MrT: My N parents want to see me after 3 years of no contact

[mrt]

Help! -My N parents want to see me after three years of estrangement. (via emails -cause I won't give them my phone number)
I had finally calmed downed and was getting on with my life. Now I am a nervous wreck again! I'm 40 years old and the father of four and happily married. I'm trying to put on a brave front in front of my wife and kids - but they know this is bothering me because I keep biting their heads off.

My dad is fighting cancer and has masses of tumors from head to toe. He wants to see me before he starts "losing his hair from chemo."
I'm at a loss to know what to do. We have a lot of resentment and anger towards each other and I don't know if I can just "see" him without getting into an quarrel or going passive aggressive. I know my mother will start asking all the whys and what did we do to you for you to ignore us for three years -  kind of questions. This will lead to me just wanting to bitch slap her. I just can't see a reunion without somebody getting their eyes poked out    or me having to go to surgery to have my tongue reattatched because I bit it clear off!
   
I really don't want them back into my life. They always pull this crap before Christmas and I've come to despise this time of year because of them.  
I know I need to see my father before he passes so I won't have that guilt on my conscience. But I can already see signs of future crap just in a few lines of email.
I know that I am going to be blamed for his cancer. I can hear it now, It will be my fault that he has it because of the way I treated him and my mother and blah blah blah. When he dies I know my mother is going to yell at me at some point. "YOU KILLED HIM!!!" "His only crime was loving you and all you did was treat him like shit!" Why can I hear this stuff in my head before it even happens?
Perhaps they will pretend like nothing has happened these past three years and will want to go on  from there. But, where can "We" go when I don't want to go anywhere?

Any visits with them,  I will have to do by myself or with a few of my kids that don't hate them already. My wife refuses to have anything else to do with them ever and she means EVER! They burned that bridge  a long time ago. They are going to be offended when they see my house is divided against them and whine till me ears bleed about how I've "taught my kids to hate them or that my wife is being childish and blah blah blah."

Should I go to their house and be in their kingdom or should I invite them over to my house? -  which curiosity is killing them cause they've never been invited over  since I moved back and bought this home several years ago? or should we meet in a public place?  - I doubt they would go.  If they were in my kingdom then I would feel more in control. But then they might criticize my home  or get jealous over it and start something dreadful.    Hopefully they will feel uncomfortable and not stay long.
I really just don't have any idea if I can be civil towards them and I really don't want to kick them while he is down.
I'm torn apart trying to figure out how to handle this whole situation. If they are back in my life then my self absorbed, jealous, and highly competitive sister will think she can just waltz in too. They will also expect me to want to have contact with my weird brother, go to church, and blah, blah, blah.
 I want my peace back. Why won't they go away? Who are these people? I don't even know them anymore. If they weren't related to me I would never choose to know them at all.

All this negative talk about them makes me feel bad - as though I don't have the strength of character to say something nice about 'em. Or something is horribly wrong with me 'cause I can't deal with my family.

What to do..... H E L P ! ! !

MrT

[Cadbury]

This is a difficult situation for you and I sympathise. As to what to do, I loved my father with my whole heart, but his parents thought it would be too painful for me to see him as he lay dying so I never got to say goodbye. I have got over that and I loved my father! So if you have the feelings you described for your father it won't be impossible to get over it of you don't go and see him.

Really, if you don't think either of them have changed then what will seeing him do? He will still be the same man who made you so unhappy for your whole life, except now he will also be ill. I think you are right in thinking that your parents will just use it to have a go at you and make you feel bad. Whether you see him or not, he will still die. If your memories of him now are bad ones, seeing him won't get you any good ones, so maybe continuing with no contact (however hard that may be) is the best thing for your own health and sanity. A father is more than just genes, so if your father has never made you feel good, then leave him to die in the kind of peace he has made for himself. You other family members are unlikely to change their opinion of you simply because you go to visit him. It could make your life more difficult in a sense as you may find it more difficult to refuse to give your contact details when face to face with your family. I don't know what would be best, just don't feel you have to see him just because he is so ill.

