Emotional Games from N H

[Surrounded]

Ok----bear with me I just have to get this out.

My sickening H is such a twit.  He is aware that I have been having huge problems with my family of origin over the last year. I have finally cut off my N mom and sister just to have some peace.   I am reading all the books I can get my hands on and reading all the posts on this board I can.  I am trying desperately to  just hold center.  I want to figure out why I am the way I am and they are the way they are before I can decide any action to take.  I struggle to just mentally make it through the day and keep the house and family from falling apart. I also have extreme issues with him too, but as far as he knows, it's between me and my "other" family. 

I have always been the one to just shut up and take it.  I am making stands that scare him, I know.  He sees I am in turmoil, although I go out of my way to be nice to him.  Not overly, fakely nice, but nice.  I also need to fortify my defenses like never before.  This means I have detached a little.  And my mind is in a million places at once.  This scares the crud out of him.  He mopes around the house pouting.  Why?   Because his is entirely absorbed in himself.  I am not kissing his a** and so he is worried about me only because of the way it is affecting him.  He doesn't get hugs, or worse yet sex when he wants it.  Boo hoo.  (That i(sex)s all about him too.)

He says, I care.  Bull.  Only if my problems damper his day.  So then he pushes all my buttons to get me to open up only to make sure that he doesn't have to worry if it's him I am mad at.  He says..."What is wrong???"    ....Are you KIDDING me????      This is our 4th conversation about this in as many months and you want to know what is wrong with me because I seem a bit "off"?  If he only knew!

I can't say anything about him because, in the past when I have said something like...

The daily porn has to stop...or....
Please stop yelling at me because you are mad at everything else...or....
Can you try to not be 1-6 hours late for EVERYTHING????
You are smothering me, I need some space...or......
ETC.

I have gotten the following responses: (to name a few)

Suicide threats
"Everyone has turned their backs on me"
"Nobody wants me around"
"Everything I do is for YOU!!"
ETC.

I know I could go on, but you get the picture.   Anyway, he gets me to fall apart or get upset with him and somehow I look like the idiot, or apologize for what he did, assure him it's not him---it's anything but him and he's fine.  He's got his fix.  I stand there, feeling raped emotionally, he looks like the hero.  Because somehow he makes it seem like either I am totally on his case for saying anything OR I am the blubbering idiot who can't handle anything without him.  These days, I play along, so he will get his fix and move on.  I have the strength to do so from advice I hear on these boards.  Until I can repair, learn and plan enough to dump his butt with all the emotional, factual, and intellectual arsenal I need.  I heard somewhere I had to be able to stand up and learn what I have to learn from these relationship mistakes and leave with my self respect or I would just be destined to repeat this same scenario again with someone else.  I believe that cause I went straight from my N mom to him. 

He has worked at home for 10 years so I have not had breathing room to do much venting or research.  He has started to be gone more since Jan 1 since he got an office away from home.  He is ultra paranoid I am going to cheat.  (????Why would I want to do that????)He hates that I ever get on the internet.  I have to hide any of this.  I used to vent by writing my feelings down on paper, and lo and behold, I don't know how cause it was hidden really well, but he found that too and holds that over my head.  He made me destroy what I wrote (journals, really) and brings it up whenever he wants to make me feel bad for him. 

I have cut myself off from EVERYONE.  He is too embarrassing.  I have to hurry home froom the grocery store, just to hear what pains in the rear the kids have been.  I ask for nothing.  He has put us through enough financial turmoil to make anyone walk.  And I mean ANYONE.  He is a RE Broker and I got my license a few years back to try and help dig out of the hole he had dug for us, but I absolutely can not work with him.  He scares me, and I told him so.......Poor him---ya know.

I run around in circles at home because I am scared of him.  To make sure he doesn't find anything he can be mad at.  No, he doesn't hit. Or drink.  He's too smart for that. Then I could have something on him.   He tried to beat me up once when I hurt his pride when we were first married.  I got the hint and I have just kissed his butt pretty much since.  16 years almost.  (He learned all this controlling, manipulative behavior from his mommy--makes me sick)

I know, I am an enabler.  I accept that part of my situation.  And I am changing that.  And I am not just having a pity party.  I just need to vent while I get my wits together because i know I am headed into a major battle on many fronts.  I really appreciate this place to vent.  I know I am new here, but you guys have made me feel welcome and I have learned so much.  I have learned I am not alone.  That is nice---more than nice, it is a god-send.   Also feel I need to write some of this so I can refer back to it when I feel like giving up and accepting this and pretending I can handle it or forget how bad things really are.  I can't believe I put up with this.  What have I become??  Never thought this would be where I was right now in my life.  Geez!

