Is she an N or what

[anony123]

I have had an ' On again, Off again' relationship with a '40 something woman for 6 months . She comes from an Alcoholic childhood where her Dad drank, beat up her Mom and had affairs .She Married a "handsome powerful man" who also drank and had affairs and 10 years and three kids later he left her.She describes her marriage as "in turmoil from day one.We broke up every three months and he came back when he missed me."
 My relationship with her is always "on edge" we have had 4 bust-ups in 6 months and now she says that she wants to just "be friends" after seeing a Therapist twice.She became real 'bitchy' after seeing this T. This was a huge switch in mood because she is a "China Doll" type  -"Princess Perfect -all sweetness and light" !
 I am usually the one who "retreats" into my cave after an argument and then she calls me a week or two later and we make up. She says that she feels rejected when I retreat.
She called me a week ago when we were separated and said that she regards herself now as 'single'.
She also called me Saturday morning to meet and talk . We went to our regular "break-up ,make-up coffee shop". We chatted for a little time and then she said that she would prefer that we talk more privately. I took her to my place, made some lunch and went into my bedroom .SHe explained again that she wanted only a friendship in the future ..Slowly we slipped into massaging and then 3 hours of sex.  At about 5 pm she said that she needed to go home to fix dinner for her son ,and I asked her if she would like to go for coffee at a local club later at 8pm. She paused and looked at me and said thoughtfully," Well, I guess that coffee is within the boundaries of FRIENDSHIP !" I was speechless after what we had just done .She looked quite serious .
Anyways we went out for coffee at 8 and then some more clubbing and had a really wonderful night out. We spoke the next day by phone a few times and she spoke as if she wanted me to take her dancing - I had other plans.. I am confused about what this woman is saying and doing .Her behavior seems to be inconsistent with her stated wishes . Is she just jerking me around and playing with my head ? DO I walk away . I am about done with her unfathomable actions .However I am powerfully attracted to her and that bothers me too.
What do you ladies think?

[gratitude28]

I think you are being played for the fool. She will continue to use you as long as you allow her. She sounds like a highly irresponsible woman (Where are the kids in all this? What kind of life are they having?).
Beth

[Hopalong]

Welcome Anony123,
That powerful sex could deafen you to your inner voice that's screaming FIRE! GRAB THE PUPPY AND GET OUT!

You can have happy great chemistry with another woman.
You can never have a happy shared life with this one.

Hopalong

[Sela]

Hi A:

I am confused about what this woman is saying and doing .Her behavior seems to be inconsistent with her stated wishes .

Who wouldn't be?  Your brain is giving you the correct message: confusion.

That's a good thing.   Now all you have to do is listen to it. 

I am powerfully attracted to her and that bothers me too.

What bothers you about being so powerfully attracted to her?
Could you elaborate further?

Welcome here, by the way.

  Sela

[anony123]

Hopalong, why do you say that I can never have a happy life with this woman (I probably agree, but I would like your opinion)
Sela, I am bothered by my attraction because it is so addictive. In many ways I wish that I could just walk away and never see her again, but I feel powerless in her company (never happened to me before in 30years of adulthood).

She is so pretty and so "sweet" - men are drawn to her becaause she is a "child/woman".
I really would like to know why she engaged in 3 hours of sex right after telling me that she wanted only a "friendship".  Any guesses are welcome ladies.Does she just want to keep me on the 'backburner' ?  If I wanted to breakup with a woman I would do it in the coffee shop ,not in her bed !! I just do not get her. But this type of behavior is not unusual for her. Endless inconsistencies and contradictions . Crazy stuff.

Oh,BTW she still shares a house with her ExB/F . They bought the place five years ago when they were intending to get married . He and she broke up three years ago and he sleeps in a rear room. Now he is the live remains of her previous disasterous past.

[Hopalong]

Anon,
All I can do is say what it would be like for me. If I'd made love to someone for three hours and he briskly informed me that was all about FRIENDSHIP, when what I really want is a long-term love, I'd be outta there.

Well, not true. In times past, I'd-a been stuck on him like a barnacle, waiting for him to reciprocate my loyalty. You see, one day he would wake up and not be selfish and manipultive. Except, oops, that wasn't just behavior, it's who he was. She made me think of the childlike sexuality of a Melanie Griffith or Marilyn Monroe...that breathy voice. Dunno if your ladyfriend is like that, anyway.

I think her behavior is who she is. And if you want to live with who she is, you can exhaust yourself wooing and screwing (pardon my French but it rhymes). And like any 4-course meal, you'll wake up satiated one day, stagger to the kitchen, and realize that you've been left with the mess.

I'm not awake enough to write good images. I understand the appeal of great sex. In my life, more than once I have had the best sex with the worst people. I've now decided that I would gladly accept warmer, less spectacular but loving sex with a good man, a steady-hearted partner...and count myself lucky I didn't get fooled by the fireworks. Had too many blow up in my face, and this woman sounds like the female version of my various trainwrecks.

So that's why. Voice of experience.
Hope it helps,

Hops

[Brigid]

Anony,
I assume we are still talking about the same woman that you discussed on the other thread.

