Introduction and trying to stay on course with divorce

[Stormchild]

Hi pavelle, welcome!

I've been spared the horrors of having to divorce and co-parent with an N, there are very wise souls here who are already advising you directly, but I know about the pity trap, the helplessness trap, that Ns can set for their sources of supply...

Ns seem to be programmed to take extreme advantage of the human tendency to confuse pity with love. You find yourself feeling sorry for them and mistaking this for a deeper bond, you find yourself wanting to help them and thinking that you might build something lasting on the shared triumph over a problem.

It's bait, only bait. Love includes compassion and pity but it isn't just these things, it includes helping but it isn't just that. If you are the only one to give compassion and empathy, the only helper, it isn't love. In the non-N world even the tiniest infant, or someone who is bedridden and very ill, seems to want to give something back, out of love, and they find a way to give it - coos, smiles, humor, grace, - just 'being love' towards the person who is with them. It's not an obligation, any more than breathing out is an obligation when you've breathed in. It's the other half of the dance.

Ns never breathe out. They cannot dance this dance. They are to be pitied - but from a safe distance. If you can't get to that safe distance [if you must co-parent with them, for instance] pity is a luxury you can't afford. Compassion can help, but it helps best, I think, if you reserve most of it for yourself and those with you who have suffered and N-dured alongside you.

It looks to me like you've pretty much figured all of this out already, but Ns work so hard to confuse and destabilize our perceptions that it never hurts to have someone reaffirming these things.

[Brigid]

Stormy,

Ns seem to be programmed to take extreme advantage of the human tendency to confuse pity with love. You find yourself feeling sorry for them and mistaking this for a deeper bond, you find yourself wanting to help them and thinking that you might build something lasting on the shared triumph over a problem.

This is a very good and concise statement of the chaos they create in our lives.  I always viewed my ex as someone who needed to be cared for.  That the little boy that he was did not have a proper mother and I was going to step in and fill the role.  Certainly, not knowingly at first, but as time went on and the roles in the marriage became more defined.  I also felt the need to protect him from his father who he revered on one hand and loathed on another, but could never stand up to and be a man.

Even as he was walking out of therapy saying he "couldn't do this anymore,"  I was begging (literally) for him to reconsider.  I was imploring him to stay to let the kids and I help him through whatever struggles he was having that made it necessary to leave the family.  This after all the information I had learned of the affair, sex addiction, etc., etc.  How truly pathetic and needy I was and I know how gratifying it was for him to see me like that.  He had finally won by turning me into a pathetic pile of goo who would crawl on my hands and knees clinging to a man who did not care a whit.

Pavelle, as Stormy said, don't confuse pity with love.  This guy will be fine--or as fine as he can be with his multitude of dysfunctions.  You have to give up the fight for him, as I finally did, and fight for yourself and your daughter.  I found that by moving from sadness and hopelessness to a great deal of anger at all he put us through, really motivated me to get up, get moving and start getting on with my life.  It's good to slowly let go of that anger over time, but I found it necessary early on to give me energy and purpose.

My arsenal of weapons to save myself became a very good therapist, a very good attorney, my very good friends and my wonderful children (pretty much in that order since the kids were never a weapon, but certainly a motivator).

Many blessings as you move forward on your journey to finding peace.

Brigid

[mum]

I was just reminded in reading here, that the pity thing is huge....it's pretty much what attracts Ns to the nurturing type...like blood in the water. And part of staying with those big baby/bullies, is a twofold fear:
Fear that we are not good people if we leave them, floundering and damaged and "baby" like as they are. We know they are screwed up and probably even why they are, and we feel like since we know where the bullshit they hand out actually comes from....we can somehow fix it...care for it.( We can't. )
In addition, there is the fear that they will punish us with the "bully" thing for actually leaving them. This fear is well founded, as they WILL punish us, sometimes (as in the case of sharing kids with them) for the rest of our lives. How dare we leave them? You can't leave an N, they are the ones who leave! They choose, not us! So, even though they may abuse us horribly, we will still be seen as a villan for taking control of our own lives.
 But, so what?
If we are damned if we do, and damned if we don't, then I say (from experience) we are far better off owning our own lives.

