Author Topic: the anger dilemma - dream, memories  (Read 2054 times)

d'smom

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the anger dilemma - dream, memories
« on: August 18, 2005, 03:40:21 PM »
i just had, the weirdest dream emotionally ive had in a very long time. it wasnt scary really, or about delphine or anything usual. it was all =emotional=. it was about emotions and feeling. it felt very strange and very transformative somehow.... it was very impressionistic... just a series of images and very strong feelings.

i dont know why but i would like to write it here. it seems to fit, i really dont know how. its not very narrative, its more impressionistic..... so thats how it will sound i guess.........maybe someone can relate.

in this dream..... i was MAD. i was REALLY REALLY ANGRY.  but i was also trapped.  somehow.. at first i was free... i was doing things. traveling...... with my friends...... and then somehow i was caught in this hospital. i woke up in this hospital looking at this awful woman nurse who controlled my fate. i asked 'how did i get here'. and she said it didnt matter, i couldnt get away.  upon hearing this, i became angry with her.

instantly i was back in the corner, waking up. i understood that they had drugged me. everytime i became angry, they would drug me..... she said 'they almost couldnt wake you up this time'.... i was angry again... they had given me so many drugs that i had almost died......... i was furious but i knew that i couldnt show it, becuase every time i did, obviously i would be dangerously drugged...... that was 'the game' i was not allowed to be angry or to show i was angry, no matter what they did to me. i was FURIOUS.

she began making me do all these different activities and humiliating things. i guess it reminded me of being in the mental hospital a lot. in the dream i was there with other kids and they were trying to get us to admit how our 'problems' were all our fault and things. i even said sarcastically - 'yes, i gave birth to myself, i raised myself, yup, it was all my doing'....

i knew it wasnt our fault. i knew that as soon as they sent us 'home' it would all be the same again, becuase the problems were at home. it was so awful and made me so incredibly humiliated and angry. but i couldnt show it. this was also the same as the mental hospital in real life....... beucase certainly if you showed anger there, you would be put in solitary, or even tied down.

this did happen in real life, in the hospital....... they strip searched us all, and found my friend and i were 'passing notes' to each other to communicate between the cells at night.............. that very day they transferred him to another hospital and we never saw him again...........he was my best friend....... i threw my shoe against the door of my 'room'...... and just for that, i was stripped naked and tied to a table for days.... with bright lights on me....... and cameras on me....... naked..  i was only 16....... i just broke right then, i remember lying there and thinking that human nature was evil.  i gave up on human nature right then and it took a *long* time for me to think again that human nature was good and not evil.  i also thought right then, that if these monsters were 'sane' then I WANTED TO BE CRAZY. !!!!!!>

i was remembering this, and another dream.....   i was in a similar situation, being hung upside-down by ropes by this sadistic psychiatrist type. i was hung upside down by these ropes in this basement until i 'complied' as they wanted me to. i was under this weird kind of water and i couldnt breathe. it was really terrifying. every time i didnt comply i would go back to the basement and the ropes. it was of course awful. it was behavior modification. anyone who has been targeted by true behavior modification techniques will recognise the horror of it. 

in this dream i thought about that dream. they were both hospitals run by my father in these dreams. (it was also a hospital run by my father in real life.) i had so much anger and felt SO trapped and violated. 

then the lady was there in my face, making me do something. i was totally conflicted emotionally.  i wanted to slap  her face off. but i couldnt do it or they would punish me. 

but ... something shifted inside me...... and i just..... changed.... something changed. i realised something but i cant put it into words.  either way i was supposed to walk around this track somehow. i felt totally humiliated but instead i just realised, that what i should feel is pride. not the bad kind of pride but the kind that is self respect. so i stood up in this dream, i was crying with frustration, but it didnt matter. i walked around that damn track with self respect and pride in myself.......  not becuase they forced me to.... but becuase, *i* decided to............. i was furious but not in a way they could punish me for..

