Voicelessness and Emotional Survival > Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
What gives you your sense of self worth
Hopalong:
--- Quote ---....perhaps I need to just focus on how the person makes me feel, intentionally or otherwise? I think focusing on me rather than them is the bit I struggle with.
--- End quote ---
Boy, can I relate. I am so so fragile sometimes when it comes to friendship, particularly with women, that when a friend is unresponsive (or chooses the shallow track when I'm eager for depth) it activates such oooooooold deep bruises. I will pace my house muttering about what's wrong with them and nurse my hurt and it just feels AWFUL.
This year I've been working through something entirely inside myself about one friendship I struggled with whether to abandon or dump. This person and I bonded intensely over our Nmothers about 10 years ago. She was eager to get together fairly regularly and expressed strong affection and interest in our close friendship ("sisters"). Then...her aged Nmother moved to town. My friend ballooned, withdrew, got depressed (all of which I totally understood) AND completely dropped any effort to connect. She was happy to see me on rare occasions but never, ever would initiate beyond the vague-est ("We must get together") kinds of texts. Would send a "ping" of a signal but shy away from committing to a 3-D visit. I began to feel as though she only reached out when SHE needed ME. (I still think that's true but am in a different place about it today.)
Unfortunately, her crisis and depression overlapped mine. And I felt so hurt I might as well have been 8 years old again, surrounded by Mean Girls who kept their backs to me.
So, now it's several years after the rhythm and reliability of that relationship changed. It was a struggle but I eventually realized that the only way I could continue to enjoy her, because I do care about her (and her hubs)...would be to accept that friendship with her was not going to be 50-50. Ever. Not even 60-40, more like 80-20. But that when I do get together with her/them there's going to be a lot of pleasure in talk (both very smart) and she and I share so much history and knowledge of each other that there's still value in that familiarity.
I think the most important thing was realizing that she couldn't help it. She is wired the way she's wired and she just didn't need me as much as I needed her. I can be angry about it or go find other friends to meet my closeness needs. Over time, that's what I've done, and some of the new friends I've made in the last few years have made me realize it's never too late to make a friend and there's always the possibility of Real Sharing. I just have to offer it but not get angry and ancient-bruise-hurt when someone isn't available for it.
(Or if I do...recognize that that emotional response belongs to me, not them.) It's been brutal inner work but I really have made progress.
You are too, Tupp. Recognize that the disappointment, abandonment and sheer pain you're feeling are real. They don't have to be "justified". There's no courtroom with barristers pitching a case for who's "right." You just feel as you feel, and it's real and you can recognize the feelings, hang onto yourself when they ride through.
I've been learning mindfulness meditation from a Great Courses DVD series. It's all evidence-based (science) rather than any woo. One of the things I realize, from the Harvard professor's narration...is that it actually has a great deal to say about relationship, and being human. I'm liking it a lot. Scattered and spotty about the practice so far, but even brief minutes of it change my day.
Love to you,
Hops
Twoapenny:
--- Quote from: Hopalong on September 24, 2016, 12:04:26 PM ---
--- Quote ---....perhaps I need to just focus on how the person makes me feel, intentionally or otherwise? I think focusing on me rather than them is the bit I struggle with.
--- End quote ---
Boy, can I relate. I am so so fragile sometimes when it comes to friendship, particularly with women, that when a friend is unresponsive (or chooses the shallow track when I'm eager for depth) it activates such oooooooold deep bruises. I will pace my house muttering about what's wrong with them and nurse my hurt and it just feels AWFUL.
This year I've been working through something entirely inside myself about one friendship I struggled with whether to abandon or dump. This person and I bonded intensely over our Nmothers about 10 years ago. She was eager to get together fairly regularly and expressed strong affection and interest in our close friendship ("sisters"). Then...her aged Nmother moved to town. My friend ballooned, withdrew, got depressed (all of which I totally understood) AND completely dropped any effort to connect. She was happy to see me on rare occasions but never, ever would initiate beyond the vague-est ("We must get together") kinds of texts. Would send a "ping" of a signal but shy away from committing to a 3-D visit. I began to feel as though she only reached out when SHE needed ME. (I still think that's true but am in a different place about it today.)
Unfortunately, her crisis and depression overlapped mine. And I felt so hurt I might as well have been 8 years old again, surrounded by Mean Girls who kept their backs to me.
So, now it's several years after the rhythm and reliability of that relationship changed. It was a struggle but I eventually realized that the only way I could continue to enjoy her, because I do care about her (and her hubs)...would be to accept that friendship with her was not going to be 50-50. Ever. Not even 60-40, more like 80-20. But that when I do get together with her/them there's going to be a lot of pleasure in talk (both very smart) and she and I share so much history and knowledge of each other that there's still value in that familiarity.
I think the most important thing was realizing that she couldn't help it. She is wired the way she's wired and she just didn't need me as much as I needed her. I can be angry about it or go find other friends to meet my closeness needs. Over time, that's what I've done, and some of the new friends I've made in the last few years have made me realize it's never too late to make a friend and there's always the possibility of Real Sharing. I just have to offer it but not get angry and ancient-bruise-hurt when someone isn't available for it.
(Or if I do...recognize that that emotional response belongs to me, not them.) It's been brutal inner work but I really have made progress.
You are too, Tupp. Recognize that the disappointment, abandonment and sheer pain you're feeling are real. They don't have to be "justified". There's no courtroom with barristers pitching a case for who's "right." You just feel as you feel, and it's real and you can recognize the feelings, hang onto yourself when they ride through.
