Open Letter to Dr. Grossman

[Betelgeuse]

On my 'Smoke and Mirrors'-thread (a sockpuppetry warning), you said my 'speculations are certainly false'. That effectively ended the discussion. It looks like I've made a terrible mistake, after all: you dispose of moderating tools that deliver facts whereas I have no more to go on than common sense and some linguistic skills.

I'm glad I had some time today to think this through, because I was amazed and shocked by your response and by the fact I could be so far wrong.

So I reexamined my thought processes, possible triggers, the material that led me to my conclusions, also the various responses made to my thread, and you know what? My mind won't budge... I just can't figure out where I went off-track, I still believe my analysis to be correct. And:

I believe you're being had.

I have no idea how it's done and I'm the first one to realise how absolutely preposterous this sounds, but I really cannot come to any other conclusion. I know this means I will have to leave the board.

I can also look at this situation in another way: if you're right and I'm wrong (and I do realise that's a distinct possibility), then my single most effective and dependable survival tool, that has helped me navigate difficult life circumstances with reasonable success, my head, does not function properly in the setting of this board. Therefore I should go.

Richard, I hope this message doesn't come across as agressive or disrespectful because that is certainly not my intention. I've found your work interesting and valuable. I'm actually working with one of the resources you made available, Three Good Things in Life. Tonight I hope to be able to write that I left the board with dignity.

I wish you well, as I do all the members here and I thank you for all the insights I've received.

Is it OK if I cancel my membership tomorrow morning (I live in Europe)?

Thank you

Bee

[mudpuppy]

if you're right and I'm wrong (and I do realise that's a distinct possibility), then my single most effective and dependable survival tool, that has helped me navigate difficult life circumstances with reasonable success, my head, does not function properly in the setting of this board. Therefore I should go.

You mean you can only stay in a place where your perceptions are always perfect and utterly trustworthy and you're never wrong?
Can't speak for others but I've never been in such a place and never will. And if one ever were in such a place how would you ever learn anything?
Being wrong occasionally (or in some cases nearly always  ) never stopped anyone else from hanging around here, why should it stop you?

mud

[Betelgeuse]

Hi Em,

I didn't ask permission to leave, but to stay on a few more hours - after having stated to Dr. Grossman that I feared he was being bamboozled, I fully expected to be thrown out instantly.

Thank you for your wishes of peace, I can do with them. In the interest of peace, I won't go over my motivations again, they're all in my posts for you to read.

I'm sorry I reminded you of your mother. Mine wasn't steely or self-righteous, quite the opposite: she'd fly off in inarticulate ages. I held myself together by clear thinking. We all have our defenses, such as they are.

And we all yearn for safe places. If I make you feel unsafe, don't worry - I'm nearly off.

Bee

[teartracks]

Hi Beatle Juice (that's the way I pronounce your name, not knowing exactly how to pronounce it),

I don't think Dr. G will end your membership for saying the things you have here.   

Anyway, whether you stay or go, I wish you the best.

tt

[Hopalong]

I ditto Mud, Bee--
maybe just you could avoid accusing people of double identities in future?
(You weren't the first, you're not scandalously wrong, I think...just turns out you were wrong.
That can be a great place for some growth to begin.)

Suely there is much else you could offer and receive here?

Hops

[Juno]

The Smoke and Mirrors thread was stunning to me, but for very different reasons from most of the people who posted on it.  While I knew that the people named as being one and the same were not one and the same, I also didn't think Betelgeuse was doing anything on purpose or maliciously. 

I had much trouble with the very, very strong emotions and then the "quick" turn around time between people hurting each other, being hurt, and then hugging and apologizing.  Even allowing for the fact that I was reading it in a few minutes and knowing the thread evolved over days--I tend to need weeks to process all that and move towards resolution.  If I move towards resolution at all.  With some people, I just can't do it.

And with the logic part of it having failed you, Bee.  I used logic all my formative years.  It is my default approach to life.  My father was probably Asperger's and he is the parent I bonded with.  While I think I probably have very good intuition by nature, I was raised in a scientific "logical cloud" and kind of took that on, I guess. 