it had something to do with anger.. and the way i feel anger..  damned if i can put it into words. i just felt it.  of course the psych people all thought it was their behavior modification 'working'... they had crushed me, controlled me, stamped out my rebelliousness....... but i knew, it was me, myself, taking control of myself, DESPITE everything they did..... i dont need to be bullied into doing the right thing. they will never understand that.  they would never understand, that if they would only leave me alone, i wouldnt have been angry in the first place. i am only angry when injustice is done to me. 

i wish i could put it into words better than that.

anyway it was just a really powerful feelings and a lot of stuff kind of came to the surface there. maybe somebody else can relate about the anger dilemma....  " i will torture you but you must not react or incur more punishment "
good day all
ds mom



Plucky

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Re: the anger dilemma - dream, memories
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2005, 04:34:12 PM »
Hi d'mom,
wow.  this is a lot of content that you dreamed.  Like one of those specialty tours - instead of 'walking tour of estonia' you have 'emotional tour of d'smom's past'.   
I can't offer much except a hug (((((((((((((d'smom))))))))))))).  I'm so sorry all that awful stuff had to happen.  I'm so happy that now you survived, you are alive, you are thriving.   You are so strong to have gotten through it intact.   And you are intact - you have some battle scars but you are in one piece and healing.  Thank you for letting us in.  I feel grateful to see how you have dealt with so much and still keep on going.   It inspires me to deal with my own little problems.

A friend of mine once said, if you can't deal with stuff while you're awake, you deal with it while you're asleep.
Since you have it all written down (good move) maybe take it to your T?
Plucky


 

bliz

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Re: the anger dilemma - dream, memories
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2005, 08:47:01 PM »
I am defintely not a dream analyst but it sounds like the struggle between the old you and the new you. People are tyring to keep you down, drug you, you keep waking up, (feeling your feelings) etc.  It sounded like a very healthy dream to me actually.  Indicative of your awakening. 

d'smom

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Re: the anger dilemma - dream, memories
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2005, 03:50:08 PM »
thanks for your comment bliz  :) i felt it was healthy too. just couldnt figure out how. >

plucky -  'tour of estonia'  - that was funny - maybe a tour of bosnia - or fallujah right now---- :)
either way you said:
Since you have it all written down (good move) maybe take it to your T?


well..... i was wondering actually... if it didnt have something to do with my recent feelings of 'irritation' with therapy in general?..... <<<*not* spyralle, happy b-day, and the other psych workers who do good and difficult and thankless work!!!!!!!!!!>>>   ive had some really bad experiences with the mental health profession - when i first came here my biggest issue was a lot of anger as people (sorry again longtire) may remember.  i wonder if some of that isnt all coming up right now for some reason...  

these recent feelings of recouping some of my power, by connecting with my little girl, and standing up somewhat against my parents, which was a great source of powerlesness before,  maybe some of this stuff is being released subconsciously.......

in having a lot of frustration with therapy right now becuase one it isnt helping me as i wish it was, and also it may still be a source of a lot of my feelings of anger stuck in me from my past................  all tied up with powerlessness from my parents becuase 1)  they are torturing me right now by kidnapping my kid, and also they were the ones that controlled my 'treatment' when i was incarcerated in the mental hospital!! (father was chief of staff). if you ask me the number one thing i hate worst in the world it is to feel trapped.... and they make me feel trapped a LOT.

its all very tangled up. but i wonder if some of it isnt coming to the surface. maybe it is a good thing to talk to the therapist about...... maybe thats some of my 'irritation' with therapy right now, leftover from my bad experiences back then, and i just wasnt realising it.

either way anything coming to the surface has to be good.

btw, dont i remember you having a lot of feelings of anger also when you came here.......? its a big problem for me.... if im remembering rigiht from your story you also have a lot to be angry about and are workig to get over it and be healthy about it........ your problems were not that 'small' if im remembering right....
either way thank you plucky :}}
d'smom


SHORTY

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Re: the anger dilemma - dream, memories
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2005, 04:02:35 PM »
A PASTER HERE OF A DREAM POST IN PART WITH MY COMMENTS IN CAPS
AND THE BELOW THAT A QUOTE OF THE WHOLE POST

in this dream..... i was MAD. i was REALLY REALLY ANGRY.  but i was also trapped.  somehow.. at first i was free... i was doing things. traveling...... with my friends...... and then somehow i was caught in this hospital. i woke up in this hospital looking at this awful woman nurse TO SOME DEGREE MAYBE ASPECTS OF YOUR SUBCONSCIOUS who controlled my fate. i asked 'how did i get here'. and she said it didnt matter, i couldnt get away.  upon hearing this, i became angry with her.