[Hopalong]

That sort of controlling intimidation is abuse.
Forcing you to throw out your own journals????
He has no right.

Hie thee to a lawyer, imho.

Don't worry about not being "nice."
You can be nice later.

Right now protecting yourself is everything.
You are in battle mode and walking a tightrope all at once.

Have faith...you will survive this.
And you are not a bad person for being angry or detached.

Hang in ...

Hopalong

[Plucky]

Surrounded,
your H is more selfish than anyone I've ever heard of!  Your Nmum must be a whopper too to have prepared you for him!  Yikes!

You are making good progress to putting an end to his reign of terror.   I'm glad you are here.  We can support each other.

a hurried but appalled
Plucky

[write]

honey, you're not an enabler.
You're a woman in an abusive relationship who can't rely on the support of her family and friends.
You can rely on us though!

(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((()))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

[Marta]

Anyway, he gets me to fall apart or get upset with him and somehow I look like the idiot, or apologize for what he did, assure him it's not him---it's anything but him and he's fine.  He's got his

I know what that feels like. What I gather from your few posts I've read, you are very self-aware and aware of how the others around you are and play their games. PLay it the way he wants if you want to buy some time to prepare yourself for your next move. Ugh. This is a nightmare situation.

In terms of Internet safety, may be you know this already, but two precautions to take. Go to tools>options>content>autocomplter>settings and make sure that none of the boxes are checked. Then click on clear passwords etc. Second is options>general>delete cookies, delete files, clear history.

I am sure that your local public library has Internet facilities, and probably rents out lockers too to store your personal papers. Just tell him that you go to the library to borrow books.

[Hopalong]

wonderful advice Marta...a wise reminder to many of us.
And Darky if the library doesn't have lockers...I got an inexpensive plastic box at an office supply store where I put important papers I don't want my brother to go through. It's just the right size for those crucial folders and it also has room for me to put my laptop on top.
when I know he's coming to town I toss those folders and my laptop in the box and take it to a close friend's house.
you need copies of important documents such as deeds, titles, bank accounts, etc.
and rent yourself a bank safe depost box. you need a will and a living trust for your kids.

But even before all that: GET YOURSELF A LAWYER. They will have step-by-step advice on everything you need to do to protect yourself.

I think you may want to document the daily porn, as this may be helpful in divorce proceedings.

This is blunt stuff but if you focus on strategies and LEGAL plans, you will survive the day to day tension. In the back of your mind you will know you are creating a new future. This part is hell, but you will get through it.

Hopalong

[roaring dad]

Be careful what you write in journals.  They can be subpeonaed in court.

[Plucky]

Hi Surrounded,
Just think of yourself as surrounded by friends now.  Because you are now.  The primary relationships in your life will soon be, not those icky ones with your H and Mother, but healthy breathing ones with your friends, starting with us.

You are not an enabler.  You are a survivor.  It's just that your survival skills are no longer acceptable to you yourself.  You're ready to move on to better things.

I'm holding you.
Plucky

[tejaspear]

Your relations with your N husband sound SO MUCH like the relationship my ex-b/f had (and still has somewhat) with is N ex. One thing that strikes me is that when I was first getting to know him he told me that he couldn't give me maybe what he gave her and therefore might not be able to give me what I deserved. I asked him what that was, and he said he gave her his self-respect. I just said, "Oh, that's no problem. I don't want your self-respect." I didn't understand that he was telling me that he has not healed.

Anyhow, I just wanted to point out that it is REALLY good how you are keeping your self-respect as you plow through this!! 

The other thing is, she always was worried about him cheating on her even though he really wasn't the type to cheat. She would threaten suicide just for his going on very innocent walks with her own best friend. Yet she cheated on him, big-time. In fact the last time she cheated on him she even "married" the guy in some pagan ritual. (She found the journal where she described the whole ceremony.) It was only her cheating so flagrantly that got him to divorce her, but for him, he only divorced her sexually. So many of the same interrelations still exist with them. She says things to make him feel guilty and responsible for her, and he totally buys into it.