I've been learning mindfulness meditation from a Great Courses DVD series. It's all evidence-based (science) rather than any woo. One of the things I realize, from the Harvard professor's narration...is that it actually has a great deal to say about relationship, and being human. I'm liking it a lot. Scattered and spotty about the practice so far, but even brief minutes of it change my day.
Love to you,
Hops
--- End quote ---
Yes I've nodded all the way through that, Hops! Particularly about people reaching out when they need you; I think that's been the basis for a lot of my relationships over the years. I'm starting to think/feel that........... my tendency to do everything in my head (rather than in my heart) and my sort of blank canvas personality (necessary for mother to take what she needed on demand) has meant that I just sort of soak up other people when it's convenient for them. Looking back over the years most of my friendships existed only within the realms of the environment at the time (school, uni, work) and didn't survive beyond that. When I had my son there were a lot of new friendships created through mum and baby groups but none of these carried on after the mums went back to work. Similarly I meet people now via disability groups but they only want 'friends' during the day when their husbands and real friends are at work.
I think perhaps I need to 'go selfish' for a few months and really focus on myself and nobody else (apart from my boy). Try some new hobbies, try and get involved in some group things (and try to focus on just doing things with others rather than wanting to make friends). I do really need to focus on my health; I am so wiped out it's taking every ounce of effort just to get out of bed. I do think some of that's to do with the menopause so I'm seeing the doctor tomorrow to talk about whether an anti anxiety/anti-depressant or some sort of hormone help would be beneficial. But I also think I need to work on hobbies and interests, try and meet some new people (just to practise talking to new people skills) and just try not to be so dependent on other people making me feel better about myself.
Love to you, too xx
Hopalong:
You're thinking very rationally, sanely, imo Tupp. I like this a lot:
--- Quote ---focus on just doing things with others rather than wanting to make friends
--- End quote ---
Children of Ns are all Cinderellas, and when we never (ever) get the carriage, ball, and prince...I think after a time, and particularly when Life is hitting us with so many pies in the face that we're choking...our needs really are big. And it takes big-hearted, big-minded, big-charactered people to see that and not run from it.
I think taking a just-doing-things-with-others approach in group situations for a while could be very tonic for you. When you go into a group with the Will They Like Me I Need a Friend thing zooming around and around your brain, it comes out of your body language and eyeballs. Most people, even good ones, do feel uncomfortable. (Alas.)
But when your focus is What Are We Going to Do Today? What Will I Learn While We're Doing This? Right, How Can I Help? (not drama, notice-this help, just...sure here's the tea). That's different. That's just being one puppy in the basket of puppies, alive, part of the pile. This may sound weird but I think you can rest in that.
Man, couldn't be much more incoherent if I tried. 'Sposed to be a poet! (Fail...)
That's why I'm making myself go back to church these days. I stopped for a loooooong time, as I don't enjoy our current minister. But I was really missing the human experience of sitting in the group. A good group. My peeps. So now I draw or (newly) meditate during his shallow sermons, but I'm breathing along with the sanctuary-full. I sit next to people, we have quiet moments, we hear music (great pianist), sometimes we stand up and sing, there are always some readings I like, the space and natural light are lovely, the "accent walls" are a blue I have always loved, some little kid has an amazing smile, some old one wears wacky scarves...some have lost unutterably, some are prosperous, some are poor, someone always hugs me, and some stray newcomer is always glad I say hello or show them where the coffee is.
That's really enough for me to require of religious community. I'm barely religious, but pretty embedded in that human group. Some of my best friendships (including the difficult one I chronicled--AND healthier more reciprocal ones) have come from there. But even when I'm not feeling closely connected, just the repeated ritual of the shared sitting...is comforting. I think it's good for me as an animal. Human animal. We need each other even when we can't get it right. We still do. Yielding to that need to let yourself exist in a group is healing. Painful sometimes, but still, it's strengthening your being in a way, I believe.
Perhaps a support group or AlAnon or other kind of group could come to feel the same way. As could shared volunteer groups, etc. Hope you'll find your way to some group things that meet that tribal need for you, Tupp. Support flows from that. The tribe needs to absorb you so they can. It's not even conscious to a group. You just keep turning up and you are a part of it.
love
Hops
Twoapenny:
I like the idea of being a puppy within a group of puppies, Hops :)
Your church situation sounds nice. It is difficult when one person unsettles a group. I've left a lot of things over the years because one or two people were just doing my head in. It is a shame when that happens. There are a few things going on that I'm going to go along to, even if it's just for half an hour (in fact, that appeals to me because it's fairly easy to do anything for half an hour, isn't it?). So yes, I'm going to try and just enjoy it for what it is and not be thinking about whether I'll make a new friend from it.
I have enjoyed being selfish today! Other than cooking up some nice food, I've done nothing but read, watch TV and nap and it's been lovely. I've resisted the temptation to make duty calls to people to show them how 'thoughtful' I am and that I haven't forgotten that something's happening in their life at the moment. I was scrolling through my phone and I did notice that I have different reactions to seeing people's names. Some people I just don't want to be in touch with anymore - there's just nothing there. Others I like but view as acquantainces rather than close friends and I think it's good to have some people like that in your life - meeting for a coffee friendships but not much more. Some made me feel angry and I think what's happened with some people is that they've been very keen to be around me when they're going through a difficult time but once the situation has improved they've dropped me. That's stirring up a lot of anger so I'm going to have to think that through a bit and work on letting it go. Not entirely sure what it all means but it will come in time.
lighter:
Tupp:
Maybe it will help if you write letters to the people you have anger towards. Of course you won't need to send them to internalize how you actually feel and make peace with.
((((Tupp))))
Lighter
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