instantly i was back in the corner, waking up. i understood that they had drugged me. everytime i became angry, they would drug me..... she said 'they almost couldnt wake you up this time'.... i was angry again... they had given me so many drugs that i had almost died......... i was furious but i knew that i couldnt show it, becuase every time i did, obviously i would be dangerously drugged...... that was 'the game' i was not allowed to be angry or to show i was angry, no matter what they did to me. i was FURIOUS. PERHAPS WHY YOU ARE SO FURIOUS AND CANT PUT IT ALL TO WORDS BUT SOME WAY UNDERSTAND ON SOME LEVEL ..IS THAT IT IS NOT JUST YOUR PARENTBUT SOME OF THE SOCIAL NORMS THAT MIGHT BE QUESTIONED MORE ALONG THE LINES OF SAY.... OH I DONT KNOW GNOSTIC..

she began making me do all these different activities and humiliating things. i guess it reminded me of being in the mental hospital a lot. in the dream i was there with other kids and they were trying to get us to admit how our 'problems' were all our fault and things. i even said sarcastically - 'yes, i gave birth to myself, i raised myself, yup, it was all my doing'.... AS A GUESS... YOU DONT BELIEVE IN REINCARNATION....

i knew it wasnt our fault. i knew that as soon as they sent us 'home' it would all be the same again, becuase the problems were at home. it was so awful and made me so incredibly humiliated and angry. but i couldnt show it. this was also the same as the mental hospital in real life....... beucase certainly if you showed anger there, you would be put in solitary, or even tied down.

this did happen in real life, in the hospital....... they strip searched us all, and found my friend and i were 'passing notes' to each other to communicate between the cells at night.............. that very day they transferred him to another hospital and we never saw him again...........he was my best friend....... i threw my shoe against the door of my 'room'...... and just for that, i was stripped naked and tied to a table for days.... with bright lights on me....... and cameras on me....... naked..  i was only 16....... i just broke right then, i remember lying there and thinking that human nature was evil.  i gave up on human nature right then and it took a *long* time for me to think again that human nature was good and not evil.  i also thought right then, that if these monsters were 'sane' then I WANTED TO BE CRAZY. !!!!!!>

i was remembering this, and another dream.....   i was in a similar situation, being hung upside-down by ropes by this sadistic psychiatrist type. i was hung upside down by these ropes in this basement until i 'complied' as they wanted me to. i was under this weird kind of water and i couldnt breathe. it was really terrifying. every time i didnt comply i would go back to the basement and the ropes. it was of course awful. it was behavior modification. anyone who has been targeted by true behavior modification techniques will recognise the horror of it. 

in this dream i thought about that dream. they were both hospitals run by my father in these dreams. (it was also a hospital run by my father in real life.) i had so much anger and felt SO trapped and violated. 

then the lady was there in my face, making me do something. i was totally conflicted emotionally.  i wanted to slap  her face off. but i couldnt do it or they would punish me. 

but ... something shifted inside me...... and i just..... changed.... something changed. i realised something but i cant put it into words.  either way i was supposed to walk around this track somehow. i felt totally humiliated but instead i just realised, that what i should feel is pride. not the bad kind of pride but the kind that is self respect. so i stood up in this dream, i was crying with frustration, but it didnt matter. i walked around that damn track with self respect and pride in myself.......  not becuase they forced me to.... but becuase, *i* decided to............. i was furious but not in a way they could punish me for..


i just had, the weirdest dream emotionally ive had in a very long time. it wasnt scary really, or about delphine or anything usual. it was all =emotional=. it was about emotions and feeling. it felt very strange and very transformative somehow.... it was very impressionistic... just a series of images and very strong feelings.

i dont know why but i would like to write it here. it seems to fit, i really dont know how. its not very narrative, its more impressionistic..... so thats how it will sound i guess.........maybe someone can relate.