Good luck and keep us posted.

[Anonymous]

Mr T!   Howdy, long time no see. But oh dear.   Well.

All this negative talk about them makes me feel bad - as though I don't have the strength of character to say something nice about 'em.

Forget that commandment about honouring them. And it isn’t “strength of character” that makes people tell lies. It’s wishing to conform to common thoughts and conditioning. You don’t have to. Be true to yourself….

Here’s what I see. Your father is probably going to die sooner rather than later. He wants to see you. If you don’t see him, it sounds as though you’ll feel guilty?

Choice: either see him and suffer the consequences, or don’t see him and suffer whatever you will feel. Will you go to his funeral? Answering this question might help with your current questions.

An option I see: arrange to see your father, alone, just the two of you, on neutral ground. A coffee shop. A hotel. No mother, no other family. Set big boundaries. If he really wants to see you, he’ll agree. If there are other motives (your mother’s for example) he won’t. If you want to see him, you don’t have to get ‘involved’. You could do it as a gift to him. You can stay neutral too.

Think about the practical side to this, keep the emotions to one side. Write down the options, a for/against list, like a work task. And talk to us! Nice to see you again Mr T…. Portia

[Anonymous]

mrt,

Don't worry about your character. You're fine. It's these people who are crazy.

Your father lost his privileges with you a long time ago. You can see him if you decide it's the right thing to do and when you have a support system to manage the trauma of it. Your first priority are your wife/children so if seeing your father would cause too much disruption in your home, don't do it.

My advice (take or leave..) is NOT to have them over to your house.

If your father dies it's not your fault. We all have to go sometime. I don't think you owe him anything but there are times when our feelings of guilt override that. If that's the case, please take care of yourself first and foremost.

bunny

[flower]

Hi MrT,

I feel for you. Maybe you could let your dad know that you want to use this opportunity to straighten things out just between the two of you with a counselor before his death. If you make it plain that you can only see him in the presence of a counselor, that might cool his jets about getting together. If he refuses to do something like that -- on your terms, closure etc. -- than you may not feel guilt at all about not seeing him. Who knows, he may want to see you bad enough to see you on your terms. Your dad has responsibility in the relationship too. It can't be all on you. My 2 cents

Also, why are these people so into appearances that you have to see him with his hair still on his head. This sounds like the manipulative technique of rushing a person into making a decision. "Limited time offer!" Gets a person off balance to have to rush into a decision. My Nmom's favorite technique, I think.

[Anonymous]

Cadbury, Thank you for your advice. You are right I really don't know why I should see him after these years. I guess I want to fight. Perhaps I want to act like I care for his sake to protect him to the fact that I'm numb after all these years and I really don't "feel" anything. Why would I still want to shield him?

Portia, Hi sassy lady! I know it has been awhile - I guess  I ran out of words to say,  so I quit saying anything  - It's a guy thing!  
 
Thanks for your advice too.
I have been making a list and putting him off. (I've got a cold! hack hack   )
I think I will just bite the bullet and go see him after I load up on some vallium or vodka!

Bunny,
Thank you for your advice too. After much consideration I will not be inviting them over to my house. That is my family's sactuary and I won't allow it to be violated.

Flower,
Thanks for your two cents too.
You are correct in stating that the hair thing is manipulative. That's exactly what I thought too.  I've been putting him off for now - I ain't in no hurry. Regarding a counselor - Yeah that's gonna happen!    I wish both him and my mother would go see someone but they would never admit they even had a problem in the first place.

Well ladies,
It seems you all have different opinions on what I should do. You are collectively similiar voices from each corner of my head. I appreciate your thoughtful analysis of my problem and thanks for taking time out of your life to aid me in this time in my life.

