don't be judgemental please!

[Anonymous]

please don't be overly judgemental with comments- eg. to parents.

For one thing people are doing their best and will feel attacked and defensive rather than learn constructively.

For another you don't know that person or their situation, many families are perfectly happy with the arrangements they work out even if it would not suit you. Unless you know the bigger picture you're just making assumptions based on your own limited experiences ( and all our experiences are limited in that respect )

But the biggest reason not to judge others and criticise is that it turns people off looking for a response to their developing voice: when their situation seems so overwhelming or so bad to them already, or maybe they are really pleased to have turned a bad situation around, only to have someone tell them they should have done it differently, actually?

That's really hard when you only just found yourself and are building confidence.

[Anonymous]

J, in your last paragraph you dangerously contradict yourself. This is almost a histrionic overdramatisation and is completely unsupportable. To state so emphatically that when you lose your voice as a child, you lose it forever, which once lost can never, ever be restored. Whereas in the very preceeding sentence you pray that these same people can find their voice and reclaim their childhoos. How confusing, and you made it so absolute. I wish you'd make up your mind. This would quite simply scare people if they took you seriously. And I wish to say, it is totally untrue, and quite preposterous. I reject it outright and wish to say so. I'm expressing my voice and opinion on this because it's such an important aspect ov recovering from damage casued by Nparents.  I lost my voice, and have found it quite succesfully, and also have established a terrific support network and great friends. All of whom have contributed to health. People who love me. I think the only time you lose your voice forever, as you put it, while ever you isolate yourself, as you have done. After all, who is there to hear your voice then. I've reached out to others, overlooked, forgiven and myself apologised and received forgiveness many times. The result is I've found warmth and care in many unexpected places. And grown as a result. It's your entitlement to state your opinion, and I respect that, but I believe you're wrong on this one, and it's not a small thing to be wrong on. It's such a negative prognosis which risks leaving a seeker completely devasted.

Guest

[Anonymous]

anyone can rediscover their voice. Nothing is forever- unless we believe it is.

[Lizbeth as Guest]

That is not true, not everything can be recovered.  We cannot regain the childhood that is denied us when we are raised in an abusive household.  That is lost forever.  

anyone can rediscover their voice. Nothing is forever- unless we believe it is.

[Anonymous]

What is not true? Prove it. You seem so sure, yet you even misquote guest, and call guest anonymous instead of guest. You took what guest said as a quote 'Anyone can rediscover their voice' and reframed it and then refuted your reframing. Not what guest actually said.
You turned it into nothing to do with the voice at all. You said we can't regain the childhood that's denied us, that's lost forever. Yes, that's right, but guest wasn't refering to childhood but was refering to the voice. Go back and read it. The voice has been on hold, on pause all these years, and can be rediscovered. Not lost, stolen or killed. Repressed, oppressed but still inside you.

[Discounted Girl]

There are so many guest postings, I don't know which to choose a reply, but, this is also for the one called "don't be so judgemental."

While no particular benefits are bestowed upon us willing to register and log on, it does provide a degree of identification to those reading our posts. Unless IP addresses are somehow traced through our log-on data and you are scared of the cyber boogieman, I don't understand the need to be known as "guest." If what one guest said is true that "anyone can rediscover their voice," after years of childhood abuse of any type you want to mention, then a simple sign on to a website procedure should be a snap.

I am not so sure ghostN's are posting on this site as guest or maybe even using multi-logged names, so much as just plain spineless, bored trouble-makers who fancy themselves therapists and even maybe think they are more internet savvy than the rest of us. It seems like quite often when a "button-pushing" post is made, it's from a guest. But, haven't we wasted enough of our life on jerks? I just cringe when I see some of you well-intentioned, loving, kind, genuine, intelligent and whitespirit-filled Nvictims waste your energy trying to explain and argue with these types.

You bet our childhoods were denied to us -- AND --------- YOU CAN'T GO BACK AGAIN, GUEST !!! If you had been N'd, you would know that. Some of us got cheated by monsters we called Momma and Daddy     -- THE ULTIMATE NO-NO. I don't believe in reincarnation, we are not going to pass this way again, and what happened wasn't our fault. There was/is no karma going on, there were/are actions of free will chosen by our parents that were wicked and they hurt us -- smacked us around. It wasn't our fault. No child ever did anything to not receive love from their parent. Yes, our baby voices were stolen, repressed and oppressed. We are mourning and dealing with the aftermath. I can't remember who, but one of our registered members said: "We must not consider it a privilege to enjoy life. Joy and peace don't only belong to others, we can have them to." All of the little kids still inside us are trying to find peace -- so, don't argue. If you want to read, read -- if you want to post, sign in. We've had a lifetime of tricks played on us, we're not interested in any more.  

