Confronting a person with boundary confusion

[cats paw]

Hi, GS-

  Since this topic is still going strong, would you be willing to give a synopsis of the story of your relationship with your friend?

  If you're not wanting to do that, it's ok, I'm just interested in the story in its entirety, from the beginning.

  I also wanted to say that there was a lot that Bean had to say that made sense to me.
 
cats paw
 

[lighter]

AHHHHH Blech.... going to teh shoilin temple and paying 2500.00 for information he doesn't wish to impart on anyone who doesn't want to receive it, lol.

Hee!

Like you'll rethink your position!?!??

Now....



Or.....


even  better....


feel guilt about qeustioning his motives and generous offer

Blech!

Ptuey!

::Blowing big phat raspberry:: : -{***

[Certain Hope]

Dear GS,

You are so welcome... I'm glad, too! 
Trying to understand matters like this with an aware, balanced view is a new thing for me, too.
Till now, I've always just flown by the seat of my pants, so to speak, so this is just another one of those Late-Bloomer lessons that it seems to be time to face square-on...
to be more purpose-full  - not just falling into relationships, but choosing friends with more deliberate awareness of the dynamics and individual needs. Wow, that still blows me away... that it's okay for each of us to have needs!!

All together, your summary of this situation with Paul rings true in both my heart and mind, GS. He's not a bad guy, just not a wise choice for friendship, is what I'm hearing.  It just fits, plain and simple.

Still facing some similar boundary confusions with an old friend who continues to write me, looking to re-establish contact... and I'm not sure yet whether I'm able to continue relating to her without falling back into old patterns, so... this really helps.
It's a tough decision to make when you're a recovering fixer/helper and know that the other person is hurting.
Next thing, I'm thinking of doing some more research, Biblically based, on how to make wise choices re: friendships and take it from there. Of course, a list of desireable traits would be helpful, too... straightforward and self-aware are good ones you've mentioned. This will take some time and more consistent work, but it's all good, so.. thank you!

Your friend,
Hope

[Gaining Strength]

Cat's Paw

would you be willing to give a synopsis of the story of your relationship with your friend?

It's not really a relationship, more of an acquaintence actually.  We have some friends in common and that's how we met.  He was married at the time but his wife  left him last summer.  I spelled out much of our "relationship" on page 3, reply 43, next to the last one on that page.  There is really not much to it.

I actually posted about him back in March and quoted an e-mail then.  I got alot of reactions similar to this time.  Here is part of what he wrote then:

Do not be afraid of love, it is not the kind of romantic jealously that most
people call love. It is the deep abiding love from the heart that does not
require anything in return.
 
 
I do not seek rewards on this earth, things that we think that we own are only
ours for this lifetime. ... Open your  heart to me and I will fill you with
love. This will not cost you anything, and will not prevent you from following
any path you choose. I will not demand that you see me exclusively or love only
me. If you meet someone that cares for you and loves you I will only be happy
for you.

I got this e-mail in March and we have e-mailed several times since and then I ran into him a couple of weeks ago.  The last time I remember seeing him before July was in February.  Not exactly a regular encounter.


Certain Hope -

Still facing some similar boundary confusions with an old friend who continues to write me, looking to re-establish contact... and I'm not sure yet whether I'm able to continue relating to her without falling back into old patterns, so... this really helps.

  I really understand how this is a concern.  It is the old patterns that are so important to change, especially our own patterns - for me, that means my patterns of reaction to things.  That is why it is so helpful to learn how to do things differently.

[teartracks]

Hi GS,

Certain Hope - thanks for sticking with me on this.  It has been such a helpful exchange.  I have grown enough and healed enough to learn some lessons I didn't learn earlier in life.  This thread has been like going back to teenage years and learning how to navigate social waters.  I feel like I am doing it much better.  I know why I get hung up on certain things - old habits from growing up N. 

In this case Paul said some things and meant another and when I pointed my flashlight on it the meaning and intent shifted.  I don't think he is malicioius but wounded.  We all are wounded but how that wound manifests in our day to day life is the question.  And for what ever reason Paul is not as aware of the consequences of his wounds as he thinks.  He really is a kind person but not as straightforward nor as self-aware as I would like.  Those two issues are significant for me because of my history with Ns.  He is not an N but the Ns in my life were anything but straightforward and wholly lacking in self-awareness and the result of those issues has been significant pain and suffering for me.  Now I can identify those issues with the help of you and others here.  That is very, very good news and a great comfort and encouragement to me.  Thanks ever so much for sticking with me to sort this out.

your friend - Gaining Strength

I am so glad that CH and others are helping you lay stepping stones to understanding.  I wish I were  more help, but on the man/woman stuff, my advice you DON'T want!  I'll be reading along with interest.  It's been fun these last few months sharing your aha monents, GS.

tt

[Gaining Strength]

on the man/woman stuff, my advice you DON'T want! 