Today -  here's what I think I'm gonna do:
I will not invite them over to my house.
I will not rush over there - It may be a week or two.
I will not be ambushed at their home - so I'm gonna drop by unexpectedly - just like they use to do.
I will take a vallium or suck some sauce before I go over there and will just get it over with and not worry about the next time or such or fights etc.
I will bite my tongue but not let them get away with too much.
If they start an attack I will leave immediately.  

I'm not afraid of them. I guess I'm  dread the drama.

Whaddaya think?
Any words of wisdom before I go?

MrT

[bludie]

Thank you for sharing this portion of your life with us, Mr. T. For what it's worth, I am thinking of Stephen Covey's 7 Habits of Highly Effective People slogan: "Begin with the end in mind."

What do you see or envision as happening? How would YOU like this experience to go? How can you set yourself up for success?

Sounds like you've thought it through and have some boundaries in mind. And if all the best laid plans are put asunder (Ns have a way of dashing them within seconds, I've found) then do the best you can. I am a firm believer that we do the best we can with what we've got at the time.

However it goes, you can choose to learn from this experience. The passing of a parent is no small situation (I experienced my N-father's death nearly 5 years ago -- am still processing the aftermath) and I applaud your willingness to walk through this and not hide.

Good luck and let us know how it goes....

[Portia]

Hi Mr T. I like the dropping by unexpectedly. That sounds cool to me. Retain control. I’d have to!

Words of wisdom?   Ha ha, if it was me, this is what I’d say to myself, okay?  Speak little. Listen very carefully to what is actually said, not what you think they’ve said.

Ask questions, don’t make statements.

Stay cool, in control of yourself, if you are emotional, accept it and analyse yourself on the spot (why am I angry? why am I hurt?). Even if you receive hurt, you don’t have to retaliate. If they attack, say, I feel attacked, I wonder why I feel like this? Could you do that? I couldn’t!   But I might bear it in mind.

It’s only a couple/few minutes/hours out of your life.

Imagine we’re all standing around you, protecting and willing you on to a conclusion which is okay for everyone. (This is probably a conclusion where they feel they’re okay, you don’t agree, but you don’t tell them.) lots of good wishes and support Mr T, P

[Ellie as guest]

Hi MrT,
Perhaps evaluating your true feelings towards your parents may help.

I have been on a jounrey this year to fully separate from my evil Nparents. I didn't realize how far I had gone on my journey until yesterday. I received an email from a dear friend whose father was dying. She was rushing to see him before he passed.

As I read the email, I had these troubling questions pop in my mind:
1. Why would anyone rush to see a dying parent?
2. What wonderful relationship must have transpired between them to sadden her so in his last days?
3. What must it be like to be close to a parent and want to share their last days with them?
4. What do you say to your dying parent in their last days?
5. How can a death of a parent be a sad occassion?
etc, etc, etc

As I thought these questions through it dawned on me that I have no feelings towards my Nparents anymore. It was a relief to know that I have no feelings of commitment to them.

If I got the call today like my friend, I would have no guilt in telling my family I do not wish to be a participant in my Nparent's last days. They ruined every effort I made while they were alive to have a respectable relationship - I do not want to spend another moment of my life being harrassed, saddened, insulted, embarrassed by such evil people.

Life is too short - your life is what's important. Live it as you want. Be happy being yourself. Be content in the knowledge that you have matured much farther than your parents will be able.

Be alive, feel alive. Your dad wants to share his misery in dying with you. He may project his fear of dying and resentment to your living on you and it could be even worse than it is now.

Just my opinion, but I am quite numb to my Nparents anymore.

[flower]

I will not be ambushed at their home - so I'm gonna drop by unexpectedly - just like they use to do.

We did the drop by unexpectedly thing before we broke regular contact with my Nparents. I think it was the last time I went to their home. They used to do the drop by thing many times in the morning when we were still in our pajamas. They full well knew our schedule.  Anyway, I think dropping by put things on a different footing...especially seeing my parents with their  hair (ha ha) all messed up and such. It could give you an advantage.  Just a short visit on your way somewhere else that you have to be at by a  certain time could also be a good idea.

