Talking behind your back

[Tamara Janow]

Hello,
I am new to this list but have been lurking with interest for the past few days.
I have to say that I am very happy that I found out about Narcissism and it's traits, as I've been trying to figure out my mother for years. As of Christmas, I have cut ties with her again. It wasn't even a huge blowout like it had been in the past, but just needed to step away from her craziness and her hyper self importance.
One of the things I find most interesting is that traits amongst Ns are very similar. I had gone through clinical depression back in 1999 and it lasted approximately 9 months. My mother thought this was a "pity party" I was having and had "selective memories" about what had actually happened in my childhood. There was one memory in particular that stood out. I was about 11-12 years old, maybe younger and we were expecting company for the day. She asked me to carry a laundry basket full of folded clothes upstairs and put them away. It was stacked higher than the basket itself and when I picked it up, it fell over and the clothes fell out. For that, I got smacked in the face, yelled at, pushed on the ground and stood over and screamed at. Then she decided to go upstairs in my room and grab my suitcase and pack it for me, put me in the car and proceed to drive me to the busstop. She was going to give me $1.00 and it was up to me to figure out where I was going to go. She turned the car around about 1/2 the way there. Later on that day when our company got there, she actually told them about my day and made a joke out of it. When I mentioned this to her during my depression, she "didn't remember" this incident at all. Never mind the fact that my brother and father did. Her reasons for not talking to me and slamming me to her family during this time was that, "it was a difficult time for her". For her. My depression was difficult for her, yet she didn't talk to me for two years after the fact.

I have seen her slam my brother, her friends, my father and many others behind their backs but when she wants to play family, she actually expects everyone to fall into line when she says so. Even though she has spent years defaming her own children to her mother and brothers and basically anyone who will listen.

I am ranting, but does anyone else experience this??

[Avery]

Hi, Tamara.  I have experienced the same type of treatment from my Nmother and I also suffer from depression.  Let me say how sorry I am that you had to cut off contact with your mom - but it'll give you time to get perspective and figure some things out - without all of the guilt and nastiness clouding your vision.  I cut off contact with my mother in June - it has been hard, but ultimately very freeing.  Maybe I'll find a way to "get along" with her, maybe not.  

Your story makes me so sad.  What a horrible javascript:emoticon(':x') thing to do to a child!  You must have been scared to death!!  I can't believe some of the things that I've read on this board...we should all be proud that we survived it all!  I can totally see my mother doing something similar.  Isn't is funny how their memories are so selective?  

When I was 7, my mother took me to my stepfather's parents house for the afternoon.  I was alone in the living room with my stepfather's father and he began molesting me.  I went to the kitchen to tell my mother and she said "just stay out of his way, that's what i do.  stop making trouble."  she tried to force me to go back on more than one occasion and only quit when i threatened to tell my father.  when i asked her about it years later, she told me to "quit living in the past, it's really not healthy.  why can't you let anything go?"  can you believe??? javascript:emoticon(':shock:')

she's also good at talking behind my back.  when i went to visit her (she lives in another state, thank god), i asked her when i might be able to visit my brother.  i went into the other room and i heard her talking to my grandmother about me.  she couldn't believe that i would "lower" myself to want to spend time with my brother, since i was such a "snob".  I couldn't believe it!!  Of course, I was crushed, but I didn't say a word.  Can't say anything disagreeable to mother!!    

She also bashes everyone in my family, because "they spoil their children" or "can't hold a job" or "won't stop blubbering because their wife died".  She was even throwing a fit because someone she worked with "had too many operations.  she's only doing it for attention".      

I'm learning how to separate from her and until i do, i won't be talking to her.  depression is a horrible illness and i feel for you.  i hope that you have a support system to help you through those black days.  i went to group therapy (which was helpful) and the counselor said that "depressed people are very angry, but they turn their anger inward and it leads to depression".  i was shocked!  i never considered myself to be an angry person.  after some counseling, i figured out that i really was angry!!  my mother would do or say something to me and i wouldn't say anything to defend myself.  then i'd get angry at myself for not saying anything.  then i'd feel guilty because i had such horrible thoughts about my mother.    does this sound familiar to you?  just curious.  i've gotten some great insight from this board, ie "why did you take it".  all of these wonderful people and their stories have been really helpful and eye-opening.    you are not crazy!  hang in there ((((tamara)))).  do you have a therapist to talk about all of this?  it really helps!  i'm here for you...

avery [/b]

[Avery]

isn't it weird?  i literally had NO IDEA that anyone else had similar issues until i found this board!  how have i lived all these years without knowing that??

