a mature Christian is their ability to clearly articulate the basic tenets of their beliefs and why they believe them. When that happens, they won't feel 'contaminated' by discussions with others who believe differently.
tt
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For many Christians it is our faith in God which we believe has been the key to our survival and healing. Is it improper to discuss that key to our survival and the place it has in our lives? I hope not.
I see a great deal of this type of discussion and very little proseletyzing so what's the problem?
Hindu's, Jainists, Zoroastrians and atheists are just as free to discuss the role of their faith (or lack of same) in their journey and I expect there would be no problem if they did.
In fact there was a time when there was considerable discussion by some folks of the role Bhuddism and new age ideas played in their lives and nobody griped.
If we can talk about some in-law or head shrinker or shyster helpng us seems to me we should be able to talk about our Creator helping us too.
mud
A soothing read and voice of reason -- thanks. :D
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Mud..... I believe the bible's been thumped a bit harder than just sharing and caring.
I don't want to hear a sermon, be judged or listen to hypocrits smack each other around with bible verse..... and I realize you're not suggesting I would.
If someone wants to talk about the strength they receive from their spiritual connection, that's one thing.
I can't say I've seen anyone find fault with that.... have I missed something?
If they're going to wield it like a sword or affect an elitist's stance..... my hackles go up.
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Just because I speak of my faith background does not mean that I am trying to evangelize. I have found that non-Christians tend to bristle easily when they hear the word, Jesus, Christ, or Christian.
Bottom line, they, people in AA don't care what faith you are. I hang out with people of all faiths, especially new agers because I am IN AA.
But there is one thing that we all seem to agree on, that there is a God and that we are not it.
The people I know in AA live and walk the straight and narrow path more than most people I know at my church. We have a saying in AA - "hang with the winners."
Excerpt from BB - "We Agnostics"
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We know how he feels. We have shared his honest doubt and prejudice. Some of us have been violently anti-religious. To others, the word "God" brought up a particular idea of Him with which someone had tried to impress them during childhood. Perhaps we rejected this particular conception because it seemed inadequate. With that rejection we imagined we had abandoned the God idea entirely. We were bothered with the thought that faith and dependence upon a Power beyond ourselves was somewhat weak, even cowardly. We looked upon this world of warring individuals, warring theological systems, and inexplicable calamity, with deep skepticism. We looked askance at many individuals who claimed to be godly. How could a Supreme Being have anything to do with it all? And who could comprehend a Supreme Being anyhow? Yet, in other moments, we found ourselves thinking, when enchanted by a starlit night, "Who, then, make all this?" There was a feeling of awe and wonder, but it was fleeting and soon lost.
Yes, we of agnostic temperament have had these thoughts and experiences. Let us make haste to reassure you. We found that as soon as we were able to lay aside prejudice and express even a willingness to believe in a Power greater than ourselves, we commenced to get results, even though it was impossible for any of us to fully define or comprehend that Power, which is God.
Much to our relief, we discovered we did not need to consider another's conception of God. Our own conception, however inadequate, was sufficient to make the approach and to effect a contact with Him. As soon as we admitted the possible existence of a Creative Intelligence, a Spirit of the Universe underlying the totality of things, we began to be possessed of a new sense of power and direction, provided we took other simple steps. We found that God does not make too hard terms with those who seek Him. To us, the Realm of Spirit is broad, roomy, all inclusive; never exclusive or forbidding to those who earnestly seek. It is open, we believe, to all men.
When, therefore, we speak to you of God, we mean your own conception of God. This applies, too, to other spiritual expressions which you find in this book. Do not let any prejudice you may have against spiritual terms deter you from honestly asking yourself what they mean to you. At the start, this was all we needed to commence spiritual growth, to effect our first conscious relation with God as we understood Him. Afterward, we found ourselves accepting many things which then seemed entirely out of reach. That was growth, but if we wished to grow we had to begin somewhere. So we used our own conception, however limited it was.
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"Just because I speak of my faith background does mean that I am trying to evangelize. "
Oh, what a lovely Freudian slip!!
Janet
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typo fixed -- an yes, deep down inside I would probably love for everyone to know who God is, that is what makes me a good Christian.
But is does not mean that when I am writing about Him that I am thinking gee, "I hope people convert."
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Hi Janet
Is that hatred or are you just happy to hear from me?
Lise
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Hi lighter,
If they're going to wield it like a sword or affect an elitist's stance..... my hackles go up.
I think this verse gives clear guidelines for expressing one's hope in Christ.
But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:KJV
I think with that approach, the offensive way you mentioned would be avoided. What do you think?
tt
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The Spirit gives us discernment and discretion on when, where and how to deliver the gospel.