I went through my  journal notes I took about encounters with my N parents to see the entry about us dropping by their house and the search brought back some strong feelings. I made a journal in which I noted the date/initiator/event/ and attitudes and details of contact (manipulations etc) with my N parents to see patterns etc.  That journal really helped me make my decision to stop contact and kept things straight about the twisted N encounters. I started that journal in January of 2003 but had been taking notes since about the summer  of 2001. ( the horror of their 50th anniversary)

Best wishes, please let us know how it goes. We could learn something from your experience.

[Anonymous]

I still haven't made it over there.
I am actually physically ill. I had to go to the doctor last Friday. I have bronchitus and a terrible cough. On top of everything else I keep having stomach aches and acid reflux problems. My wife thinks it is because of them. I'm beginning to suspect it too.
I am not going over there until I am better - I wouldn't want to give a weakened cancer patient some virus or such. My mother would think that I did it on purpose for sure.
He keeps emailing me and asking if I'm still sick.
This situation is getting stressful. I'm sick and not getting better and I have been getting pressure since before Thanksgiving to not be sick. I know they think I'm blowing them off which is not true. I should be used to that by now - them thinking something that isn't true and not believing me.

until later
MrT

[ShayeBaby]

Mr. T: well, i have two separate views on your situation and they are both opposite! So as weird as it is i'm sending along both. Maybe one will feel more right to you over the other.

i think i have two opposite replies because i don't know your family history and how abusive the man has been to you. i also don't know if you have even an iota of loving feeling for him in your heart. So i guess each reply reflects those opposing possibilities.    

i hope you will be ok with whatever you choose to do and feel good about it after.


Scenario One:

Have those few drinks and stop in for just 1/2 hr. or so minimum. Be nothing but kind (the booze with make it doable).Make it clear in some diplomatic way that you are there to see him because he is so ill/before he passes so he knows its a one off.

You did your part to show up for a dying man at his request and you don't have to become re-involved with him or any extended family beyond the email you are already doing.

Also, don't give out any phone numbers or contact info. that they did not have prior to your visit.  


Scenario Two:

If you are dreading going there so much that you would need to numb yourself with a tranq. or booze, which who could blame you, then maybe you should not go.

When you go see someone who is dying it is supposed to be an extremely sacred time where loving things and feelings transpire emotionally.If you are going with it in mind to get out of there as soon as possible and in a numb state of mind to cover up feelings that are exactly the opposite, then ask yourself _why_ are you even going.  

For appearances? To appease them? What i'm saying is that if there are no genuine loving feelings of wanting to be with or see your dad before he dies, then _why_ go through a whole charade??

You reap what you sow in life and if he was such a poor father to you then he has sowed this result at the end of his life. It's not vindictive or "bad" on your part at all. it is just how you feel, and this is rightful,  after a lifetime of horrible, damaging treatment.  

i say protect yourself. You can say whatever you want to say to your dad about the end of his life thru the same means as you have been doing already which is email.

i have this opinion only because if your dad is dying and you still want so much not to go see him at such a time then you really do have your answer wrapped up in your feeling.

if you want to go to start a fight like part of you may feel like, well i say don't go for that reason for sure. You'd probably feel worse after he passed then if you hadn't even gone at all, and you'd be hearing it from your family forever.

You might hear it from your family just from not going too, but i say that it is the time in your life to take care of _you_.  if you feel anything caring at all in your heart for your dad still then maybe go in peace (with that drink or two... or 3 in you!) if you truly feel nothing- i wouldn't go for any kind of external reasons.  

By the way in regards to being sick and not wanting to go, i'm just getting over the worst hell bronchitis and believe me when I tell you that feeling bad can last up to 3 months    But seriously stress makes it worse for sure and I was going thru stress that prolonged it and this stress about your family can prolong yours too.

[bunny]

[

He keeps emailing me and asking if I'm still sick.