Kudos to you for your very healthy "work" you are doing in learning and understanding just what's going on and not buying into all that crap anymore.

It has been very disillusioning for me personally to see my ex-b/f give up his relationship with me because I would not stand for his continued "close personal friends" relationship with her. (They don't even have children together, and she made a point to call most of the times I came to his home, etc.) He described so well how she abused him. I heard so much about it I could practically write a book. The things she would say to him to intimidate and tear him down, "No one else would have you," etc. Never apologizing for her outrageous wrongs, never taking responsibility for anything -- not even the cheating. Everything was always his fault. He asked her after they divorced if she had any regrets and her answers were all what she regretted about HIS behavior, "I regret that you were like this, and I regret that you weren't like that." No regrets about her own behavior. She also pummelled him into deep debt without his knowledge. (She kept the books and paid the bills, or was supposed to pay the bills, with the money he made -- and he made very good money.) He is just SO clear on all the abuse, but totally WHIPPED even now, nearly 2 years since they separated.

So, seeing you be in even a worse situation in a way -- being with that N for nearly twice as long -- and seeing you really confront the real issues is really heartening to me. It is such a shame to see a person so capable of giving and receiving love to stay chained to an N's emotional blackmail and refuse to admit that that is even what is happening. I will follow your story with great interest and be cheering for you always...!!!!!!!!!!!

Hugs,
TP

[Surrounded]

Wow...I have gotten so accustomed to his nonsense that I guess I didn't realize how bad things are.  You guys are amazing.  I get strength from your posts, every one.

Roaring dad:
Really, my journals can be subpeonaed???   Good thing they are gone!   HAHA.  What about this site?  Or computer histories?  I worry, but mostly, I think they will just prove what my point in the end.

Tejaspear:  the suicide threat thing is really cowardly, IMO. And an ultimate mind game.  Recently, he has turned to sickness and crying...yes, he found out how to make himself cry after knowing him for 20 years now, he finally cries.  Only to manipulate me and his daughters into doing what he wants.  Cause he knows we will respond.   

Last week, in order to keep tabs on me and get out of working, he "threw his back out"  Oh dear, he has to stay home in bed all week.  And whine and moan about his back.  I feel so cold, but I am so sick of it and I see what he is doing so it makes me crazy.  He likes to tell me I'm cold when he really wants me to respond his way.    He won't even allow me to say I'm sick cause if I do...all of a sudden....he feels a little sick too.  He knows I will be the one to take care of everything, sick or not anyway.  But he can't even let me have that.

He was actually snickering at me while I was driving him to an appointment, because he didn't think he could drive himself.  (Really he just wanted to control my day).  We were driving in a snowstorm on icy roads and the car slid a little around a corner a little.  He snickers cause  I can't handle the car as well as he could, obviously.  Well, we get out a few minutes later and.... we had a completely FLAT tire.   Maybe I'm not such a bad driver after all??  I didn't say anything, it was actually a blessing for me because the tension in the car was way too thick and I knew we were headed for a fight.  Now he had to focus on the tire--not me.   

He won't cheat on me either, cause he is too scared of a disease.  I wouldn't care anyway at this point.  I wish he would, it would get ME out easier.

(((((Plucky))))))   Thanks!  You know I will be keeping me eyes and ears and heart in your posts.

Marta:  The computer advise is helpful.  And well heeded.  I hate the games and going behind his back cause it's not like me, but I know I have to protect myself now.

Write:  Amen.  And thanks!  (((((())))))  Hugs back at ya!

Hopalong:  The laywer is just around the corner.  Saving up some cash first.  I know, he is abusive.  Sometimes it is such a hard thing for me to get out of my denial.  I have been denying this for about 5 years now.  (blatantly)  For the kids, I guess.  I first asked for a divorce about then.  That's when the suicide threat was and the porn was a big deal.  He doesn't seem so bad at that now dayswith the porn...probably just better at hiding it.  He also has computers elsewhere he can use.  Frankly, I don't care or have the time to monitor that anymore, but if you think it would help.....

Sorry, some of these replys and posts are long.  I have to take advantage of the time when I have it.