LOL tt.  That bad huh?

It's been fun these last few months sharing your aha monents, GS.

Thanks tt.  I am so very, very thankful.  Today I made yet another stride.  I faced a very old issue that I have tried and tried to deal with but each and every time I found myself overwhelmed with shame and anxiety and was paralyzed to take action.  But today I got to work and made some progress.  That was good but the amzaing thing was that none of the old shame etc was triggered.  That is a progress that I long feared I would never see.   I am certain that I got there by BELIEVING that I would.  Changing my thoughts has really begun to change my life.  I am just simply amazed and unbelievably thankful.  It feels nothing short of miraculous.

[cats paw]

GS,

  Thanks for posting that - it sure brought clarity to the rest of what you've said.

   I just figured out- TODAY- that I needed to be logged in to read all previous posts by members.  So when you refer to page 43, I assume it's page 43 of your posts?  I'm going to go look.

cats paw

[Gaining Strength]

No, no Cat's Paw.  That's page 3 of this thread and the reply number 43.  It's the one next to the bottom.

[cats paw]

GS-

  Thanks.  I did read that, yet the last excerpt you posted from what he said makes the picture more complete.

   When you posted about this before, was this one of the things that sparked a discussion about monogamy?  I seem to vaguely remember a board discussion when I was just a lurker. 

   What I think is pretty cool, though, is that you're being more open to life and the resultant things to deal with- which you seem to be doing just fine with.

cats paw

[Ami]

Dear GS,
 Paul's initial emails sound "good" and "pure" on the surface,but don't "feel" right to me. They feel like he is trying to rope you in .
   It does not sound "real"  to me. Just an impression, GS                          Love  Ami

[Bella_French]

Hi GS, Sorry I haven't posted on this thread lately, but I have been reading it. You have seemed to be on top of things and received really insightful advice, I feel.

Paul seems to be very interested getting the upper hand in his friendship with you, don't you think?  He seems to intuitively sense that the key to getting the upper hand with you is to get you to forfeit your boundaries, if not convince you that you are downright faulty for having any. I think what hes doing, unconsciously or otherwise, is trying to get to a place with you where you are vulnerable and defer to his way of thinking. Maybe he thinks physical intimacy or sex will give him the leverage he needs. But anyway, I think its really about power. Why do you think he wants power in your relationship? Could it be his natural impulse, or do you think he is challenged by your way of thinking and lack of deference  and has become insecure? Or some other reason? Its food for thought.

Gaining Strength, I feel that you may be able to get what you want from your friendship with Paul, so long as you are aware of the power struggle, and never let him get the upper hand. You might even teach him something, which could be the basis of his fascination with you. I don't think you have to be afraid of Paul; just be aware that he's trying (unsuccessfully) to win a power struggle. If it that is too boring and tiring for you to put up with, I can totally understand.

X Bella

[Certain Hope]

I do not seek rewards on this earth, things that we think that we own are only
ours for this lifetime. ... Open your  heart to me and I will fill you with
love. This will not cost you anything, and will not prevent you from following
any path you choose. I will not demand that you see me exclusively or love only
me. If you meet someone that cares for you and loves you I will only be happy
for you. [/i]

I got this e-mail in March .....

Dear GS,

I was away from the board in March and never saw this one... oy vey.  ((((((((GS)))))))))  I'm with you on changing reactions to these things!
He may be reluctant to make "demands", but he sure has no trouble ignoring your attempts at subtle boundary enforcement.
I wouldn't want to have to spell everything out to somebody time after time... AND... and and... sometimes I think these "easy going" ones with no demands just want to ensure that nobody makes any demands on them!  And that's another 2 cents worth from me 

Love,
Hope

[Hopalong]

Hi GS,
When he gave me the iggghhs it was when Paul said:
"I will only impart the knowledge to..." etc.

I'm just not comfortable with people who say things like:
I will impart the knowledge.

The pretentiousness of it bowls me over.

Hops

[Bella_French]

LOL. I agree Hops. Those condescending remarks rub me up the wrong way too.

[towrite]

GS - I hear a blurring of his own boundaries covered with some "spiritual" prose which he seems to think is lyrical. IMO he's looking for someone to merge with so he doesn't have to deal with his own boundary issues. Don't you think you're irritated 'cuz this is too similar to your mom? Yet it's not the same - he's not your mom and his boundary violations are not as blatant - but it's still violation of you.

towrite