I'm very familiar with this. My H was constantly sick so he could avoid  seeing his N-mother. She guilt tripped him about being sick and there was enmeshment and wierdness around illness...anyway....here is what I can tell you:

(1) You are sick because your body is telling you not to see them.
(2) Your mind has decided to see them due to obligations/duty, which is reasonable. But your body hasn't agreed to this.
(3) You should not see your father when you're sick, that would be bad for all concerned. I think everyone agrees on that.
(4) Your father has become a nag about "are you still sick?" which is intrusive and makes your body even more reluctant to see him.
(5) You need strategies to deal with this guilt and pressure. There are ways to act toward people, even if you feel differently inside, that make them back off. I think adults really need to have a grab-bag of strategies for self-protection.
(6) Do you have a therapist right now? This is a crisis and it would really help. If you have a former therp, can you call him/her?

bunny

[flower]

This situation is getting stressful. I'm sick and not getting better and I have been getting pressure since before Thanksgiving to not be sick. I know they think I'm blowing them off which is not true. I should be used to that by now - them thinking something that isn't true and not believing me.

until later
MrT

Hi MrT,

I got the pressure to be well  too. It was stressful. I feel a little nauseated just thinking about what it is must be like for you because of what I've been through with my parents' past pressure to be well. Seems kind of like there is a double bind going on here in more than one way.
Wishing you the best.

[mrt]

This is for everyone that wanted me to keep them posted.

Well, I finally made it over to my parents house!  
A week prior to this my dad sent me an quick email telling me that he had just gotten out of the hospital's intensive care and almost died but was doing fine. (He had developed internal bleeding kept passing out. - I found out during the visit)
I ignored it 'cause I still didn't want to go over just yet. I didn't know how to respond. I had suspicion that the email was to induce guilt and to get me over there quicker even though I didn't doubt that he was telling the truth about being in intensive care. It's weird how numb I am and how reluctant I was about going over there.

I made my son go with me. He is eight. I wanted to reintroduce him to his grandparents 'cause he didn't remember them. I left my coat on the whole time I was there. I didn't want them to see my flabby stomach and comment on how fat I've gotten. They seemed to be smirking at me anyway. My dad got up and left the room for a moment while we were chatting and I kept looking out of the corner of my eye to make sure he didn't come back with a gun, or axe, or bat etc. I was getting nervous and paranoid. He came back in and sat back down empty handed. To my great relief. You just never know. I was thinking...He has nothing to lose and knows my wife has a lot and they would love to see her suffer.  

They were civil &  polite.  They carefully negotiated all my triggers and mainly talked about themselves as though they are just having a bad few months.  We mainly chatted. I wanted to talk seriously about what's going to happen to my mother if he dies. I wanted to ask them what they are going to do about living arrangements if he loses his job and parsonage.

Well we didn't. I heard the tales and woes of the cancer and it's treatment. He has tumors from head to toe but seems to portray it as just temporary. Instead they talked about the new stuff they had bought. They showed me the new truck sitting in the garage unused 'cause they drive the other one but had also mentioned that he can't drive due to loosing use of his hands (a problem he developed  just a few months prior to the cancer) They showed me the improvements done to the house,(it's not their house!!! ???) They asked me about paint colors for the wall.
They told me about my sister and her kids, and my brother and his kids. They never asked about my wife or daughters.  They told me about all the people they knew that had cancer.
After awhile my son grew restless and I could tell my dad was getting tired.
I left there elated that it was over. Perplexed at what they didn't say. Bewildered at the denial and how they were acting. It was a surreal moment in my life. Of course they want future contact and I was asked for my phone number under the pretense that it is for emergency purposes. (it better be!! )
Anyway. That is where I stand at the moment. Relieved that I did make it over there but confused at why they wanted me to come for a visit if they are living like nothing is wrong and have nothing to worry about. I suspect I know why. I'll see soon enough I reckon.

MrT