Author Topic: constructive loneliness  (Read 3715 times)

Hopalong

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #15 on: April 02, 2007, 10:17:03 PM »
Thank you, Stormy, for your spirited protection.

Bless yer heart.

Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

gratitude28

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2007, 10:21:18 PM »
Amen storm. That is a brilliant response.
Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

Sela

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #17 on: April 03, 2007, 12:04:34 AM »
I think too ...loneliness, like happiness, or any strong feeling really....is a state of mind.  I mean, you can't feel lonely if you don't think you're lonely.

An old man once told me:  "You'll never be lonely as long as you have a good book!"

I think there is great wisdom in his words.  They helped me anyhow.

Take good care of you Hops.

 :D Sela

moonlight52

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #18 on: April 03, 2007, 12:19:50 AM »
(((((((((((((((((((((((Hops)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Ditto

Hops - they're not friends if you cannot be who you truly are in their presence.

love to you and the kind compassionate heart of yours

m

Hopalong

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #19 on: April 03, 2007, 07:41:15 AM »
Thanks, (((((((Sela))))))))) and (((((((((((Moon))))))))))).

Ja, I know. I think the wealthy friend's distance was a trigger for a lot of childhood feelings when I was rejected by girls at school. Simple as that.

Anyway, in her reply she also said, I wonder if you worry too much.

I'm sure I do. I just wrote back, keeping it light, and said it had been a visit from the insecurity debbil, and I was booting his hairy keister to the curb. No further response, so I assume we're not going to talk about it any more. I think I'll leave the ball in her court now.

Sigh. Dang. Well anyway, I have taken to heart all the love and kindness here, and I know there's plenty more Out There, so I just need to get off my hairless keister and go mingle! I'll find ways.

thanks, all. More than I can say.

love,
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Stormchild

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #20 on: April 03, 2007, 07:52:24 AM »
Hey Hops,

that business about 'you worry too much' is right out of the same chapter as 'you think too much',
'you care too much', 'you're too conscientious', 'you're too sensitive'.

Basically, whenever someone responds to a genuine problem with any sentence structured as "You ___ too much", their real message is "I'm going to blame you for your situation and leave you completely on your own with it, but I don't have the decency to come right out and admit that."

Major, major red flag.
The only way out is through, and the only way to win is not to play.

"... truth is all I can stand to live with." -- Moonlight52

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axa

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #21 on: April 03, 2007, 09:26:09 AM »
Hops

"chasing the less available" WOW that really hit a note for me.  I think it may be common to most of us here.  It seems that I have a pattern of the less available they are the more energy I put into the relationship..... past tense now methinks!  Is it not what we play out with Ns.  I have noticed it in other areas of my life also which has been like a bolt from the blue.  Always chasing after the rainbow only to find it is behind the next hill.  Well, I am not sure how to identify the "emotionally unavailable" but from that wonderful book some things have enlightened me in some ways.  The initial contact seems to give some flags if we are open.  I noted that your friend has an N parent also........... while this gives you common ground, part of me wants to have relationships/friendships which are not contaminated by N speak.  In the book the author talks about the pseudo intimacy, the way people tell all on first meeting, its as if to set up some connection which is not necessarily linked with the authentic self........... not sure if that makes any sense.  Example, first date with XN he told me we could go and live in Africia and I could have an orphanage and take care of babies with Aids.  This I did tell him I thought was weird considering he hardly knew me but he protested he did.  Well he knew the picture of me he wanted.  Intimacy  takes time.  It builds slowly, I do not have much experience of it I must admit and it is about the real seperate people meeting each other.  Probably rambling here not sure where I am going but hope it makes some sense.

axa

Hopalong

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #22 on: April 03, 2007, 02:40:18 PM »
Thanks, Storm and CB.
I have a feeling it may all have been more along the lines of what CB suggests, that she really felt awkward and I misinterpreted her look. But her emailed reply was too cursory for comfort, so I'll take that as warning not to be emotionally needy around her.

It doesn't mean I don't value her friendship, but that I want to hold onto it very loosely now.

That's all to the good anyway.

