Baiting

[gratitude28]

Hi All,
I hate to admit to this, but I believe I have been baiting my mother lately. As I have said before, she never calls me (although she calls my sister four times a day). We also play on the same game site online... on with chat.... When you log on to the site, you can go to Friends and see if you r friend is there and go to their room just by clicking on a link. I have told her this, but she will go there and wait for me... even though I told her sometimes I leave it on and she could find me. When she had me add and IM to my computer, she would write a lot... but that was because she liked using the IM. Basically, it's ok if it's her program, but since the game site was one I was originally on, it is not that interesting to her.
So today I went to her room after I had been on for a while and asked why she didn't look me up. She said she had and I wasn't there... not true, because it tells you if your friends were there. Also, when she tells me she waits for me to call or that it is so far away and that is why she doesn't call, I tell her (yet again) that you can get very cheap phone cards or a plan. Of course she won't.
So why am I baiting her? I have also been having bad dreams where I scream at her or feel pissed at her.
For the most part, I feel like I have successfully dampened a lot of these feelings. So what is going on with me?
Thanks for listening.
Love, Beth

[isittoolate]

Hiya Beth
 she never calls me (although she calls my sister four times a day).

Might this be why you are baiting her, and did I pick up that you want to catch her in a lie? Sounds as though she just might be lying about the logging on???

Tell us more!

xx
Izzy

[Lupita]

Dear Grats, My situation is so similar. That is why I dare to say something, because I think you might be feeling the same way I do. For some reason, your mother enjoys the company of our sister, chatting or playing a game in the internet, or talking on the phone, they dont have to be together physically, bet they are together anyway. They are together because your mom enjoys being with her. Probably she does not enjoy being with you and that is why she does not try to find you in the chat, the game room, or the phone.  You feel it. You have felt it probably all your life and you will never know why your mother prefers to interact with your sister more than with you.
It happened to me too. My mom always went shopping with my sister, took her personally to school amd picked her up from school personally. In all my years of school, elementary, etc, my mother never took me and never picked me up. Never. never!!!!! I never saw my mother waiting for me at the door of the school. I dreamt about that, and when I came from school walking alone I imagined that she was walking with me and I even talked to her in my imagination. Like that I can tell you many situations. Many.
Do we know why our mothers do that? No. We will never know.
The only thing we can do is choose how to react to that. Your own mind is a sacred enclosure into which nothing harmful can enter except by your permission. The way your mind looks at what she is doing. It is of paramount importance that we know how to harness and control the great force of our feelings.
I dont know if I am making any sense to you, but my mom's behavior does not hurt me as much as it used to. I am aware that you have much more esperience in this business than me, but I thought that you would not mind if I offered you my thoughts.
We love you, I appreciate all the nice comments and encouragement that you have had for me. I really thank you for all your adivises. Now, you are a good writer, so, you might notice that my English is not very good. So sometimes I have to find my way with vocabulary and if I read something that I founf interesting or beautiful I use it here. So, if you see a sofisticated word is beacuse I read it in some article.
God bless you.
Love,
Lupita

[Lupita]

I want my mommy!!!! You probably want to be her child, you want to be a baby, probably you never were a child. She did not pamper you. Or so I think. That is me. I want my mommy. I need to stop that too.
We love you Grat.
Lupita

[Kimberly]

 8)Don't feel guilty about baiting her.  She has probably programed you to feel guilty so you quit asking,"Why".She sounds like my parents.  A lot of favouritism, emotional and physical abuse growing up.  My parents were alway favouring my sisters. They were always saying hurtful things and comparing me to my sisters. Dad has even said,"I have only 3 daughters."There are 4 of us.  My youngest sister has just gotten married and I found out that day. Mom left a voicemail, message:"Hope everything is fine with you guys, oh by the way Pam and Mark are getting married today, what else, oh i"ve been gone for a week, well hope your all fine, luv you lots, bye." I'm not sure if your family makes hurtful comments too, but as I got older I realized how much my mother lied and the same with Dad.  I always beleived everything and never made any fuss even while growing up and I felt I wasn't treated fairly.  They would come visit my one sister several times a month and never come to my house-then lie about it.  Last year I called Dad on it and he admitted,"Yes, we would go visit your sister once or more a month all the time." They never came to visit me. It's called emotional abuse-Alienating a family member.

