Emotional battering

[October]

These were her choices and as much as it hurts me to admit it....I'm glad she did what she wanted, at least in death.  

October, I know how hard it is to watch someone slowly kill themselves with alchohol.  I also know it is a choice.  

And I know how hard it is to know someone will die without medical care.
And now I know this is a choice too.

For your child.....maybe he doesn't want her to sit by his hospital bed and see him like that?  Maybe it's the one thing he wants to spare her?   Deep down inside....he knows he's dying.

(((((((October and C))))))

GFN

Thank you for sharing your story about your mother.  She sounds like a very special lady indeed, and I am sure you should have no regrets at all.   She knew how to live, and that is the important thing, after all.

Perhaps you are right about D, but I am not sure that he is capable of understanding that much.  From what I saw on Sunday he is the same lost child he has always been.  He told me he just wanted to be back to normal, and I said to him, I am not sure you are going to be able to do that.

Then afterwards in the car on the way home C and I talked about what normal is to her dad, and whether either of us would recognise that if we saw it.

My greatest fear for myself is of dying alone.  Not the pain, but being alone.  And because it is a fear for me, it is also something I would not wish on anyone else; I don't want him to die alone either.

I would be much happier if I thought that he were in a fit state to make the kind of choice you describe with your mother.  A good friend of mine has a heart condition and I have spoken with her today - a kind of surrogate mum for me really - and she also will not ever go into hospital again.  She has recently had several minor illnesses - if there are such things for her - and had an angina attack only last week, and stayed put in her flat, and intends to do that from now on.  She has had two heart operations, and doesn't want any more.  She goes for check ups at the hospital, and to her GP, but she doesn't want to be admitted again.  In her case, I perfectly respect her wish.  I asked her about dying alone, and she says she will not be alone; the angels will be with her.  

I don't think D is in that state.  He is confused, hallucinating, and forgets conversations of the morning by the evening.  To me, it is neglect to leave him alone, and it hurts.

However, on the bright side, I underestimated his sister.  She rang me, and says she can see both her parents position and mine.  She promised to keep C and me informed of what happens, if anything.  Her view is that the symptoms we are seeing in her brother are side effects of anti depressants.  Nothing more.  But at least we are talking, which is a step forward all round.

Meanwhile, I bought daughter a pretty little silver ring with three hearts on it; representing herself and her family; me and her dad.  And I told her that her dad loves her.

[October]

Hi October,

What a stressful situation. It's really awful when one is faced with the bad decisions of others and can't do anything about it. You did the best you could and that's all you can do.

Take care,
bunny

Thanks Bunny.  I keep thinking maybe there is something else ...

What I need now I think is to switch off life for a while to recover a bit.  I kind of need a side room, to hide in.  

[October]

Try and rest peacefully in the knowledge that you tried your best and in your faith that God is in His heaven.

(((((October and D)))))

mudpup

Thanks, Muddy.  This one is hard for me.  I am not very good at sitting back and doing nothing.  Much better at finding something practical to do, and doing it.  

[October]

You have demonstrated for your daughter what true compassion looks like.   Bless you.

Brigid

Thanks, Brigid.  I really appreciate your comments.  
(((((((hugs))))))))

[October]

Sending my prayers and love for both of you.

So sorry.

Mia

Thanks Mia.  (((((hugs)))))

I really value everyone's prayers.  I am sure they will help, somehow.  Many thanks to everyone.  xxxxxx

[mudpuppy]

Hi October,

This one is hard for me. I am not very good at sitting back and doing nothing. Much better at finding something practical to do, and doing it.

I guess I was using my usual bumbling words again.
I meant rest peacefully in God in a spiritual and emotional sense.
You can rest like that while you're working in your garden or using a jack hammer.  

mud

[October]

I guess I was using my usual bumbling words again.
I meant rest peacefully in God in a spiritual and emotional sense.
You can rest like that while you're working in your garden or using a jack hammer.  

mud

No, Rupert, hun, you were fine.  I am not good at spiritual and emotional rest either; makes me all jittery.    

However, the jack hammer sounds fun ...

[Anonymous]

Hello again October:

I would be much happier if I thought that he were in a fit state to make the kind of choice .......I don't think D is in that state. He is confused, hallucinating, and forgets conversations of the morning by the evening. To me, it is neglect to leave him alone, and it hurts.

Are you sure this wasn't partly withdrawl??
He was in a lucid enough state to get up and leave the hospital and say that he just wants things to be "normal again".  My mother was in and out of reality, near the end.  The closer she got to death, the closer to reality...it seemed.  I don't know him but my guess is that he is more aware than he is saying (even in his own denial....he knows his body is giving out).  He is making his own choices.

You've done all you can, October, to make sure he isn't neglected.  But he has always chosen to neglect himself (by his alcoholism) and those around him, right?  So now, it's not really all that surprising that he will neglect himself in death.

That isn't up to you to fix.  You can't be sure anyone but....the angels....will be there with him, even if he were in hospital (unless you intended to stay there 24 hours a day).  He could still die alone there (so what if some nurse is down the hall and some sick stranger is in the bed beside him, really?)

I'm so glad to hear about your communications with your daughter.  Your obligation to her is not taken lightly and her needs are first (above his).   Good for you for being so open with her.  I bet she'll treasure that ring with the 3 hearts in it.  Did you get your slippys??

I hope so.  My prayers are with you and C.

GFN

[October]

I'm so glad to hear about your communications with your daughter.  Your obligation to her is not taken lightly and her needs are first (above his).   Good for you for being so open with her.  I bet she'll treasure that ring with the 3 hearts in it.  Did you get your slippys??

