The split over masks

[lighter]

A post about another "Karen" popped up today about an educate, identified by her initials, refusing to wear a mask at a local gym.

The poster offered her a mask, and she refused while citing all the scientific reasons for not wearing one, mixed with excuses about not being comfortable working out with a mask on.   Just a jumble of excuses and refusal to comply with what's now mandatory.... social distancing and wearing a mask in public. 

About an hour later another poster named the educator.  A quick google gave her place of work and everything you'd ever want to know about her job and history in public education.

There's contact information for her.  There's contact information for her boss.  It took 3 minutes to get these things.  I assume the post identifying her will be removed soon, if it's not already gone. 

I have a difficult time understanding why people aren't wearing masks in gyms and stores when it's mandatory. 

I have to say I wear a mask into restaurants, take it off to eat, then put it back on.  I'm conflicted about this.  It feeeels wrong.  Spending 5 hours at the party last night, with everyone maskless, felt wrong... it was dreamlike, but I did it with my mask tied around my wrist.  It actually matched my outfit. I wouldn't have minded wearing it.  I expected everone to wear one. 

I think we're used to seeing videos of conflict over masks, in both directions.  Violence, assaults, people coughing on babies and hoping children die..... and I was both surprised and confused at the post wasn't accompanied by a picture or video of the confrontation. 

When another poster named this woman.... it felt like a trainwreck.... I couldn't look away.  I wondered if it was turning into a lynching or a situation where she loses her job or if the members who named her will get kicked off the message board. 

I honestly don't know how this will go, and I don't know how it should go either.

People SHOULD follow the rules.  We aren't always going to, as I well know.  I'd be a tremendous hypocrite if I pretended I'm doing this perfectly myself.  I am not.

One thing I am, is shocked at the violent reactions of people on this topic.   I'm shocked to see people pepper spraying and throwing handicapped people to the floor with intent to do harm.

I keep going back to following the rules, most of the time, as the default CORRECT way to handle the situation.  If it's creating so much animosity it's turning going out into a life or death situation.... why not just wear a mask?

For some reasons it's worthy dying or killing or harming others over, rather than just wearing a darned mask or going around people refusing to wear one without consequence. 

I haven't turned on any news station other than Al Jazeera in a while.  Beirut's explosions were devastating and then I watched a some US face mask conflicts and thought...
What the hell? 

We can't handle wearing face masks.  Imagine if a large city was devastated by explosions, and financial devastation and lack of medical care and everyone finger point... errrr.... I guess we have some of those problems, but it seems like we're falling apart over small things, unable to focus and work on the larger issues.  Maybe that's part of the problem.  Folks can't see an end in sight, or they're positive there IS no virus...it's a hoax, or they've been convinced it's a personal assault on their freedoms to wear a mask when they don't believe in it.  Maybe they do.  I know some people believe this is a natural selection thing.... a purge of sorts.... nature culling the herd, and they don't feel they're going to be culled or care if some around them are culled.  Sort of dreadful, really. 

Thoughts on naming neighbors, educators and others on message boards for failing to wear a mask in gyms and stores?  I think the attitude and arguing, in the face of someone calmly requesting someone to wear a mask, is the thing that makes people write about it and name people. 

Lighter

[Hopalong]

Got nothing, Lighter.
I don't read those stories any more, too depressing.
Skimmed this with one eye shut.

I have the same frustration as (such as today) when I'm taking a safe, 6-8 foot distanced walk in the fresh air with a friend and either a runner or bikers come whooshing up behind, breathing within feet of us like bellows. "Thanks for the plume, folks...."

The degree of inconsiderateness is near-sociopathic, in my view. Particularly from the young and fit toward white-hairs trying to stay healthy....

No stores, no businesses, no restaurants for me. For the duration.

Hops

[Twoapenny]

Absolute no to naming people online.  It's the modern day equivalent of putting people in stocks so villagers can throw fruit at them and I find it both demeaning and dangerous.  Very passive aggressive behaviour and what if that lady has escaped domestic violence?  Rebuilt her life, got her confidence back, got a new job, working out at the gym helps her mental health but the mask induces a panic attack? Her name's out on the internet so that man she escaped can find her now.  Or some other weirdo now takes it upon himself to wait for her after work and 'teach her a lesson'.  People just don't think about other consequences. People's lives are complex and, for the most part, not known to strangers.  I find the judgement and the tones of superiority people are taking about this so publicly very worrying.  I equally find people not wearing them worrying, but none of us knows anyone else's situation.  I'm in the same boat as Hops; just avoiding public places as much as possible.  The library, osteopathy clinic and cinema are all taking very strict precautions and we can visit them all at quiet times as well so I feel safer including them in my bubble.

