Names

[October]

Does anyone else feel as if they don't have a name??  My name is Catherine, and my family always use it in full, if at all, but I rarely hear it.  My friends call me Cathy, mainly because my Nmum and echo dad always objected to shortened names when we were small, so now I can choose for myself I choose a shortened name for my friends to use.

But my t asked me yesterday which I preferred, and I said I don't mind.  I said neither of them is really me, because I don't have a name.

Does anyone else have this same feeling??

I know my mum says that when my older brother was small she used to call him 'boy', and she laughed at me when I was a baby and started to say the same thing.  She never says what she called me, and I suspect I had no name for a long time.  (She always laughs at babies for doing what is perfectly normal for babies to do, in terms of playing and talking.)

When I remember hearing my name as a child, it was always when I was being told off for something, and with a nasty tone of voice.  It was a warning, or threat.

I know she didn't want me when I was born, but I don't know much more than that about the early years.  She never mentions them.  Even with my daughter, she never says, you are just like your mother at that age (although she is very like me).  And there are no pictures of me as a baby.  Lots of my brothers, but none of me before I was a toddler.

C

[flower]

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Thanks so much for your insight and support.
 It aided my healing. Too much of my heart
was in this post to let it remain here for posterity.
The post served its purpose and now it is time to
edit it or gently take it down.
 
To every thing there is a season, and a time
to every purpose under the heaven:  Ecclesiates 3:1

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[Portia]

Similar feelings here..I have a middle name which my mother tells me was what a previous girlfriend of my father's was called...so that negates that name pretty well and makes it bad. The only time my full first name was used was in anger. And I was mostly called by stupid pet names (quite debasing ones too). Think I'll adopt Portia!

I like this song 'Give me back my name' by Talking Heads:

There's a word for it
And words don't mean a thing
There's name for it
And names make all the difference in the world
Some things can never be spoken
Some things cannot be pronounced
That word does not exist in any language
It will never be uttered by a human mouth

Let X make a statement
Let breath pass through those cracked lips
That man was my hero
And now that word has been taken from us
Some things can never be spoken
Some things cannot be pronounced
That word does not exist in any language
It will never be uttered by a human mouth

Give me back my name
Give me back my name
Something has been changed in my life
Something has been changed in my life
Something must be returned to us
Something must be returned to us

         YEAH! And we have to take it! Best, P

[shixie]

Did anyone ever read the books by Dave Pelzer? A Child Called It, The Lost Boy, and A Man Named Dave.  He was the worst documented child abuse case in the state of California.  His N abusive mother tried several times to kill him.  He slept on a cot in the garage ate garbage and wore dirty clothes.  Heart wrenching story of survival and living.  An amazing man.

[Anonymous]

cathy

i know exactly what you mean about your name.  i've often thought about changing mine too.

my name is a made up name - a combination of my N mother's name and my absent father's name.  i've been asked to explain the origin of my name countless times because it's unusual and people are curious.  it has always made me uncomfortable because every time someone asks me the story of my name, i have had to explain it, even though i was not comfortable speaking about my father who had left us and i barely knew.  i also look unusual due to mixed ethnicity, so i think people were also trying to figure out how to place me in that way too.  i've always found it intrusive, although not anyone's fault because how could they know it was so loaded to me?  

i've often wished for a name that was not so loaded with uncomfortable family attachments.  i suppose i *could* change it, but i have no idea what my name should be..

claris (not my real name!)

[October]

It looks like this is fairly common, then.  In some cultures people are given a secret name, that only they and the giver - a kind of sponsor or godparent figure - ever know.  I think maybe we need something like that.  Something that belongs only to us.

((((((((hugs to all)))))))))

C

[yuki]

My family had a weird thing about my name too. For most of my life my dad wouldn't say my name. He called me by my initials. It was NOT a cute, affectionate nick name, it was a way of keeping an emotional distance from me - I sensed that even when I was very young. I hated it - it felt like having a serial number instead of a name. The other one I got was "kiddo" which I also hated. It felt condescending and generic. I've always felt disconnected from my last name - it feels like something that belongs to them and not me.