CB, thanks for the thoughtful questions. It's aligned with childhood social rejection from wealthy LITTLE girls at the private school where my mother taught. Much as I can and do form close bonds with women when we talk about real and deep things (as we do here), I find it harder in the aspect of church that's just social. Interesting that I have no fear of being in the pulpit, but women's casual gatherings are more difficult.

Class and money stuff is ooooooold. This is a town I found very hurtful as a child...very full of aristocrats, country clubs, people with estates, etc. And racist and snobbish. When I encounter anything resembling snobbery as an adult, the same string gets plucked.

Very good idea to heal that within myself. I think maybe my little side earnings idea will help. I'll be selling to the well-to-do, and anticipate myself very happy in that position. (Maybe liberating some of their excess cash is part of the cure!)

hugs, and I hope to think more constructively on this...

Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

gratitude28

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #23 on: April 03, 2007, 10:53:16 PM »
Hops,
I went to a college chock full of mega-wealthy, celebrity or once-removed types. And I was a nobody. And sometimes people figured it out. And not only was I not rich, I lived in the filthy hell-hole my parents created. Only once did someone throw it in my face, but it was enough to just about kill me. I also didn't have the lithe body that the girls had (or the liposuction tales to go with...).
I'm mostly OK nowadays, but sometimes that fear resurfaces... that I just don't "belong" and people will figure it out.
I think, having established my own identity and created the life we have now... I am confident no matter where I am now. I do, sometimes, realize that I am not part of the "in crowd" with the military wives, and that is OK, because they annoy me. Still, sometimes I feel left out.
I agree with storm about the red flag...and I would go even further back in the thread to where people talked about if you are not comfortable with someone, they can't be a good friend. I have some friends that say off-the-wall stuff and get into ideas I don't believe in, but I just nod my head and let it go at that. I wouldn't make them feel bad about their ideas.
OK, I am rambling and not sure if any of this helps.
Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

Hopalong

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #24 on: April 03, 2007, 11:53:21 PM »
Thanks, Beth (and you too Axa, sorry I overlooked you).

Beth I think you get it. Same time, I think my commenting about my concern over the money gap between us touched a sore place in her. She's a good person, gives her all at church, etc. But she's also pretty materialistic without saying so...just in her house, etc. So perhaps I unintentionally made her feel guilty.

I don't want to and can't monsterize her for whatever her mistake might've been. After all, she's the friend I was so scared of losing this summer when she had cancer. It was just an unexpected awkwardness and I felt solely responsible.

You all made me feel a lot better just by pointing out that there are two people in a relationship, and as I became aware of my projection/blunder, I learned from you that she could've responded more reassuringly.

That's okay now, though. With your help, I'm reassuring myself! 'm trying to just let it go now, so we'll be more at ease when we are together again. We will be, at church at least.

hugs all,
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Gaining Strength

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #25 on: April 04, 2007, 11:29:04 AM »
Hops - I think you found her limit.  I encourage you to keep her as a friend who has a limit in this area.  But aren't we all limited to some degree?  We just have to pick and choose our friends according to what we share with them and what we need in each individual friendship.  I am sorry she could not share that concern of yours.  I know it hurts. 

I love the way you process things.  I admire your strength, your willingness to be vulnerable even though there are costs to that, and your ever-present determination to forge forward and continue healing.  I admire those parts of you Hops. - GS

WRITE

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #26 on: April 04, 2007, 02:12:22 PM »
I think a lot of people ( more so here than I remember in England too ) are worried to have anything asked of them frankly, this great Christian culture and sense of community is a bit of a myth. In England where there is much less religion and community I never was at a loss for help in times of difficulty. In fact people who never bothered with me would step up and be spontaneously kind. Here it's a taboo to need anything unfortunately.
 
People are worried in case others who need something become a nuisance or a burden but also it's insecurity- not wanting to see another side to life where things go wrong and people aren't perfect.
 
I'm waffling Hops but the gist is- it's not you.
 
It's perfectly legitimate to ask for help, and of course there's a chance people will say no or back off. They could say it with more grace and love of course...
 