My "logical cloud" has failed me miserably in that, when info was missing, I supplied what was most "logical" in my very youthful and inexperienced mind.  And it turns out some of my conclusions were either wrong, or not deep enough, or led me astray because I remained locked into them.  Logic can only go so far all by itself.  But I have found that out the very hardest way.  It is very hard to unlearn and then re-learn at this stage of the game.  But that is all we have at this point.

I think you should stay and lurk awhile until you find a way back in.  I don't mean a way back onto the board.  As you can see, people stay here after all kinds of tussles.  I mean a way back in through your own heart.

You were not malicious, IMO. You can forgive yourself for being mistaken about particular people being posers.

What really happened was you got a "fall flat on your face" moment.  It was a turning point for you.  You can just pick yourself up and brush yourself off and see what comes along next.

[Certain Hope]

Dear Bee,

I share Juno's perspective, as she expressed it so well here.

You spoke up because you didn't want to go silent...
and now you're going silent? It's sad, to me...  because
I don't think this is about the board at all, you know?
Anywhere we look, there's offense hovering throughout the very atmosphere, it seems... but it is always the personal choice of each individual whether or not to take it up. All I know is the feeling that your heart is very spacious...

and you don't have to be perfect. That's all.

Sincerely,
Carolyn

[teartracks]

Hi,

I wonder what it says about us when we allow a perspective or two to put us down as thoroughly as if we had been zapped with a stun gun?  I don't mean this as a criticism of anyone, especially Beatle Juice.  It's more of an observation of how fragile many of us are here and how often our fright or flight instinct kicks in or our need to people please at any cost takes over, or we tread water in the groupthink tank, or we exercise good old common sense and bow out or in. 

Carolyn, I agree with your sentiment.  At every turn lately, there seems to be razor wire.  Not just here on the board, but everywhere.   

tt

[Juno]

Yes, tt, I see the fragility and the proneness to fight or flight.  I feel it in myself all the time.  It is always close to the surface.  And I think you are right--it is not just here.  Our society is fragile now too.  I think the past is coming home to roost.  Added on top of terrible events that have occurred and are occurring in our world and it is a recipe for triggering and fight or flight in our schools, our jobs, and other meeting places.

I don't see myself changing my basic approach which is to stay out of the way when possible.  The times when I have "engaged" I have succeeded only in feeling like a complete, shameful fool.  And been very disappointed also in the failure of others to take up for me.

I think my way is slow and difficult.  But I suspect that it is hard-wired to some extent.

I think there is room on this board for anyone who is at least open to the possibility of learning and growing.  I would like to think there is room for the quieter people too and the ultra-sensitive among us.  However, it is probably up the to quieter ones and the ultra-sensitive ones (I guess I count myself in that "group") to stand up and be counted without expecting any knights to come rescue us.  We have to be our own heroes.

[Overcomer]

Beetle Juice is logging on as a guest.  I thought that was not to be anymore.  I thought you had to be registered to post.  I do not see a Beutelgeuse on the members list.

[Dr. Richard Grossman]

Hi Betelgeuse,

I'm sorry you have left.  Obviously, we have differing views, and unfortunately I cannot share all of the data which supports my position.  I wish you my best, and of course, you are welcome to return if you so choose.  I do understand that a board with many "sock puppets" is of little use to you or anyone, and I will continue to do my best to keep people from posting under multiple screen names.

Best,

Richard

p.s.  Overcomer:  when Betelgeuse deleted his/her membership this afternoon, all of his/her previous posts automatically changed to the "guest" designation.  Betelgeuse has not posted since that time; "guests" are not permitted to post.

[Overcomer]

Thank you for clearing that up.

[Hopalong]

Juno,

I just want to say that I think you've written two brilliant, sensitive and very perceptive posts.

You have been such a keen observer of people and the world that you must have developed some really far-reaching perceptiveness.

I think you've been thinking about other people for a long time, writ small and larger (society). Your observations are astute and deep and challenging and I am grateful to have read them.

love,
Hops

[gratitude28]

I'd like to hop on Hops's train and say I agree, PP. (Juno). Your words are always so meaningfula nd helpful to me. And I feel you are fair in any situation.
Love, Beth

[Juno]

Well, thank you Hops and Beth!

Still learning......