[Karin guest]

I'm just sitting here remembering a few things about names in my family.

*My father and his five siblings (all from the same mother and father) all had different surnames because they all had differing opinions to what their surname should have been because one of their forebears was (gasp!) illegitimate.

*My brother has a hyphenated surname (like my parents) but when I was born Mum put a stop to all that nonsense. So I was different from them with just the one.

*When I met my future husband he decided to call me by my middle name because he liked it better. (Big clue to his future Narcissism??) I didn't respond to it at all so I told him that he better call me by my real name which is Karin.

I've always been comfortable with Karin, though I pronounce it the English way, and not the German way which my parents intended and called me by.
So, I made it my own.

[Anonymous]

Interesting thread.....

I had noticed that my exNH tended not to use peoples names.  Especially those that he was "close to."  I  wondered about that tendency and what it was all about before I found out about Narcissism.

He would call us by our title or category.  For example, I was called "Wifey."  And he would often call his daughters, "Daughter" or more specifically, "Youngest Daughter."  When talking about me to his daughters he would almost invariably refer to me as "your wicked Step-Mother."  

He even called the dog, "Dog!" as in "Come here, Dog."   Not officially though, the dog did have a name, but come to think of it, the dog had the name already when he got him.

He would also assign nicknames to people rather than call them by their given names.  The nicknames were usually a "dig" of some sort, not a nickname that one would choose for oneself.

The real kicker was a young, male friend of ours that he admired tremendously for his intelligence.  He was called "Junior!"  How N is that ??!!!

When I became aware of his N-ness, I saw this as a symptom. There is the emotional distancing part of it, yes. Since we are not really human to them, it just wouldn't DO to give us names.

But, the way that my exNH did it, I also see it as a boundary issue.  We were all assigned "names" that described US in relation to HIM, as extensions of him.  By calling us that, he could "own" us and we were not considered separate from him.  Scary stuff......

Now I really pay attention and try to make sure to call everyone, especially the ones that he dehumanized by their given names.

Incidentally, two of his three daughters have ceased all contact with him.  The third comes and goes, more often gone.  One of them is planning on changing her name to her mother's maiden name as she doesn't want to be identified with him at all anymore.

Gingerpeach

[October]

He even called the dog, "Dog!" as in "Come here, Dog."   Not officially though, the dog did have a name, but come to think of it, the dog had the name already when he got him.


When I became aware of his N-ness, I saw this as a symptom. There is the emotional distancing part of it, yes. Since we are not really human to them, it just wouldn't DO to give us names.

But, the way that my exNH did it, I also see it as a boundary issue.  We were all assigned "names" that described US in relation to HIM, as extensions of him.  By calling us that, he could "own" us and we were not considered separate from him.  Scary stuff......

Now I really pay attention and try to make sure to call everyone, especially the ones that he dehumanized by their given names.

Gingerpeach

That is sooo interesting, Gingerpeach.  We had a dog too, called Ben, and my mum called him 'dog', and she does that with the dog from next door now, and she and dad both say 'he', although the dog is a bitch, and is called Georgie.  They seem not to care that there is a name, or even about the sex of the animal.  My mum treats Georgie really weirdly, imo.  She always gives her biscuits, and then is surprised that the dog comes back over and over.  She says giving her biscuits is the only way to get her to go home.  I think in her fantasy world she is St Francis over again.    

And when my parents went out for the day with my daughter and her friend, they didn't bother learning the friend's name; they just called her nothing at all, and now just refer to her as 'C's friend', if at all.  It is as if differentiating people is just too difficult for them.

I think your point about labels rather than names is very perceptive.  I shall look out for that now.  And strange how when I first became unwell, my identity was only 'C's mum'.  I had nothing else, especially not a name.

My brother calls his three boys by their names most of the time, but he also refers to them as number one son, number two son and number three son.  When the third one was born I remember my dad putting this in a card, with pictures of them, and saying number three son and counting, so that clearly resonates with him.