You are baiting her because you want to be part of the family and she is deliberately leaving you out.  I baited them too, and found out they were lying about a lot of things. I'm not even sure if 'DAd' is my dad. I don't think he is.  It hurts. I have given up on my immediate family and don't talk to them anymore. I have my husband's family. It's been a month since I've talked to them and I feel less miserable and don't get upset as much.  Everytime i talk to them they say hurtful things, and I'm upset all over again.  It never ends.

I'm not sure how bad your situation is with parent manipulation, but it probably has always been there even while you were growing up. You don't always see things for what they are til you are old enough to handle it. You have to decide what you will put up with, and if you I wish you luck.   You are a worthwhile person, just remember that!

Kimberly

[pennyplant]

So why am I baiting her? I have also been having bad dreams where I scream at her or feel pissed at her.
For the most part, I feel like I have successfully dampened a lot of these feelings. So what is going on with me?

Hi Beth!

This part of your post stood out to me and I hope I'm not being too literal with your words.  To have dampened your feelings--well, that is not the same as feeling them and allowing them to run their course.  I'm kind of on my own little "feeling my feelings and letting them run their course" kick and so that is kind of what I'm recommending here, if indeed I'm understanding how you've explained it.

Dampening the feelings, stuffing them, bottling them up.  That is what I did my entire life.  So, when stuff triggers me, it is triggering some very ancient stuff.  Child anger is how I think of it.  Possibly the purest anger there is.  It is tiring to keep it down all the time.  Maybe you're just tired on some emotional level and it is spurting up into your consciousness during the dreams.

I no longer really have much interest in being closer to my mother.  It took some real hurtful insights to lead me down that particular path.  But I knew all along, somewhere in me, that I was never the daughter my mother wanted.  If she had wanted any at all.  My sister is actually more similar to her in personality and I believe that is why she was favored often enough.  She was also a lot more trouble after about age 2 or 3 and so she could play on my mother's sympathy or guilt or something.

I'm guessing you've got to get in touch with some real old emotions and hurts in order to lay this to rest.  It is unlikely that your mother will see the light about you.  I mean, she has known you all your life and can't see what we here can see on-line.  She's blind in that way.

What a great daughter you are!  But she just can't see that.  Definitely her loss.  But for you to accept that and move on--it's a process, a hard one.  Sounds like you are somewhere in the middle of the process.

For me, it took years.  There was the conversation in my 30s where she said she would not have children again if she had it to do over.  There were many small incidents over the years that made it stressful for me to be around her.  Then my father died and she got his insurance settlement and wouldn't share or tell me what she did with it.  Then the knowledge of N that I got here.  Started to see some things that kind of fit with N.  And now, I'm just not all that interested.  I just go through the motions with her.  And she seems not to care anymore at the lack of closeness.  She used to try and guilt me.  And that was when I saw her much more.  Now, it's--out of sight out of mind.  And I'm getting that way with many people who are just problematic most of the time.  High-maintenance.  Not mutual.  Life is just too short for that.  Maybe I'd still be very caught up in it if I hadn't gone through my father's death the way I did.

Beth, I know it's hard to be the one your own mother treats this way.  I hope something in here gives you some relief.  She's just so flawed and sadly mistaken.  All you can do is heal yourself from the inside out.  It takes a long time.  But you're part way there already.

Love, Pennyplant

[gratitude28]

((((Guys)))))))))))0

I just got to read all your responses... I saw only bean's and izzy's before I checked out for the weekend (my husband left for a three-week deployment, sigh).

All weekend, I thought about bean's and Izzy's responses... and I realized that I have never come to grips with the fact that she lies before.I should have... I remember once I said I felt bad because I had taken too long to respond to a friend's email and she said, "just tell her you were out of town or something." Why lie when you could just tell the truth?

I think, too, that although I believe that my Dad is the one who gave me whatever degree of self-worth and sanity I experienced through childhood and ito adulthood, I am angry that he doesn't bother any more than she does. He is pleased to hear from me, but doesn't go too far out of his way. Sometimes I give my dad a break as I know he was raised by a raving N and then married one. He must have no clue what a real family is like.

Lupita, yes, your description is right-on. I quit every sport/after school club as it was too much a bother for my parents to deal with. But they went to EVERYTHING my sister ever did and raved about it. And it's the same to this day. They couldn't be any less interested in what I am doing... my mother especially. So there is nothing to talk about.

Kimberly, you must be yet another long-lost sister of mine And yes, I am totally programmed not to question why she does things for my sister and not for me. Every once in a while (when my dad or a relative points out an inequality, I am guessing) she tosses over an explanation... "We do this for your sister because...." There is always some "valid" excuse. I look forward to hearing more from you Kimberly!!!! welcome!!!