[Discounted Girl]

I feel totally the same way. Without ever having exactly said to myself that I must be the only person who is treated this way by their mother, I must have somehow believed in that theory, because when I discovered her weirdness actually had a name and that there were other evil ones like her out there and other children of the monsters being abused less, worse and the same as me, it was a shocker.  You are right, this depression business is awful. What the N didn't take away, the depression is trying to. It's easy to write and read about the right moves and actions to take, but actually doing it when you are completely drained of energy is real hard. I am convinced that the love I have for my children and my desire to steer them into productive and happy lives saved me from earlier depression and a wasted life. But, now my kids are grown and my Dad is gone and my depression has gained strength. I am grieving for the time I lost and the joy of childhood I never had. I still yearn to feel loved, to be valued and cherished. I wonder if it will ever go away. But, this board has helped greatly and I am truly grateful for all your posts.

[Tamara J]

I know how you feel. Always knew my parents were nuts. Even as a baby in a highchair watching my father threaten to stab my mother in the back with a jacknife. Idiots. It's amazing how similar the stories are from one another. Thought we just had a very bizarre family or that I was just making a big deal out of very little.

As far as sexual abuse goes. My mother had an uncle that lived with her aunt and grandmother. We used to stop over to visit them every time we went up north to her family's house. Her uncle who was about 45 at the time and drank, used to have me come over to him so he could feel me up and talk about my "boobies". This was all done in front of everyone and they all thought it was humorous. I didn't. I was about 7-12 years old while this was going on. I mentioned this scenario to my mother, not even accusing her of letting this happen to me, but said that if I had a daughter and someone did this to her, I'd kill them. And that this kind of behavior and her letting it happen was just one reason why I would distrust her. Her answer: I was supposed to ask him for an apology, not her. And I always embarrased her when I became too provocative at too young an age. None of this was any of her responsibility.

I had also mentioned that I remembered clearly that when I was about 6-7 years old and my father wanted to kiss me. His way of kissing me was to put his tongue in my mouth and think that was funny. I tried fighting him off and inadvertently hit him in his groin and he got angry and started hitting me on my face and head. I ran into the bathroom when he was finished, trying to get away from him and looking for comfort. Her answer: "next time you shouldn't hit him there". She can't understand why I wouldn't go to her for comfort or trust her at all.

This b*tch doesn't deserve to know me.

[Tamara J]

Rob,
I am so sorry to hear that story. How disturbing that must have been for her and for you to remember. Disgusting behavior of these people.

At one time I knew that my mother had been sexually abused somehow, but I heard the information second hand and she never admitted to it when I asked her about it. You have to wonder if this is the reason she became who she is.

Strangely enough about Ns and their sexual behavior. My mother is 57, I am 34. When my husband and I first got married 8 years ago, she would outwardly flirt with him. It was embarrasing. I never felt threatened by it, but why she was doing it was just strange. She would go so far as to compare herself to me and even grope him in front of her own family and husband. He felt uncomfortable. I never confronted her on it as I felt it would just embarrass her, but it was still strange.

[write]

that is horrible.

I have an early memory of an unspecified traumatic event, though sometimes I have thought it was my mother trying to catch my grandfather out in child abuse with me or my sister, both under five years...it was all so contrived...any way, my mother was banned from her parents home for years and we were terrified of her father, who we saw once or twice a year, probably because he was my father's supervisor and for a few years could lose my father's job.

It was all a weirdness, because we were too young for permanent memories, and my mother was too mad/ alcoholic ( and believe me I'm not doing the usual American: alcoholism= heavy drinking thing here )  for anything really.
My father, Mr Borderline, took charge for occasional ten minute intervals. Which confused things greatly.

What I don't get is
WHEN I LET MY CHILD DOWN, I COMPENSATE, EVEN OVERCOMPENSATE. I do anything to prevent him pain.
WHY WERE MY PARENTS NOT LIKE THIS?????????????????????
They knew, but they chose not to know....
Then they chose not to acknowledge.
Then they ignored our struggles to cope.

I AM FULL OF HATE WHEN I think of things in their right context.

NO ONE EVER HAS OR WILL ABUSE MY CHILD, that is the only sense I can make of my life.

Also I teach him about abusiveness and not to harm others.