Diagnosis -- not crazy!

[Gabben]

I'm sitting her at my desk and I just looked down at my therapist bill she has coded me at DX 300.00.

What a relief that was exactly what my Psychiatrist coded my diagnosis and that was over ten years ago.

So it is safe to say that I do not suffer from a personality disorder, well, I knew that.

The reason this brings a moment of relief, even though I already knew it, was that I have a huge fear of being crazy.

Does anyone else have this fear?

It is as if my worst nightmare of being called or labled or thought of as crazy or personality disordered has been finally evaporated. This has nothing to do so much with the DX code as it has to do with getting on a deep level that I am OK -- that I am not losing my mind.

If someone does suffer from a PD or does have emotional problems, is there anything wrong with that? Perhaps they were deeply hurt has children. Lord knows none of us are perfect. Would they feel safe coming to a web site that bashes PD's?  (with the exception of P's and N's because they do not know they are P and N.)

[Ami]

Dear Lise
 IMO, any emotional problem or PD is just defense mechanisms. If we can get rid of the defense mechanisms , we will be well..If we can go in and re --feel the original emotions , then we get unblock them from the brain,and there will not be the need for defense mechanisms(ie emotional illness). That is what I believe and have experienced, recently.
 I HATE labeling b/c my M is a therapist, as you know.
 I think labeling is so hurtful and detrimental.     Love  Ami

[Gabben]

Dear Lise
 IMO, any emotional problem or PD is just defense mechanisms. If we can get rid of the defense mechanisms , we will be well..If we can go in and re --feel the original emotions , then we get unblock them from the brain,and there will not be the need for defense mechanisms(ie emotional illness). That is what I believe and have experienced, recently.
 I HATE labeling b/c my M is a therapist, as you know.
 I think labeling is so hurtful and detrimental.     Love  Ami

Agreed,

Ami what you are doing is the original pain or original grief work. This is work I have been doing for over 20 years. The way out is through.

There comes a time when doing this work that it will become easier for you meaning that you will not even have to think about the pain.

There is a great deal of strength from prayer which enables me to work full-time, do service, maintain hobbies and live in balance despite the hurt and pain I carry in my heart. Sometime the tears roll, usually first thing in the morning when I am the most raw. Over the years I have learned to take out 15 minutes in the morning to re-feel and stay with the pain, but then, most of the time, it is time to get up and get on with my day.

For me I still carry a deep fear about what others think. Getting to the root of this fear is what my pain is all about and this thread, re-feeling the old hurts from my  narcissistic wounds where I was not seen or loved enough.

As I cry out the stabbing pain in my heart over the betrayal of my parents I can actually feel my anger and shame diminishing along with the critical voice of my super-ego quiets---------That's peace!

[Ami]

I am very happy you are finding peace ,(((((((((Lise)))))))))))               Ami

[darren]

I'm sitting her at my desk and I just looked down at my therapist bill she has coded me at DX 300.00.

What a relief that was exactly what my Psychiatrist coded my diagnosis and that was over ten years ago.

So it is safe to say that I do not suffer from a personality disorder, well, I knew that.

The reason this brings a moment of relief, even though I already knew it, was that I have a huge fear of being crazy.

Does anyone else have this fear?

It is as if my worst nightmare of being called or labled or thought of as crazy or personality disordered has been finally evaporated. This has nothing to do so much with the DX code as it has to do with getting on a deep level that I am OK -- that I am not losing my mind.

If someone does suffer from a PD or does have emotional problems, is there anything wrong with that? Perhaps they were deeply hurt has children. Lord knows none of us are perfect. Would they feel safe coming to a web site that bashes PD's?  (with the exception of P's and N's because they do not know they are P and N.)

I had that fear... I thought I might have been a self aware NPD who got shocked into it by a traumatic relationship with a borderline.  The doc said I didn't have NPD, but it turns out I may have had my own personality disorder after all.  I take comfort in knowing that I rarely hear people complaining about the Schizoid PD.  They keep to themselves and don't bother people.

I totally get why people bash PD's.  I went through it too, and I've gotten very angry at times.  Now I tend to blame the disorder and not my actual ex.  She didn't really choose to be the way she was, her disorder drives her.  It doesn't bother me that people bash PD's... well.. sometimes... but not the places like here were there seems to be a focus on getting better and healing.  

People here have been very nice to me, but I still have fears.  I wanted to start a new topic today about false selves and true selves... I've been wondering if I have one.  I think I chickened out though.  THe more I talk to people the more we both find we have things in common... like bad childhoods and PTSD symptoms and such.  

There are a few places full of very angry people who treat me as though I had NPD.  I see people make blanket statements about bashing personality disorders when there are a few personality disorders that aren't quite so destructive.  There's that cluster of PD's that is odd and eccentric, and not crazymaking and conflict creating (schizoids and avoidants.)  

I think a lot of people come out of abusive childhoods and relationships thinking they have PD's, but real PD's don't wear off.  I think thats common.  I think sometimes though it turns out to be true :/

Oh, and my ex was probably BPD.  She did have a bad childhood.  She does bad things, but she can't control it.  She thinks the world is doing the same thing to her.  She didn't choose to be who she was, and I don't see it as a choice for her.  I tend not to look down on N's and P's and such and blame the disorder instead, not that I didn't hurt badly at the hands of one.  