PP, yes, yes and yes. And I also think I am suffering some guilt from not keeping up the relationship. It seems that you have done well now that you are used to it. I am so used to playing the good daughter role that it's been hard to make this change. I really think she's relieved not to have to deal with my, but maybe I am inferring that. Maybe that's what is hard too, having your mother scrape you off the bottom of her shoe and just be glad the shoe's clean. LOL (funny not funny).

Thanks all... This helps.

I have to say, I always wonder if she will start saying to the relatives, "She never writes or calls." And I wonder if anyone will ever ask, "Do you?"

[pennyplant]

I quit every sport/after school club as it was too much a bother for my parents to deal with.

This happened with me also.  Part of why I quit everything was me--if it became a challenge, I didn't know what to do next.  In our family if it got too hard, then that was it.  With everything.  And even if I had known to just try harder, there would have been no support whatsoever.  I would have been all alone in my endeavor.  No support, no one to talk it out with.  Nothing.  Never any helpful suggestions or advice.  Never a "well, how about playing a different instrument if you don't like clarinet anymore?"  No idea of striving for a goal.  Just quit.

Anyway, I remember doing those things for my kids.  And all my anger from my childhood would rise up to the surface during my kids' concerts.  I'd be sitting in the auditorium and looking around at all the other families sitting there, too.  Three generations!  Gray-haired grandparents, babies, siblings, both mom and dad.  Big brothers and sisters who were on break from college.  When their student was introduced for a solo or whatever, the entire group who was there for them would start cheering and clapping and whistling!  Kind of rude to the others, I suppose.  But just great for the kid on stage.  And I would be seething.  Never in a million years would my parents have done that for me.  It was like pulling teeth to get one of them to do anything of that nature for me.  I don't think my father ever went to one thing.  He thought that was the mother's job.  And my mother resented every second of it.  Hey, maybe she was just liberated!!!  She actually thought, in 1962, that when she came home from the hospital from having my sister, that my father would have a meal on the table for her and have all the windows open in their hot apartment so it would be comfortable for her.  He didn't even know how to boil water.  What made her think that he would learn how to be a househusband in a week?  The N in her I suppose.

I am so glad I did those things for my kids.  I do hope they didn't pick up on my anger, though.  It wasn't at them.  It was at my parents and all the other so-called adults who couldn't lift a finger to help raise me with one little molecule of self-confidence or self-value.  I was raised just the opposite.  To believe I was worth absolutely nothing.  Because that made it easier for their lazy little selves.

See?  It is still in there.  It takes a long time to heal from this.  I'm lucky now that it doesn't get triggered so very often.  When my kids were still at home, it got triggered regularly.  Four or five school functions per year during junior high and senior high.  From 1992 to 2004.  Towards the end, I was forcing myself to go through the motions.  My anger almost took away the joy I felt at seeing my kids on stage.  I was very lucky one time, though.  I went to the school to pick up my son from rehearsal and I got there early.  Hardly anybody was in the auditorium and I sat down to listen all by myself.  Their music teacher got them started on, I think it was some Santana or something along those lines.  All of a sudden, the four T-bones clicked with each other.  They were all buddies anyway.  The teacher just moved off to the side and let them go with it.  They were all grinning and playing their hearts out and swinging their instruments in unison while they played.  It was phenomenal!  And I got to see that.  It was a never to be repeated performance.  During the actual concert they got nervous and inhibited so it wasn't the same.  But I remembered it.  And it was great that I was by myself and didn't even think about the past for once.

That kind of hurt so early on from our parents just becomes a part of your heart I think.  The less I'm around reminders, the better.  I can definitely understand the desire, or the reflex, to bait your mother.  But it's not going to turn out the way your little child heart wants it to.  I wish it would, because you deserve to have that.  But I think it's just not a real option.

((((((((((((Beth))))))))))))))

Love, Pennyplant

[Hopalong]

PP, hon.

It was so not about you. I am so sorry. (I'm mentally clapping and hollering bravos for every single thing you needed that praise for. I'm so sorry your parents were too selfish to notice.)

You are a good mother! Nobody could be so smart and thoughtful and insightful and not be a fine mother. Nobody said perfect. I'm saying FINE. Your kids are lucky.

You are a bright shining copper penny who brings so much heart and insight to everyone she gets near (lets near?).

hugs,
Hops