in this dream..... i was MAD. i was REALLY REALLY ANGRY.  but i was also trapped.  somehow.. at first i was free... i was doing things. traveling...... with my friends...... and then somehow i was caught in this hospital. i woke up in this hospital looking at this awful woman nurse who controlled my fate. i asked 'how did i get here'. and she said it didnt matter, i couldnt get away.  upon hearing this, i became angry with her.

instantly i was back in the corner, waking up. i understood that they had drugged me. everytime i became angry, they would drug me..... she said 'they almost couldnt wake you up this time'.... i was angry again... they had given me so many drugs that i had almost died......... i was furious but i knew that i couldnt show it, becuase every time i did, obviously i would be dangerously drugged...... that was 'the game' i was not allowed to be angry or to show i was angry, no matter what they did to me. i was FURIOUS.

she began making me do all these different activities and humiliating things. i guess it reminded me of being in the mental hospital a lot. in the dream i was there with other kids and they were trying to get us to admit how our 'problems' were all our fault and things. i even said sarcastically - 'yes, i gave birth to myself, i raised myself, yup, it was all my doing'....

i knew it wasnt our fault. i knew that as soon as they sent us 'home' it would all be the same again, becuase the problems were at home. it was so awful and made me so incredibly humiliated and angry. but i couldnt show it. this was also the same as the mental hospital in real life....... beucase certainly if you showed anger there, you would be put in solitary, or even tied down.

this did happen in real life, in the hospital....... they strip searched us all, and found my friend and i were 'passing notes' to each other to communicate between the cells at night.............. that very day they transferred him to another hospital and we never saw him again...........he was my best friend....... i threw my shoe against the door of my 'room'...... and just for that, i was stripped naked and tied to a table for days.... with bright lights on me....... and cameras on me....... naked..  i was only 16....... i just broke right then, i remember lying there and thinking that human nature was evil.  i gave up on human nature right then and it took a *long* time for me to think again that human nature was good and not evil.  i also thought right then, that if these monsters were 'sane' then I WANTED TO BE CRAZY. !!!!!!>

i was remembering this, and another dream.....   i was in a similar situation, being hung upside-down by ropes by this sadistic psychiatrist type. i was hung upside down by these ropes in this basement until i 'complied' as they wanted me to. i was under this weird kind of water and i couldnt breathe. it was really terrifying. every time i didnt comply i would go back to the basement and the ropes. it was of course awful. it was behavior modification. anyone who has been targeted by true behavior modification techniques will recognise the horror of it. 

in this dream i thought about that dream. they were both hospitals run by my father in these dreams. (it was also a hospital run by my father in real life.) i had so much anger and felt SO trapped and violated. 

then the lady was there in my face, making me do something. i was totally conflicted emotionally.  i wanted to slap  her face off. but i couldnt do it or they would punish me. 

but ... something shifted inside me...... and i just..... changed.... something changed. i realised something but i cant put it into words.  either way i was supposed to walk around this track somehow. i felt totally humiliated but instead i just realised, that what i should feel is pride. not the bad kind of pride but the kind that is self respect. so i stood up in this dream, i was crying with frustration, but it didnt matter. i walked around that damn track with self respect and pride in myself.......  not becuase they forced me to.... but becuase, *i* decided to............. i was furious but not in a way they could punish me for..

it had something to do with anger.. and the way i feel anger..  damned if i can put it into words. i just felt it.  of course the psych people all thought it was their behavior modification 'working'... they had crushed me, controlled me, stamped out my rebelliousness....... but i knew, it was me, myself, taking control of myself, DESPITE everything they did..... i dont need to be bullied into doing the right thing. they will never understand that.  they would never understand, that if they would only leave me alone, i wouldnt have been angry in the first place. i am only angry when injustice is done to me. 

i wish i could put it into words better than that.

anyway it was just a really powerful feelings and a lot of stuff kind of came to the surface there. maybe somebody else can relate about the anger dilemma....  " i will torture you but you must not react or incur more punishment "
good day all
ds mom




Plucky

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Re: the anger dilemma - dream, memories
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2005, 05:45:22 PM »
Quote
btw, dont i remember you having a lot of feelings of anger also when you came here.......? its a big problem for me.... if im remembering rigiht from your story you also have a lot to be angry about and are workig to get over it and be healthy about it........ your problems were not that 'small' if im remembering right....

yes.....I hate to tarnish my 'calm' reputation with you, but I refer you to the Need Help Dealing with my Anger thread where I described nearly stabbing my H with a big kitchen knife.  Want to revise your opinion?

