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Twoapenny:

--- Quote from: lighter on July 10, 2024, 09:12:34 PM ---You know, Tupp....it hit me last night.

What if...
I/certain others
hold an unconscious belief around
self care = doing for others?

I honestly get an endorphin surge when I do for others, think about it, plan it.....it occurred to me to do for others
after l was on the road 4 hours,
trapped in a truck stuffed with stinking trash after cleaning the lake house for 13 hours on top little sleep....running up stairs and down stairs.....many many very many many stairs....
Occurred to me that doing for others, in a time of intense fatigue/frustration/disappointment/problemwith housekeeping....to do for others, rather than self and I was focusing on self care!!
I realized....
part of my self care ritual is doing for others😬😵‍💫😵

Others.

Not myself.

Holy guacamole, Tupp.

I found myself

--- End quote ---

Yep, I definitely think doing for others can do really good things for ourselves.  I guess, as with everything, it's balance and whether what we do is appreciated, reciprocated - needed?  I think I can tip into enabling without noticing sometimes, and doing things for people that they could do for themselves.  Much less than I used to but even so, it can be a hard line to tread.  Doing really fun stuff for people can be great - organising a party or wedding entertainment, helping decorate a house for a homecoming, that sort of thing.  And doing helpful things when people really need it - yes, definitely.  I suppose it's the difference between that and being someone's emotional dumping ground, or endlessly cleaning up their mess (of any kind), or trying to save them and so on.  I guess it's all keeping a balance and keeping an eye on ourselves.

Funnily enough, I was thinking to myself today that I'm wondering if I need to limit my human interaction to half an hour at a time and see if that helps, because I just find myself feeling too tired after I'm with people to do anything else.  We did our early morning swim this morning which is very sociable and I do like seeing the other people there, but the chit chat was, I think, enough for the day.  But my son had a get together today and after catching up with everyone that was there one of the mums came back to mine for coffee.  We chatted for a while, then went back to collect our respective sons, chatted with everyone again before saying bye, and then had a long chat with a friend on the phone.  It's all been nice, friendly, amiable, no drama or unpleasantness, but I' m so tired now I'm struggling to even think about doing my evening routine.  Even watching a film feels like too much, I put my book down because I couldn't concentrate.  Something to ponder xx

lighter:
Sometimes time goes by in chunks.  Not linear at all.  And.... it's too easy.  No.  It's how things have always been to feel swamped and overwhelmed, but that's changing.

Maybe it's already changed.

To stop and notice.  Discern and choose.  Right from wrong.  Good from bad.  Worthy from the rest.  To let go of what's not important enough....to me.

To discern important enough....for me.

Nothing is wasted.

I am where I'm supposed to be.

To believe I'm home, inside myself, and live that truth.....while discerning and choosing and being so very kind to myself.....
kind to my family without being dishonest or  disingenuous. 

Empathetic truth......sans judgement feels like sunshine and "the way" just now.

Putting down responsibilities for other's feelings.....

Picking up self care.....not to model it, but bc it's a job.  It's my job.  I don't need a reason or permission or the right time or feelings about it.

It's just ok.  Just as it is. And breathing is what I do.....to break the patterns and find the form of what I'm creating....
instead of what I've had/done/been.

I can be free, creative, joyful....and I'm not seeking out social interactions.  I'm not lonely.  I'm exhausted by very little socializing. I get that too, Tupp. There's only so much time,attention, care and energy to give.  It's limited and limiting.  Know thy limits.  Honor them.  Choose wisely.  Again and again.

Back to breath, discernment, empathic honesty and radical acceptance....
releasing outcome.....
saying NO.....
holding boundaries I've set, sans regret.

It's a lot.  It's different to live with choices and return to choice when it slips away.  It comes back again. I can bring it back.  Choose it.  Again and again.

What's important...?  What deserves attention?

 Learning to put things down if they're not important.
...esp if I'm carrying them, have been carrying them....intended to carry them mindlessly....felt compelled or obligated or right carrying them.

It's a sea change.

It's learning not to focus.....on the obvious....on the default settings when fearing them and denying them make them stronger.

When reactivity resolves....drops away or is just a blip then retreats.....
that's the stuff.
Lighter

Hopalong:
Introversion is a normal and natural way of being. Often mischaracterized, but comes a time one stops trying to fit one's unique square peg into a round hole.

Good for you for noticing the drain and thinking about ways to manage it for your wellbeing.

hugs
Hops

Twoapenny:
Hopsie, yes, I think that's very true.  I think I still need to focus on and prioritise what I need/want to do before I start thinking about socialising or interacting too much with people.  There are things that don't seem like much - the mum who came back for coffee was here 45 minutes?  No more than that.  But I know I'd have felt better in myself if I'd come home and spent that time tidying up and getting the evening meal ready.  Instead of getting home and feeling behind, then spending all afternoon on the phone by which time the day was a write off and nothing else got done.  It does affect me, I just think I do better when I stick to my own routine and everything in my little world is as I like it to be.  It's not reflection of other people being wrong, in some way - too much, too demanding, anything like that.  I think I just need more quiet and down time.  And to remind myself of that throughout the day.