[Hopalong]

Storm, Brigid, Mum:

Your three posts here could be a digest of all the best books on leaving an N--how it feels and why it's absolutely necessary. These are brilliant.

I remember feeling like a moth pinned to a board alive...my wings were flapping but the pity and guilt I felt skewered me through the best part of myself.

Thank god the wings won.

Hops

[mum]

I remember feeling like a moth pinned to a board alive...my wings were flapping but the pity and guilt I felt skewered me through the best part of myself.

Thank god the wings won.

Oh, HOPS! What a brilliant collection of words. You are a writer, yes? Oh, my gosh, PLEASE write a book, so I can read words worked together in thoughts like this over and over.
Here's my attempt at making that last request sound more interesting (I am not a writer!) and actually how I feel about wanting to read words like yours (that make such amazing images!):
I want to sink into a bathtub full of your words....and sing underwater and blow bubbles and soak until my skin wrinkles up with water.
ARe you indeed working on a book? PPPPPLLLLEEEEAAAASSSSE DO! I can just see all kinds of people submerged in your book! See it? I do!
It's not a fantasy...you wrote words, and they completely inspired someone else.....wow!!

[Hopalong]

Good grief I hope you have some nice moisturizing bubbles. 

Thank you Mum. 
I have written a lot of poetry and one chapter of a novel I yearn to finish.

You encourage me!
love,
Hops

[mudpuppy]

Thank god the wings won.

For a minute I got excited. I thought we were talking about hockey. Never mind.

mud

[Hopalong]

 

[pavelle]

All:
what a wealth of good stuff here to return to. I went out in the sunshine today (it has rained and rained here all month) and then to a film with a friend of mine. I had many a good cry alone today too, lots of grieving, which had been dormant I think and slowly the grief is hitting, which I think is a good thing.
I'm trying to hold my heart intact right now, bring in some compassion. I really cried today to keep and hold that and I truly see how that can get skewed and has, most definately.
Funny to return to this and see that acknowledged, that fine line. I also need to feel it safe again to have it, to keep that empathy going, that heart to beat again because it is "me" returning and will carry me in my alone, bring back my self-nurture.
So what to do? Today I just prayed while I cried, that I can accept that my job is done and stop this compulsion to hold onto this relationship and let it pass. I also prayed that I don't spiritually execute my ex. To me this means accepting that I don't really know, nor need to know his potentials, that is no longer mine, nor is the outcome. I cried a great deal doing this, because I am not there yet, but I want to be and I need a good deal of help "letting that go". It's no longer mine to know.
My daughter is not his, he has not seen her since we split, nor ever has to again. We share no children, though live in a rather small New England community. The only thing holding this thing is the emotional grip, the last bit of legalities and the grieving that is left to work through.

I guess I'm pretty lucky, it could have been far more difficult...this seems hellish.

Pavelle

[Hopalong]

Tremendous growth in a compressed period can indeed feel hellish...but what leaps you're choosing to make, Pavelle---I am so impressed that you decided to grieve and accept your grieving, and this:

I don't really know, nor need to know his potentials, that is no longer mine, nor is the outcome.

I think you have taken a deep, important step today.

Keep breathing, keep walking, and weep when you need to.

You are moving through.
(That compassion has to extend to yourself, your bruised heart and awakening mind, FIRST and foremost.) You're doing it! For yourself and your child. Bravo.

(((((((((((Pavelle))))))))))))))))

[mum]

Pavelle.  I am moving home, TO a small community in New England. I couldn't wait to get out of there 25 years ago, and ironically, now I am heading back...I think to make my peace with it as an adult. 20 years drying out in the desert was enough.

Anyway, welcome back to yourself...and enjoy the trees, you never know how wonderful they are until you live without them.