Also, I have been reading a book about adults that grew up in a N family, and wow it has shed a lot of light.  One thing that hit me hard is realizing that my kids are depending on me to use my power to protect them.  Power I have been too nice and people-pleaser type to dare to use.  Protection from the mind games he pulls on them and the rages he goes into.  I have done what I could short of his being gone.  I wonder if it would be a first step to ask for a separation.  I know we are all a lot happier when he is not around.  We can relax and enjoy stuff and each other.  I don't have to be shooshing them all the time.  He was so mad our oldest was getting bad grades because it hurt his feelings and his pride, that he wanted to send her away.   What????  What an N!!!!    I know that once I cross this guy, that is it.  Be ready for all manner of evil.   I have learned what button NOT to push.  Mom prepared me for that.

He also likes to ACT empathetic.  He knows  where to go...."oh how sad, or ...ohhh how cute", or.....  whatever ....in the right places.  But really, now it just creeps me out cause I know it is an act he learned from his mom.  She is the extrovert, pretender type.  My mom is the cold, damn you, type.   

Anyway, just my thoughts for today.  Again, thanks for accepting me.  I am starting to feel weight lifting and I am able to bear this nonsense a little easier in my mind.  Not always condemning myself for having reactions and feelings about the way people treat me.

Have a great day ALL!

[Hopalong]

You can get some good library books on protecting yourself in ADVANCE of divorce and also get free basic starter advice at a free law clinic...

hope you won't let the money make you wait too long for learning about the legal side of things...

(I know, I nag.)

Sending luck....and strength.

Hopalong

[Plucky]

Hi Surrounded,
you can also just call up one of the attorneys that advertises and get a free consultation over the phone.  It may not be the one you want to use, and you will not want to follow any advice you get without a second opinion, but at least you can get some basic facts and start to understand what the issues are.  Do not give up after one phone call.   Some of them are jerks.  I was divorced before and I went through 5 phone calls for a very simple situation.    Call from a public or friend's phone.

Plucky

[2224Jessica]

Hi Surrounded,
Oh my gosh you are amazing for still even managing to survive. I don't really know how to respond but I want to be there to care and support you. It's amazing how we are conditioned to put up with abuse from our parents.
Now that you can see through the crap, you hold the power. Look forward to the future when you are emotionally free from all this horrible treatment.  All the best, take care
Jessica

[tejaspear]

I'll second that. Absolutely. Your strong and sane self is totally coming through for you. Congratulations. I know you'll do GREAT...!!!!!!! 


TP

[movinon]

Anyway, he gets me to fall apart or get upset with him and somehow I look like the idiot, or apologize for what he did, assure him it's not him---it's anything but him and he's fine.  He's got his fix.  I stand there, feeling raped emotionally, he looks like the hero.  Because somehow he makes it seem like either I am totally on his case for saying anything OR I am the blubbering idiot who can't handle anything without him.  These days, I play along, so he will get his fix and move on.

Wow, this sound just like my ex-husband to be.  This is my first post.  I have been doing research all day on NPD and I am trying to do a collaborative divorce process with him.  I too, have been scared of him in my marriage.  From what I know, my husband and yours are what is referred to as high-functioning.  They "look good" to others and may have adamant followers that would NEVER beleive they were abusive.  Your husband is abusive and so is mine.  After I left a year and a half ago, I "took him back" twice.  He's in recovery I reasoned - doesn't mean jack!  He's a sick, sick man.  In my divorce process, I thought I'd be "nice" and give him extra visitation with our daughter and forget all about the $$$ he owes me - money he STOLE out of our account and from trashing most of our belongings.  These people see this as weakness.  I was ripe for the attack and he took it - trying to put restrictions on where I live - within the same town for goodness sakes!  TAKE, TAKE, TAKE.  This man is showering with our 6 year old daughter and sleeping with her.  He's a sex addict.  He raped me in our marriage.  I want to deny him seeing her, but what rights do I have?  I've just gotten pissed enough in the last 2 days to say no more.  Sitting in a lawyers meeting where the 2 lawyers main concern is to not "inflame" him doesn't cut it for me anymore.  When does the real stuff get addressed.  Going to court will be messy and expensive, but my daughter is worth it.  If I don't stand up for her, who will?