Cathy

[gardener]

Just a thought, I found this little quote on a page of childrens writings and thought you'd all like it.
  "When someone loves you, the way they say your name is different. You know that your name is safe in their mouth." Billy - age 4

[Ellie]

Same in my family.

The girls were 'Sis' to my father. He only used our real names when he was angry, then it was first and middle - we KNEW he was mad.

When he spoke to us about our mother, it was 'your mommy'. He only used her name when angry, then it was first and middle and he was yelling it.

And now at 44 years of age - if we were speaking, he would still refer to her as my mommy. They got very upset when I started calling them "mom" and "dad" in my teen years. They kept saying they were my mommy and daddy. A light should have gone off long ago!

BF or H was 'boy' to his face as in "listen here boy", or "well boy, you shoud know"

[Anonymous]

This strikes a chord with me as well!  Thanks for bringing it up!

My H is referred to as "son" by his father. His N father also called his wife "wif"  His N father had lots of "playful" names for people, as does my husband.

My H has nick names for people to.  H sometimes calls me "wify"
He referrs to co workers as: "Sniper Matt"  "Tiny head"  "Psycho Matt"
My H has a voice for me called "Jenny voice"  It is a meek child's voice with a lisp.  He has a voice for his mom and for other female coworkers and friends.  He uses them in jest, but I don't think it is very respectful.

My name is Jennifer Susan.  Susan is my mother's first name (that might point to an N tendency!) and incidentally the first name of my Mother in law as well.  I may never go by Susan, or my husband will flip out! (His mother's middle innitial is J.  She was SJK and I am JSK) I don't want that name anyway because it doesn't belong to me.  It belongs to my mother.  
My parents call me Jennifer. I never felt they knew me.  And it is associated with anger.  So, I have my friends call me Jenny. There are so many Jennys my age, I feel like a clone.  Not to mention, "Jenny" is not taken seriously.  It sounds like a sex toy or a child's name.  I have enough trouble getting anyone to take me seriously or treat me like an adult.  I am 22 and I look like I am 12.  I don't feel like Jennifer, or Jenny.  When people ask what they should call me, I say "whatever"
My screen name is mixed up letters from all of my names, mine, my mom's, my father's, my husband's... None feel like mine.  But I am trying to make them mine.  I could have created something that sounded more like me!

When I married, I had trouble deciding whether to keep my father's name, take my husband's name or hyphenate.  My husband wanted me to take his.  In the end, I did, because they both came from a man, so I didn't feel it mattered.

I have started to practice saying my name... "Jennifer Susan, grand-daughter of Catherine" (a woman I love and admire, and wouldn't mind taking after).

Peace, sjkravill

[October]

This strikes a chord with me as well!  Thanks for bringing it up!

My H is referred to as "son" by his father. His N father also called his wife "wif"  His N father had lots of "playful" names for people, as does my husband.

I have started to practice saying my name... "Jennifer Susan, grand-daughter of Catherine" (a woman I love and admire, and wouldn't mind taking after).

Peace, sjkravill

Sounds like you are in a similar position to me.  I stick with Cathy, but it is a bit twee, and not really 'me'.  Strangely, I once heard a good friend use my full name with a gentle tone of voice, and it really scared me.  I didn't know what to do, and I wanted to cry.  In fact I think I did cry.  It sounded so strange.  Perhaps that is what my name should be; a different tone of voice.

You could always try Jenn.  That is a bit more grown up.  Some neighbours call me Cath, and it is kind of ok.  I usually don't mind any version, except I hate the name Kate.  My mum tried it out for a while when I was smaller and I refused to answer to it.

C

[Karin]

"I have enough trouble getting anyone to take me seriously or treat me like an adult.  I am 22 and I look like I am 12."  

I obviously don't know what you look like sjkravill, but I thought of you as much older because you always write with so much maturity and sensitivity; I was gob-smacked to read that you're only 22!

What really matters IS what's in your head and heart and if people don't take you seriously because of what you look like then they're not worth knowing anyway. Their loss.
(My 25 year old daughter has the very same problem!).

Karin.