You are wondering how she can have mind-blowing sex with you and then consider you just a friend.  I would say that it is because she is incapable of sharing real intimacy, and as long as she considers you "unavailable" as a love partner, she can be sexually intimate with you. 

I agree that some therapy would benefit you to help find out why you are so attracted to someone like this. 

Brigid

[Anansi]

Hi Anony,

You asked what the ladies thought.  I hope their feedback is helping.  Would you like to hear what another male here thinks?

Anansi

[Sela]

Hi again Anony:  (better not use "A" as there are more than one now........welcome to you too Anansi):

Sela, I am bothered by my attraction because it is so addictive. In many ways I wish that I could just walk away and never see her again, but I feel powerless in her company (never happened to me before in 30years of adulthood).

Thanks for answering that question.  Ok.  Here's my take.

Addictive?  Sends out a big, large, huge red flag and loud sirens start going off in my head when I read that.
You feel addicted?  Powerless?

Whoa!!  Turn Silver around and head for the hills fast!!  Get support.  Get a therapist.  Join a anaon-somethingorother group.  Whatever it takes........just get away from her!!

Just get going and go fast and don't look back.

Don't even be friends.  Seriously.

You don't want to be addicted to anyone......do you?
Powerless?  In the relationship?  You can live with that?

I say: High tail it!

  Sela

[anony123]

This forum and your replies are helping me greatly.
To ANANSI, yes please, another male's take on this would be great . Please go slowly though . I am absorbing all this real slowly .

To Brigid -I am a little confused by your post and the "unavailable" comment.
We have been "love partners" and therefor "available" for over 5 months (give or take a few separations). Maybe she creates drama and turmoil to CREATE distance and prevent true intimacy.
She is never really active and vigorous  in any activity except at the height to HER sexual passion. Her whole demeanor is passive and "underinvolved" (my word). She has a huge expectation that the 'man' will do most of the work and she then acts like a passive recipient. Maybe this strategy puts her in the 'princess' position so that if stuff goes wrong is becomes HIS fault because she did not actively DO anything.
( I love this statement of hers - " It is the mans job to shield,protect and provide for me AND to take off my bra. !")_

More please ?

[Brigid]

anony,

To Brigid -I am a little confused by your post and the "unavailable" comment.

I will explain by using my own experience with this very thing.  My xnh and I were married for over 23 years.  During our courtship (technically I was still unavailable), our sex life was very active.  After we got married and I became very available, our sex life died a slow and painful death.  When he told me very suddenly nearly 3 years ago that he was leaving our marriage because he had found someone else, I begged him to go to counselling--which he agreed to for 6 weeks.  During that time he quite suddenly became very interested in me sexually.  I thought it was because he was having second thoughts, but when he left anyway (also very suddenly), my therapist explained that the sexual interest existed because he once again saw me as unavailable and therefore sexually interesting.  The woman he left me for was and still is married to someone else--also unavailable.  Some people can only be intimate with those who are unavailable.  This can also take the form of pornography (also an issue with my ex), prostitutes, etc.  The unavailability makes it impossible to form a truly intimate relationship.  N's are incapable of intimacy.

I hope that helps to explain what I meant.

Brigid

[Hopalong]

Hi Anony,
You have the focus on her.

I'd rather turn it gently back to you:

I am bothered by my attraction because it is so addictive

I don't want to comment more on her because I think that will feed your addiction.
But help you look at your craving for this unhealthy attachment that is harming you? Sure.

If you look at the place in your mind (apart from sex) where you feel most connected to her, what feelings arise? If you take that same feeling and trace it back through the years...what memories come up?

That's where your recovery would begin, I think. I do think it would help you a lot to also talk to a wise, experienced therapist about this. I think it can be massively destructive to your life and wellbeing (having been there...)

best,
Hopalong

[anony123]

Hopalong, the feeling that she triggers in me most (outside the sexual) is that she 'listens' to me.However what I thought was true listening on her part has narrow limits. She stops listening when she hears something from me that causes even mild discomfort in her. We talk at an intellectual and detached level to avoid stepping on her sensitivities (and possibly mine too).Many time I bite my tongue. Hiowever, she is, many times unaware of the impact that her statements make on me.
I guess that being 'heard and really understood ' are what attracts me to her BUT I am deluding myself because my thoughts feelings and wishes only penetrate IF they suit her.

[Hopalong]

I am deluding myself

GOOD FOR YOU.
That honesty is a step toward health.
It's evidence that a part of you knows the direction you want your life to go.

Trust it. Get help strengthening your respect for your inner voice if you need to.
If you do, don't be ashamed of the need for help for one second.

Addiction is a powerful thing...but having a good life is worth all the discomfort of beating it.
(Plus, once you get started, it's actually more exciting and creative to get healthy than it
was to waste your precious life in toxic relationships. Way more.)

Hopalong

[mudpuppy]

Hi anony123,

I'm a guy and here's my perspective.

She is playing head games with you, perhaps not even knowingly. People who play head games never stop.
If you're looking for more than being made to jump through hoops you ought to look elsewhere.

mud