Author Topic: Racism  (Read 1320 times)

Hopalong

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Racism
« on: June 16, 2020, 09:49:50 AM »
[responding to Tupp's description of racist behavior rising in the U.K.]

It's scary but if there's an optimistic way of looking at it, once seen it can't be unseen. I have been finding hope for the future in the fact that the glossing-over, the being civil-with-a-smile but legislating racist policies, is not going to fly any more. And the ANTI-racism protests exploding all over the world are a wonderful thing. "Let us realize the arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice.”--Martin Luther King

The "long" part is the hard part. But hope is in the bending. Civil unrest is scary always, and violence or looting never right....but the violent are the minority, imo.

Racism is exposed for its reality by the latest filmed police brutality exposing it to the world. And by smug white broadcasters saying outrageous things to black colleagues. The price paid is discomfort among those who can't choke out the phrase "white privilege" and who must squirm with the uncomfortable truth of what this country was built on and certainly in the U.S., that it's not fixed. Factors are different in the U.K., but it was abolitionist long before the U.S. The chances of reflection and change everywhere are increased by the painful exposure of how virulent racism is, I think.

And how STUPID it is, to be tribal based on skin color. The entire world and civilization are dragged down by that idiotic human trait...to blame the "other" rather than lift up everyone. And that who we vote for is like getting or fighting vaccines.

Still, I genuinely think that despite these scary and sad times with racist pustules blowing open everywhere (and amplified daily by technology that makes them immediate)....I think the trend is in the right direction. (Reminds me of the turning point in the Viet Nam war, the first time we watched war nightly on TV.)

We can't un-see what our own eyes have seen, or un-hear what our own ears have heard. As for civilization, my hope is that once naked, any emperor will be seen clearly. In this country, our emperor has been seen by the sane as a naked baby for quite a while (thank you, Brits, for the balloon!)

hugs and hope,
Hops

"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

mudpuppy

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Re: Racism
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2020, 09:05:17 PM »
No comment on the idea racism is pervasive nor even on the idea it is the biggest challenge facing black people* but I will only note this;
There is no evidence race or racism played any part in the death of George Floyd.
Likewise there is no evidence Chauvins's knee did. In fact there is evidence to the contrary; the ME found no evidence of asphyxiation or strangulation. That makes sense since our trachea is on the front of our neck while his knee was on the back of Floyd's.
George Floyd had a blood level of about three to four times the clinical therapeutic dose of Fentanyl. That is a rate considerably higher than has proved fatal in many cases. The primary risk from an overdose of Fentanyl is cardio-pulmonary arrest. The cause of death listed for George Floyd by the ME was cardio-pulmonary arrest while under police restraint. Not caused by police restraint but while restrained.
It is possible having Floyd prone and with his hands behind his back contributed to his death but it is just as possible he would have died even had they sat him up.
He was in the squad car at one point and said he couldn't breathe. They took him out of the squad car and took him to the sidewalk, He sat down and was unsteady and was still complaining that he couldn't breath. When they took him back to the car he nearly fell three times but he did still clearly resist the cops.
There is a very good chance his cardio-pulmonary arrest began before he was ever on the ground and because he had hypertension and heart disease he might very well have died regardless of what the cops did that day.
There is also a very good chance, due to the facts I cited above, that any halfway decent defense lawyer will be able to shred any attempt to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the cops caused his death. They may very well not have, or they may have contributed in a minor way. No one really knows for sure.
If that occurs how many more people are going to be killed and businesses and lives destroyed when people riot because the only thing they ever heard from the media is Chauvin murdered Floyd with his knee rather than the actual medical determinations?

*Nine unarmed black men were killed by cops in 2019. Of those six were determined to be justified. Of the remaining four all are either charged or under indictment.
On the weekend George Floyd died in Minneapolis 24 people were murdered in Chicago.
In 2018 7400+ black men were murdered in the US. Well over 90% of those were by other black men.
Which is the bigger problem for black citizens?

But nobody cares about those thousands because there isn't any political hay to be made with their lives so they end up in the potter's field. The country gets torn apart, and several black cops murdered I might add, so some well to do white people can feel better about themselves while the real things tearing black communities apart and killing black people by the thousand is ignored. Worse than ignored, the solution is a bunch of Marxist silliness about eliminating police departments and letting thousands of criminals out of jail. Who is that going to harm? The mayors and the celebrities and the wine sipping, virtue signaling crackers  living in their gated communities? Of course not. The people who catch the brunt of do-gooders do-gooding are never the do-gooders who slum it for a few hours to take a selfie while chuckin a brick and then scoot on home to the suburbs. It's the poor innocent black people who are the overwhelming victims of those predators who get let out of prison to ease some white bread's conscience.

mud

Hopalong

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Re: Racism
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2020, 09:51:01 PM »
This seems like a pretty balanced view of the two autopsies, imo:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/george-floyd-death-autopsies-homicide-axphyxiation-details/

As to the systemic impacts of centuries of systemic racism, I got nothin' new.
Thoughtful education about it is everywhere and easy to access. One of the first authors to broaden my understanding was Tim Wise.

hugs
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Meh

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Re: Racism
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2020, 03:36:09 PM »
I've not been following it all closely for various reasons. I do hear about it of course from people around.

The underlying narrative below all the media images as far as I can tell is always a question of what morsel is being fought over and who is going to get the biggest piece of it.

I'm not too keen on the whole situation because is it A) about racism B) about police brutality C) about immigration D) about defeating Republicans. Each one A & B & C & D, is enough on it's own. Smashing it all together and then sticking mob mentality, media and ancillary violent curb stomping into it, in my point of view is a mess.

I've got no intention of trying to unravel it right now.


lighter

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Re: Racism
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2020, 12:54:07 PM »
I've never understood why we HAVE to tick off boxes on forms, informing who knows who of the color of our skin.

WTH?

Why are we ticking boxes?

Why did we ever ever ever start ticking off boxes?

Madness. 

We're one human race, and we've always been ONE.

Lighter