Lighter, yes, nodding all the way through.  I find that, because I've had to do so much on my own over the years, I'm quite capable in a lot of different situations, much like you are.  Then also having a child who doesn't fit any of the pigeon holes available and home educating him which again is very different to the school system and I feel I've got quite a wide range of experience in different areas and an ability to cope, because I've had to.  I think, therefore, that I find being around people who don't cope with a wide range of things, very tiring.  I do seem to know a lot of women whose husbands are quite childlike, in the sense they don't deal with their own problems, they don't think of others very much, they couldn't just take charge for a week and deal with the kids/house/pets and so on.  So the long talk I had with a friend yesterday was tiring because for some reason I can't seem to listen to someone else's situation without being affected by it.  She wasn't complaining or criticising, she was just talking through what's been going on in her life.  But as I listen I can see how selfish and self absorbed her husband is and how accepting she is of that (it doesn't even register with her that there's so much more he could be doing but he leaves her to get on with it despite the fact she's ill, and expects her to prioritise what he wants over what she needs). I can see it as she's talking; so many ways her situation could be improved if her family members did more.  Not that she even wants them to.  So she's not asking for suggestions or thoughts, I don't say or suggest anything, it's different people in different situations and not my business.  But it still leaves me feeling exhausted.  I'm going to have to ponder that some more as I'm not quite sure how best to manage it.  It's definitely my issue rather than someone else's xx

lighter:
You care deeply, Tupp.  You want your friend to suffer less, bc you're kind and can see how easily the h could manage it, if he cared to.  Apparently, he doesn't OR friend can't/hasn't articulated well enough/at all.

I didn't know how to ask for help or speak about difficult needs, once upon a time.  It's learned, in my case.  Likely hers too?  Not sure.  Not yours to solve.  Not mine.l, though I like to understand what I can.

Your friend gets something out of her situation, perhaps...unfortunately, IME.  I don't think she can see how her situation could change...not with any clarity, bc of her beliefs around her situation.

And if she could see it....all the ways you see.  If she began making changes....I imagine her new choices would bring some energy to your interactions.  Reminds me of Hops and her Poet friend, a bit.

Reminds me of Cowgirl, next door, who wants to "chat" over wine.

Ummm....no thank you.  I listened for a while, but there's nothing there for me and that's ok.  If you're getting something out of the time spent with this friend.....sans expectations she'll change.....find ways to spend time more joyfully or maybe spend less time. 

I wonder at the ease I used to be cornered into listening to situations, like the one you're dealing with.  It's easy to just state I have to go, then go.  And I do. 

I think part of the angst is feeling the need to help or at least impart som help before stepping out.  A phrase that sticks or jars the listener out of their default settings just a bit.

That's dropped away too, mostly.  The saying "we are where we want to be" makes sense now, bc I can glimpse my own unconscious beliefs and how intractable they "felt" when really I was in my own way.

I understood it, but couldn't identify the mechanics or solutions, even when people who care pointed them out.

I guess getting sick of feeling sick of being where one doesn't belong is part of learning to see around mental corners, finally, and assessing what's truly there.  If one can stomach it or not.

You're very nice and simply saying no to coffee or listening to a friend's suffering feeeels wrong, bad, upsetting....like your physical energy is loose and easily pierced by others....affected.

I think I pulled mine in, very tight and tucked against myself.... it's not easily pierced or affected....not like it was. I haven't thought about it in a while, but I remember doing it.

Not just anyone can get at it, like they used to.  It's one thing to say..." let me know how that works out for you," while biting back dread and advice.

It's another to feel it and not say it.....not even feel the need to say it, IME.

I can listen to friends upsetting situations, give my opinion if they ask and reassure, but it doesn't get in like it used to, bc I manage to stay outside their suffering.  I don't go down their rabbit hole either them anymore, at least I usually have a choice, now.

And there's the responsiveness vs draining reactivity.....managing to stay above their emotions and not feel them too....I think.

A couple years ago, or so, I just couldn't sit and take listening to faffing...lost my chill.....blurted out truths.....("Your need to be right all the time is so tedious")and that was a mixed bag.  One friend dropped away and it was for the best, imo.  Did he benefit?  I don't much need to know.  It's ok if he didn't.   

Some people in my life learned to think before speaking.  That was better, for the largest part.  People learning to be more mindful, even if it's a by product of my setting boundaries and not the goal, is good, IME.

People can judge and feel victimized and go away OR begin looking at their part, looking at mine.....sussing out the history and noticing other choices between us. 

Accepting coffee with your friend/s drains you might just be what it is, if all things remain the same.  Attempting to change the dynamics, insert energy and joy is a possibility likely requiring more energy until it gets better, IME.

I kept my Moss friend, bc we share lovely interests and recognize similar vulnerability and overdoing for others ...in each other.

Lastly, discerning between allowing intuition and "feeling right" to lead.....most of the time.....
but hushing it when self care/boundaries and new habits are involved in a new trick I'm mindful of.

Lighter

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