[Anonymous]

Discounted girl, it's not up to you to tell me or anyone else what to do. I've got a suggestion for you though, get the rules of the board changed so that no-one can come in as guest anymore, or hey, don't read what the guests write. That suits me. But don't tell me I can't post without signing in. And you've completely vindicated my position in my mind with your wild crazy accusations that guests are trying to trick you. You are just one of the hurt types still needing someone to swing at.

Guest and proud of it.

[Discounted Girl]

Darn, I can't find the sticking out my tongue emoticon. I guess my N'dchildhood arrested my development. I do try to not read the postings from guests, but there are so many of them and I am a fast reader, so sometimes I mess up and I accidently scan your posts.  Well, ta-da you have been completely vindicated? I thought we were here to be validated. You're proud, you said it loud -- bye to you Guest  

[Lizbeth]

What is not true? Prove it. You seem so sure, yet you even misquote guest, and call guest anonymous instead of guest. You took what guest said as a quote 'Anyone can rediscover their voice' and reframed it and then refuted your reframing. Not what guest actually said.
You turned it into nothing to do with the voice at all. You said we can't regain the childhood that's denied us, that's lost forever. Yes, that's right, but guest wasn't refering to childhood but was refering to the voice. Go back and read it. The voice has been on hold, on pause all these years, and can be rediscovered. Not lost, stolen or killed. Repressed, oppressed but still inside you.

I didn't call anyone anonymous, the board did that automatically.  I don't have to prove anything to you, GUEST.   Who are you to demand I prove anything, you don't even post with a name or a handle!  Maybe it should be "N".  You are sure reacting like one.

[Anonymous]

Bravo, Lisbeth.  You are recognizing Narcisstic behavior, and calling attention to the fact that you do not have to deal with it.  Remember, Narcisstic people love to mince words and argue semantics.  Empathetic people are able to see the meaning behind the words, even if what is said isn't one hundred percent grammatically correct, or if the perfect word isn't used.  Empathetic people want to understand each other, Narcisstic people need to be right.  Congratulations, Lisbeth, you responded perfectly.

[jacmac, as guest]

PLEASE NOTE, THAT IS JACMAC SPEAKING AS GUEST.  I WOULD NOT WANT TO MISTAKEN AS THE GUEST WHO HAS BEEN POSTING LATELY.
i cannot log in from this computer  

[Lizbeth]

Bravo, Lisbeth.  You are recognizing Narcisstic behavior, and calling attention to the fact that you do not have to deal with it.  Remember, Narcisstic people love to mince words and argue semantics.  Empathetic people are able to see the meaning behind the words, even if what is said isn't one hundred percent grammatically correct, or if the perfect word isn't used.  Empathetic people want to understand each other, Narcisstic people need to be right.  Congratulations, Lisbeth, you responded perfectly.

I am just so tired of being bullied by people who seem to think they have a right to "demand" this and that of you, who attempt to edit your speech, which is a poorly disguised attempt to silence you, intimidate you from saying anything that rocks their boat or makes them face themselves.

[Lizbeth]

Liz, that's me   you're quoting, I couldn't log on and I sent you an PM to explain.  I'm not being sarcastic, I mean it.  Do you see what's happening?  This "Guest" has got us doubting each other already.  I spoke about this in the other thread, the one entitled:  "Why post as guest".  I mean that you're very insightful to see that "Guest" here is behaving Narcisstically, because he or she, whoever they are, really is.

Hi Jacmac, I knew it was you, I was agreeing with you by quoting you.  But you are right, I'm not going to bother to respond to "Guest" postings any longer, unless the guest identifies themselves as you did.  I forget to log in sometimes but I always put Lizbeth as Guest when I do.    There is no way to identify one guest from another so I'm just going to ignore them, especially since they seem to act like "N's" when their view of the world is questioned.  I know from all my reading here and other places that the best thing to do with an N is to play by the NO CONTACT rule and ignore them.

Did not mean to stir up such a hornet's nest but it sure has been an eye opener.

P.S.  I don't have my PM turned on, sorry.  Will have to look into doing that now that I feel a little more secure here.