Guess it depends on what your goal is; to just say it louder than anyone else or to seek and save that which is lost by becoming all things to all men that by so doing some might be saved.
heehee, Mud! Guess we were on the same wavelength! (I just read your post in the next thread).
Love
CB
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Mud, I made a couple of comments about the use of religious arguments on the board--and that may be a bit of why this and other threads started.
Actually CB - my strong statement of spirituality WAS what started all of this....
Hmmmm...
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When person has a true ,deep realtionship with God, it IS the best love relationship . . I have been there. I don't stay there b/c of my own failings.
God is supposed to be our first love. For those of us who believe in Jesus as a living,breathing "alive" God, He IS our lives,as I see it
Ami
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The Spirit gives us discernment and discretion on when, where and how to deliver the gospel.
Let your light shine, and always, may your speech be seasoned with salt.
Leah
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Using scripture or "faith" to gobsmack someone is no more about God than using psychobabble to shame someone is about Jungian psychology. Both are about conflict and aggression.
Nor do I think that is what axa was even referring to, and my post was in response to hers.
She seemed to be uncomfortable with Christians bringing their faith to the board. I just wanted to point out that in most cases it is in the context of how it has helped them.
mud
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Using scripture or "faith" to gobsmack someone is no more about God than using psychobabble to shame someone is about Jungian psychology. Both are about conflict and aggression.
Nor do I think that is what axa was even referring to, and my post was in response to hers.
She seemed to be uncomfortable with Christians bringing their faith to the board. I just wanted to point out that in most cases it is in the context of how it has helped them.
mud
Who are you addressing now?
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. Discernment is from the Holy Spirit---not FROM another person(human being). Discernment is a private matter between a person and God--only. It is NOT for another human to judge. Ami
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I am quietly observing comments at this time and will contribute when and if the Lord leads me to :)
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Who are you addressing now?
I am not addressing anyone in particular. Some posts referring to mine seemed to miss my point so I contrasted what they were referring to, to what I was, which was axa's original post.
I consider the discussion of ideas and ideals worthwhile. Indulging in personal animosities less so.
If you took it as a swipe at you, you were mistaken.
mud
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Hi lighter,
I think with that approach, the offensive way you mentioned would be avoided. What do you think?
tt
I think asketh, meekness and fear are good words.
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Who are you addressing now?
I am not addressing anyone in particular. Some posts referring to mine seemed to miss my point so I contrasted what they were referring to, to what I was, which was axa's original post.
I consider the discussion of ideas and ideals worthwhile. Indulging in personal animosities less so.
If you took it as a swipe at you, you were mistaken.
mud
Thanks mud for taking the time to explain.
There has been a lot of swiping lately (myself included). However, the air is toxic, no denying that - I am affected by it and overly sensitive these days, perhaps reading too much into things? Sorry -- Lise
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I was raised in a very "churchy" family. I recognize the religious talk. But at the same time I believe and have gotten there despite the spiritual abuse I feel I suffered. I do not like it when my fellow Christians start quoting scripture to support their labs-more spiritual abuse. But without my faith I would have nothing to lean on.
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support our "labs?" I have a black lab puppy, but i am guessing that's not what you meant by this?
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Yes my T9 on my phone changed my meaning yet again. I meant their jabs. i noticed a lot of arguing backed up with a scripture quote and I can understand why some might feel offended.
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Overcomer, thanks for clearing that up..."jabs" not "labs"
I don't feel I'm guilty of jabbing anyone because I don't like seeing others being subtly jabbed through use of humor or whatever either. I know the Bible is a 2-edged sword, so I do my best to weild it carefully only as needed.
~Laura
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I'm probably quilty of using sarcasm and humor as "jabs." I also think of a good scripture or two sometimes. Mostly when there is a conflict on the board I have to look at the humor in it or I think I would get very upset by it all. Whenever someone raises their voice at me in real life I get a giant pit in my stomach. My h is a yeller and I took it for a long time before I said, "there is the door, now walk through it!!!" This stopped him from yelling as much. I think his mother was a yeller.....
I was thinking about this board and why we have so many flare ups........first, it is the anonimiity which allows you to say whatever you want and then kind of duck. If you were in a room with all these people I doubt the same dynamic would occur. Also, when you go to couples counseling and the discussion gets heated, you usually have a doc there to point out the lunacy in what you are saying. Or to point out dysfunctional thinking. Here - it's a free for all.
I truly try to never get offended. Yes, there has been a time or two when I could read between the lines and hear someone jabbing me. Oh, well, maybe from their perspective what I say is stupid.....I dunno.....