The whole mask wearing thing has been handled so badly it's no wonder people aren't doing it.  Neither of our governments took this seriously or took effective pre-emptive action.  Medical staff and other key workers have been forced to work through it without the correct PPE so you can see why people aren't taking it seriously.  It's a bit like telling someone to stop smoking while you puff on a fag.  There's no point making something mandatory if it can't actually be enforced and suddenly shop staff and waiting staff are being asked to act like security guards and mask monitors and are getting all sorts of abuse for it.  A lot of them are young and they're all on low wages.  I wouldn't want to have people screaming at me that they're not wearing it for x dollars an hour.  And the guidance is pointless; any protection a mask offers disappears as soon as people take them off to eat and drink so there's no point wearing them anywhere there's food and drink being consumed.  The whole thing is such a mess.  I am personally finding the internet so toxic now that I'm limiting to here and a quick browse through some docs and number crunchers I follow on Twitter to see where we're at with infections and numbers but other than that it's box sets and books for me.  And I cut the grass last night so I can add gardening to the list again now.  Lol.

[Twoapenny]

I should add that I mean all of that in a nice way; I feel I'm a bit shouty online at the moment so if that's the way that came across I'm sorry because it wasn't mean to

[sKePTiKal]

MOST of the mandatory mask regulations make an exception for people with a medical issue that makes wearing a mask, a health issue. How does anyone know if a maskless stranger has a health issue? or is being "inconsiderate" about other people's health?

Maybe they should wear a yellow star?

Honestly, some days it feels like our society is running headlong into that kind of situation again, for me. I get horrified and turn off the "box" for awhile.

I'm not perfect with the mask either Lighter. If I'm making a 5 min run into a non-crowded store... I may not bother. For me, it's the on/off/on/off that's annoying and the fact that I wear glasses and they can/do fog up. The numbers of cases in my state are so low, as to not bother me much when I do go out. It's probably more important to wash your hands first thing, when getting groceries put away, ya know? But across the state line - the small city I visit regularly has higher numbers of cases than most of my state. I try to be more vigilant there - even if others aren't. The bank still doesn't have an open lobby there yet; but our local one did - until someone tested positive and they went back to drive-up only.

As for the online stuff - the only places I hang out online still, are like here. There are only rarely actual disagreements, much less rabid dust-ups over little things like this. The intensity of animosity woven into politics these days has completely turned me off and I avoid expressing an opinion at all these days. Used to be one didn't discuss politics or religion (or sex) in polite company. I kinda miss those days when people actually had private lives and weren't castigated for not SHARING every single thing about themselves. Or thought they have a right to demand that other people be just like them... as if someone died and made them God.

[sKePTiKal]

I don't necessarily see individualism (depending on the current definition) as a problem - as long as it's not self-centered and uncaring/unconcerned about others and responsibility to one's community - large or small. There is no way I'd ever be (or have been) a herd mentality person... but that doesnt mean I simply don't care about others either.

Way too much either/or thinking going on in a lot of disciplines these days, instead of "and"... or degrees of scale... and it's creating some absurd leaps of "logic"... in people and especially online hyperbole. For instance, that if you don't wear a mask you want people to die, that kind of thing. Is it foolish and taking a risk - most definitely. But does that mean one is automatically heartless and cruel and a threat? That's kind of a stretch... given all the situational variables and suceptibility issues. Which is one reason I'm still wearing my mask a lot of places - who gets sick seems to be so blessed unpredictable and random. But that doesn't mean I'm in mortal fear of my life going out either.

[Hopalong]

Hit a new temporary nadir this morning when I read (and watched on Twitter) that our fearless leader gave two talks at factories lately (most recently Thursday) and the walk-out soundtrack blasting to introduce him was the Bond movie soundtrack:

Live and Let Die.

I
kid
you
not.

I do believe sociopathy is being modeled genuinely, from the top...and is thus echoing on view in less than half but an alarming percentage of the population, unfortunately. Health condition exceptions to mask wearing are real but rare and unfortunately, being milked for pot stirring, as I view it. (Whole bunch of online resistance, fake certificates that say you aren't required to wear one, etc.....)

Head back down,
Hops

[lighter]

Well, the rabid people refusing to wear masks had their say, then the rabid YOU HAVE TO WEAR MASKS OR YOU DON'T CARE! people had their say, then the "can't we regulate our emotions and have a civil discussion? people had their say. 

Nothing was resolved. 

The "Karen's" name remained on the board, and it's unclear whether or not she has health conditions requiring she not wear a mask, or not. 

I do know there are times I so desperately NEEEED to feel normal..... I make mistakes, like not wearing a mask in a room full of people not wearing masks.  Taking my mask off to eat in a restaurant... everyone else was. 

Are we sociopaths?  I don't think most of us are.  Are there sociopaths refusing to wear masks?  I'm sure, yes.

I think most of the people refusing are being influenced, and given permission to behave like sociopaths, as others have mentioned on the board. 

And Hops....
Live and Let Die.

Holy guacamole...
that
is....
words fail me. 

I'm grossed out by the men and women who find Trump a powerful, sexy creature, going against the swamp....
just....
I'd gag if I was brushing my teeth right now.

So. Gross. 

Gross is a good word.

Lighter