I hope so.  

GFN

Not yet.  But I am working on it.  Takes me a while to buy anything like that.  Very fussy.  

You are right that she comes first.  That is why ex had to go; she was 4, and it was a choice between him and her, and she won.  And looking back on the 8 years since then, I dread to think what state she would have been in, had I not made him leave.  His family think I abandoned him, but I think it was an act of love towards him to protect his daughter from those years.  And myself, in a way.  

Now sorting out information on local Alateen meetings - never bothered before, but it may help C now.  Also, have printed out bereavement leaflet, written for young people.  Helps to know what to expect, and to find phone numbers.

[longtire]

Meanwhile, I bought daughter a pretty little silver ring with three hearts on it; representing herself and her family; me and her dad.  And I told her that her dad loves her.

((((((((October))))))))    (((((((((October's Daughter)))))))))
If I were God, I'd let you into heaven on that one alone.

[mum as guest]

Ditto what longtire said...October, you are an exceptional human being.  Your daughter has a wonderful role model for how to do life.  Your ex husband is (although he may never realize) a fortunate man, to have had a child with you.

bless you

[Stormchild]

You know, October, you are giving C. the gift of honesty and courage, something children rarely get when facing the death of an adult. So often kids get pushed aside, ignored, or treated as though they are bad for wanting to know what is going on.

I wish I had known when my grandparents were dying, I would have done all I could to say my goodbyes to them. No, the adults thought it was better not to trouble me with that stuff. Boy were they wrong.

I'm glad you're doing these things for C.

[2cents]

(((((((((((((((((October and C)))))))))))))))))))))))

2cents

[October]

If I were God, I'd let you into heaven on that one alone.

Ah yes, but you don't see the very wicked side of me.     D rang last night to tell me that he had discharged himself from hospital,    not remembering that I had already spoken to him two days earlier.  However, he did seem a bit more lucid than before.  Don't know whether that is good or bad, really.  

I asked him when he is going to realise that there are other people in this world besides himself and what he wants, and start behaving like a grown man.  I told him he has hurt his mother and his daughter, let alone anyone else, by what he has done, and that he is a fool to walk away from help like that.  I told him that his memory is going, and he is seeing things and that something is wrong, that needs sorting out properly, not denying.  I think he prefers not to know or think about that, or perhaps he can't.  He said he was seeing things because he is tired, and that he didn't have enough sleep in hospital, and that was the only problem there.  He sleeps nearly all the time, though.  

Later he spoke to C to apologise (I insisted that he do that), and said that he loves her, and she said to him; 'Whatever!'.  He wanted to hear the same back, but she can't do it, and I don't blame her.

He has seen his GP, which is something, and she is going to see him again next week.  He said she did not like him having left the hospital.  I bet she didn't.  But at least I am absolved from having to visit now, I think.  I am not about to reward this kind of thoughtless behaviour.

So, not any kind of saint, I am afraid.    The man I married died long ago, if indeed he ever existed.  Actually, he did, for a while, but there was a demon inside who took over.  Sometimes I see a glimmer of the person I once knew and - liked - but not often.  Mostly I see a wreck of a human being, and a terrible, wicked waste of a life.  If D had done this to anyone else it would be murder, imo.  As it is, it is long, drawn out self destruction, dragging everyone else down in the process.

So yesterday I made some gf cakes, which was very nice.  I am trying to just get on with living, and with being a family of two.  Not easy, but I am getting there.  Today I did all the ironing.  Later I will go shopping.  

[October]

You know, October, you are giving C. the gift of honesty and courage, something children rarely get when facing the death of an adult. So often kids get pushed aside, ignored, or treated as though they are bad for wanting to know what is going on.

I wish I had known when my grandparents were dying, I would have done all I could to say my goodbyes to them. No, the adults thought it was better not to trouble me with that stuff. Boy were they wrong.

I'm glad you're doing these things for C.

Thank you, Storm.  My dad thinks I am telling C too much.  He has said for a long time that she should not know the word 'alcoholic' and that all she should know if he dies, is that he was poorly.  That is all.

I told C the truth right from the very start, as far as she was able to understand it, because I wanted her to know that it was not her fault, and not my fault.  I suppose AA would want me to stress that it is an illness, and I have not done that.  I said that daddy chooses his behaviour, and he chooses to drink, and cannot stop, the same as gran and grandad cannot stop smoking.  She knows about addiction, but she also knows that there is nothing that I would not do for her sake, but that her dad was not able to stop drinking, even for her and me.

There was one episode, when C was a toddler, when she went into  the kitchen and saw her dad hide a can of drink up his jumper.  She said to me; 'Daddy has alcoholic up his jumper', and he denied it vehemently.  He said there was nothing there, and that she had imagined it.  I said, 'if C says there is alcohol up your jumper, then I believe her'.  And I made him take it out and give it to me.  

I took it from him, poured it down the sink, and then I spoke to C and told her; 'Daddy tells lies sometimes.'

Horrible, horrible, horrible thing to have to do to him.     But I had to validate her reality.  I would not have known the words then, but I had to tell her that what she said matters, and that I believed her.  What would it have done to deny what she saw and say, 'no dear, daddy doesn't drink, he has promised us both, and daddy doesn't break his promises.'

D has never learned the difference between truth and fiction.  If he wants it to be true, it becomes true.  And his whole family is playing the same game, at present.  My family has a version of this game all their own.  No wonder I am so mixed up.