Being up here has really calmed me down.  I don't feel angry with anyone here because no one here has done anything to me and most everyone seems so helpful and nurturing.  The few times I felt triggered I snapped at someone and then withdrew.  It's hard to unlease uncontrolled anger when you have to type it, spellcheck it, then post it.  Too many chances to calm down.  Maybe you guys type faster.

I'm having a lot of intense dreams right now too.  I guess it is all just part of the excavation and replanting process.  Good luck with your garden.
Plucky

miss piggy

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Re: the anger dilemma - dream, memories
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2005, 05:56:56 PM »
Hello D's mom,

This is a powerful dream!  Your experiences are beyond my comprehension, but I will try to offer something with an idea from Viktor Frankl (a psychiatrist and concentration camp survivor).  He said something along the lines of the only thing that no one can take away from another is that person's control of how they feel about what is happening to them.  Or how they choose to respond to what is happening around them or to them. 

Your dream seems to have a bit of that idea in it.  That inner strength to choose how you feel about what's going on around you. 

I find my dreams to be really helpful in feeling new feelings about my experiences before I can display a new attitude during waking hours.  Kind of like a dress rehearsal.  Perhaps this is happening within you, too?

I had a pretty complex dream last night also.  I won't change the subject, but I do really value my dreams now and what they can tell me.  Take care, MP

d'smom

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Re: the anger dilemma - dream, memories
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2005, 06:02:18 PM »
yes its all coming clear to me now. ive been living an anger catch-22 for the last 4 years.... not to mention my entire life......




that is totaly reminiscint of the one at home: 'oh you are crying? i will give you something to -really- cry about' ( i KNOW people here have heard that one)

then in the hospital - 'oh we have wronged you? well we will just put you in solitary for having a totally normal reaction to that'

and now - they take my child by force..... and flat out tell me, that if i show anger about it, i forfiet contact with her. i must smile and be pleasant when i want to rip their faces off....... or, i pay, by forfieting contact.   (yes, they can do that).  so..... all this four years.... ive been choking back the strongest bone-deep fury i have ever felt..... that of these maniacs messing with my own child..... beucase i had no choice, or else lose contact.

ohhhhh what a tangled web we weave.

im tired of this catch-22.   im pissed off and i have a reason to be. (lots of reasons.) i can express it be done with it and get over it.  

they will just need to deal with that. im tired of playing the game. im done. i dont need to play anymore. maybe that is why things are finally straightening out in my dreams. i wont repress myself for their pleasure. i feel healthier already. what can they do to me. NOTHING.   HA.  


====
oh hi plucky - yes, i remember that. i read that thread :}  dont worry about being tarnished with me~!  i think your doing great.   i also dont feel mad here............ (but i will never live down snapping at longtire who is the most gentle person ever. i think he has forgiven me) i dont feel mad here becuase people dont tell me what to do and they dont treat me like dirt - amazing how that helps a person  not feel mad in life. as i say above, when i can express it and feel healhty about it, and most of all identify WHO I AM ANGRY AT and WHY, and that its ok to be angry at that, its not a problem...... the idea of 'righteous anger' as you said in another thread was very healing for me when i did most of my anger work years ago. when you figure out who you are angry at and why, and allow it and own it, it seems to go away.

its this catch-22 aspect..... not feeling allowed someone to own it, that it isnt ok. thats when it becomes a problem, for me anyhow.
take care there :)
d'smom



ack ps again! hi mp.
yes - that was why i was concerned about the idea of mia's ex telling the kids he can see into their thoughts. personal sovereignty is real important to me. one things they can never take, never have, (altho they can with enough torture sadly) is WHO YOU ARE INSIDE. its important. your mind- the final frontier.
thanks. :)