The reaction to that is what triggers old feelings of insecurity or shame.
 
If she had said yes, i'll help you would have felt strong and empowered to have had the courage to ask.
 
Keep the courage to ask- for everyone who has nothing spare to give there is someone else who will gladly advise or sympathise.
 
As for single life, mine looks a lot brighter this week despite having checked my disastrous last month finances and they're low: one of my friends told me her sex partner pays to stay overnight, another went back to a severely abusive husband because she was worried about money...

How can women feel so disempowered to suffer so someone will take care of them- so lacking in a sense of what being taken care of means too, to think that financial security is so important. I'd rather muddle through with my independence and true security. It'll be okay even if I'm not well off, money is so little in the face of real stuff.
 
My ex offered me half of a windfall he just got, i graciously declined- it'll only be a source of irritation or pain later. I did say can I have a few hundred extra dollars over the summer to entertain our son, and he seemed pleased I'd asked for that. So there was a balance.
 
Frankly I'd rather take my precarious chances and wobble a bit from time to time than accept dependence in a wrong situation.
 
And don't worry about losing a friend- friends don't have to be perfect. I sometimes take a break if my projecting is getting in the way, or their issues are, and most of my friendships soldier on. The ones that don't were just for a passing season I guess! Or sometimes they come back way later.
 
Don't worry. You are loved.
 
Good luck with your business- you can do it!

***

For some feminist comedic relief I just got this in my inbox:

The World's Shortest Fairy Tale...
 
Once upon a time, a guy asked a girl "Will you marry me?" The girl said,
"NO!" And the girl lived happily ever after and went shopping, dancing,
camping, drank martinis, always had a clean house, never had to cook, did
whatever the hell she wanted, never argued, didn't get fat, travelled more,
had many fantastic lovers and only cooked the things she liked to eat, and
always had money. She went to the theatre, never watched sports, never wore
fricken lacy lingerie that went up her ass, had high self esteem, never
cried or yelled, felt and looked fabulous in sweat pants, and burped, swore,
and farted all the time.
 
THE END

Hopalong

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #27 on: April 04, 2007, 08:59:06 PM »
Thankyou thank you, Write.
Very encouraging and reality-based, balanced wisdom.

I do appreciate you!

I love your attitude about independence too.
Bravo.

Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

axa

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Re: constructive loneliness
« Reply #28 on: April 05, 2007, 10:30:21 AM »
Write,

LOVED YOUR STORY........trying to live it myself, oops excuse me (guess what that was!)

About money.  I have worked hard all my life and own my own house.  I choose to work on contracts so I do  not have a regular income.  Somehow I prefer it this way.  XN was very wealthy but interestingly enough when we were together I gave up contracts to be with him so that HE could make more more.  He got richer I got poorer........ in monetary terms that is.  For some strange reason I never worry about money.  I have had hard times financially but have managed and have faith in my resourcefulness.  Xn used to tell me have faith in him regarding money...........well that was a dumb move on my part.  Gone are the holidays........ well I can pay for myself.  Gone is the big fancy house, which I never liked.  Gone is his money, which he was generous with as long as it was what he wanted and  i got a stressfree life.

XN's xwife is back with him, playing happy families and being a source of supply.  She told me once that her psychiatrist told her that she was married to a man who could not bear to see her happy.......... and she went back.  She has choosen not to make a life for herself or work.  She was waiting in the wings for the cracks to appear in our relationship and as soon as they started to show she was back in there like a shot.  I am very grateful to her because I see her as my insurance policy.  As long as she is supply he will leave me alone.  She has had psychotic episodes and seemed to me very "strange" to say the least.  I think living with xn for such a long time must have contributed to her mental health problems.  He has not changed and she is back for more.  How sad is that but long may it last.

About muddling along on my own I sometimes get a longing for a partner and then I check the reality and that longing disappears very very quickly.  Yesterday I realised that the past year of my life has been like a bad episode of the Jerry Springer show.  I have thought about writing about it but the more I ponder the experience the more nuts it seems.  Nothing like a bit of distance to give one perspective.

axa