Learning

[seasons]

and thinking about forgiving our Foo's in our life.

Is this an important step in recovery? And what does it actually mean.
 I'm sure this is very different for everyone and I'm sorry if it is painful to even think of.

With thoughtfulness, seasons

[Ami]

Dear Seasons,
 It is really funny that you ask this question ,now, b/c I feel like I have s/thing helpful to add based on  experience.I have recently forgiven my M, I think.
What happened was that it was NOT a struggle , as I thought it would be and as it always was. What happened was that I saw that *I* could not help my own 'thinking. I saw that  I was "drowning" and I could not get out. By drowning,I mean that I could not get up from under 'crazy' thinking(perfectionism, anxiety, depression, distortions, fear(terrible) etc.
 I saw that I simply could not help it. I had tried everything and nothing helped( before the board and trying to be fearlessly honest)
So, I had compassion for her brokenness. THEN,it was NO struggle. My heart broke for her .
I saw that she did not try to hurt me on purpose. She was drowning and s/times she had to push me under the water to get a breath.
 She had so much shame that she needed me to look good to take some of it away.
 The main point that I want to leave you with, Seasons, is that at some point in YOUR own healing,forgiveness of her will just come(IMO),almost effortlessly. IF you have to struggle with it, just keep facing yourself and your own pain. In time, I bet that you will experience what I did.  Love to you,     Ami

((((((((((Seasons)))))))))))

[SilverLining]

 The main point that I want to leave you with, Seasons, is that at some point in YOUR own healing,forgiveness of her will just come(IMO),almost effortlessly. IF you have to struggle with it, just keep facing yourself and your own pain. In time, I bet that you will experience what I did.  Love to you,     Ami

I think it's an important point.  If you have to force forgiveness, it doesn't work.  And it's easy to believe it's something we should do instantly, just to satisfy the requirements of someone else's program.  I knew at an intellectual level 20 years ago I SHOULD forgive the FOO.  But it seems only recently I started to feel I might be able to really do it on a consistent basis and not get knocked back into anger by every little event.  The parents had their own batch of "stuff" to deal with and there is no way I can ever know the truth about what they experienced.  So at this point I am trying to let go of the "analysis paralysis" I have been in for several years and just deal with the present.   And if I get set back a few more times so be it, I will just keep working to stay with the moment and deal with things as they are happening now. 

I have to remind myself of this as I roll into the annual test next week.....

 

[Leah]

Dear Seasons,

As a believer, I forgave. 

As a healed (believer) person, I forgave again. 

The difference was, the real "forgiveness" and subsequent "letting go" came for me personally, after my healing.

Also, I had to grieve, of what had been, and all that I had hoped to be, and, finally, I accepted, what could never be.



Dear Ami ,

Regarding what you have been discussing regarding the subject of; Self, Self Hate, Shame, and Forgiveness ........ this article extract the site below, has the full length article ... and mentions all your thread topics in the one article.

...... "As much as I can forgive myself, that much can I forgive others. What I really forgive in others is an old pain of mine, released from the disgust of self-hate and loved and welcomed like a bird with a broken wing. Shame and self-hate did not start with me, but with all my heart, I deign that they will stop with me. I will do unto myself as I would have others do unto me.

http://www.pete-walker.com/forgiveness.htm

It may, or may not, be of interest to you, in reference to your recent thread topics.


Love, Leah

[Bella_French]

My opinion about forgiveness is that it is important in the sense that radically adjusts one's mindset for the better. Forgiving is a form of taking total responsibility for one's decisions, getting in touch with one's personal power in the present, and escaping victim mentality. I'm struggling to describe it, but that the effect it has on me.

Forgiveness is not the same as trusting someone, and you can forgive even when someone hasn't asked for forgiveness. Its just a way of moving forward, i guess.

I forgive my FOO, and I understand the dynamics. I trust them only in the sense that I know how they will behave, even if I don't always like it. I do enjoy them, though, when i see them. They are my family and my feelings for all of them resonate very deeply. I've just adjusted my expectations, I guess. I look for my needs to be met elsewhere. I struggle to be the person I want to be. I have minimal contact when they act badly, and I do nothing out of obligation or due to pressure. It must work, a little, because I still have the capacity to love them this way.

X bella

[Ami]

Thank you ,Leah.                                                                   

[Leah]

Ami,

You're very welcome, quite a lot packed into such a brief article, which was most interesting, to me, also.

Leah

[seasons]

Thank you for putting it in such clear context for me, very helpful.

(Leah)
(Ami)
(tjr)
(Bella)

My opinion about forgiveness is that it is important in the sense that radically adjusts one's mindset for the better. Forgiving is a form of taking total responsibility for one's decisions, getting in touch with one's personal power in the present, and escaping victim mentality. I'm struggling to describe it, but that the effect it has on me.

Forgiveness is not the same as trusting someone, and you can forgive even when someone hasn't asked for forgiveness. Its just a way of moving forward, i guess.

I am filled with much more peace than I have in years. I think after learning and processing NPD it has help me realize life with them is what it is. My heart has let many ugly thoughts go. Healing myself also while I guess I was in the progress of forgiving what can never be.

Thank you again for your help seeing through the fog. ((seasons))

[Hopalong]

Hi Seasons,
For me, forgiveness of my Nmother and Nbrother has come in waves. I forgave them right away because of my value system. They hurt me again (and again). I forgave again. They also did nice things for me. I appreciated them. Boundaries up, boundaries down. Finally, it became boundaries up always, but love them anyway.

The thing that startled me was realizing that forgiving myself needed to come first, before my forgiveness of them could be complete. That's usually steady, but a work in progress. I can still be triggered into shame, particularly when I'm tired, stressed, or worried. Then I get vulnerable to bad judgement and bad feelings.

Forgiveness feels successful to me when it's no longer a repeated act of will, but the background for how I see the world. Disappointments and hurts still happen, but they affect me at a more surface level--or even if they cut deep, the healing time isn't as long or repetitive as it used to be. Once I work through the present feelings about present events, the status quo is forgiveness. In a way, I feel: who am I to think too long about granting forgiveness? It's a given, so I will just get out of its way.

I agree with everyone who's mentioned forgiveness being perfectly compatible with lack of trust or even NC. It's an inner decision for inner health. It doesn't change anyone but me.

xo
Hops