I'm sure I've mentioned it several times, and everybody is still nice to me.  

[Ami]

I would like you to start a thread on false self/real self,Darren.  It sounds really interesting.   Hugs,     Ami                         

[Gabben]

I'm sure I've mentioned it several times, and everybody is still nice to me.  

Thanks Darren,

I'm glad that people are nice to you here and no one is being harsh. It is OK to express our true selves not everyone is always going to respond to us the way we like them to but that in itself can be a valuable lesson for us. We can learn to shake off the negative and draw from the positive here,or at least practice.

I think that what I was referring to when I say bashing is labelling...We need to talk openly about pain and struggles that come with dealing or coping with a loved one or enemy in our lives that suffers from some form of PD. It is the behavior that is to always to be discussed, not so much the person.

But people do use labels to put others down from time to time; the label of crazy is the worst, the most painful. If you know what I mean?

When someone is labled crazy by someone else do we not automatically just write them off? Do we not just dismiss them in our mind as having nothing to offer us. It is as if the person suddenly becomes nonexistent, they must feel so hurt and objectified.

It would make sense if the person was labled P because then perhaps people could be warned and they would have a heads up. But in our society even labeling someone P is considered slander or libel. Unless I am a doctor or someone with right to make that diagnosis I cannot attach label to someone. But I can assess their behavior has narcissist and or antisocial, correct? I think that is along the lines of what you were trying to express, right?

Lise

[Izzy_*now*]

About being crazy......................

I never thought I was, but...

I had a terrible feeling that if I cried too much I would never stop and go over the edge!
I had a terrible feeling that if I exhibited too much anger, I would never stop and go over the edge!

Without mentioning anymore, it was a feeling that if I exposed my feelings, I wouldn't be able to stop!

............so I buried them all!

Now I know assertiveness, not aggressiveness...and I know I am not crazy!

Izzy

[Gabben]

Hi Izzy,

No you most certainly are not crazy -- hugs to you.

I've decided that when I see you name on the end of a thread I am going to respond no matter what. The thread can end with my name, not yours

Peace,
Lise

[Certain Hope]

Lise,

I see you stepping forward and living your life despite your fear... making you an embodiment of courage, in my book.

In fact.... apart from faith, I almost think that a real symptom of craziness might be the absence of anxiety! I mean - whether a person uses addictions to mask it or denial to hide it, the anxious feelings are there... not far from the surface (except in a sociopath, I guess).

2 Timothy 1:7 is what first popped to mind tonight when I read this, and so I looked up the word used in the original Greek, which is often translated discipline, self-control, or - as in the KJV - "sound mind".  It's "sophronismos" - defined as:  an admonishing or calling to soundness of mind, to moderation and self-control ....
self-control, moderation.

That's the Spirit in you, dear Lise... and I see you walking in Him.

Love,
Carolyn

[darren]

Thanks Darren,

I'm glad that people are nice to you here and no one is being harsh. It is OK to express our true selves not everyone is always going to respond to us the way we like them to but that in itself can be a valuable lesson for us. We can learn to shake off the negative and draw from the positive here,or at least practice.

I think that what I was referring to when I say bashing is labelling...We need to talk openly about pain and struggles that come with dealing or coping with a loved one or enemy in our lives that suffers from some form of PD. It is the behavior that is to always to be discussed, not so much the person.

But people do use labels to put others down from time to time; the label of crazy is the worst, the most painful. If you know what I mean?

When someone is labled crazy by someone else do we not automatically just write them off? Do we not just dismiss them in our mind as having nothing to offer us. It is as if the person suddenly becomes nonexistent, they must feel so hurt and objectified.

It would make sense if the person was labled P because then perhaps people could be warned and they would have a heads up. But in our society even labeling someone P is considered slander or libel. Unless I am a doctor or someone with right to make that diagnosis I cannot attach label to someone. But I can assess their behavior has narcissist and or antisocial, correct? I think that is along the lines of what you were trying to express, right?

Lise

Yah, I know what you mean.  Sometimes I tell people I'm crazy but it really hurts when somebody comes to that conclusion on their own and tells you you are.  I've had that happen to me before, but I wasn't really acting all that crazy.  I tell most people I'm a bit on the crazy side and they don't write me off.  Some are even sympathetic to my plight.  I guess its those people who do hurtful things that get written off and get no contact. 

I sometimes just ramble on randomly, so I don't know that I actually had a point to express =)  I think it was that its common for people to think they might be crazy or have a disorder themselves when being in a relationship with somebody that does.  I think its like a "medical student syndrome."  We are going to recognize traits of all disorders in ourselves, we just do them at healthy levels.  That and that I have a PD and it doesn't bother me to hear people talk about their experiences here in the ways that they do it. 

[sKePTiKal]

OY! Lise, dear... your fear of being "crazy" is why I detest labels. A label de-humanizes you, contains you in a "final" state of being, with no hope of transformation, healing or change. No, you're not crazy at all...  People really DON'T "get it"... that we are just human beings trying to become whole, healthy, and our SELVES.

I carried that fear with me all these years, because of the months of dissociation I experienced. In fact, it was even reinforced FOR ME, that this meant there was something "wrong" with me. Turns out - it was a normal reaction to my situation & experience. Quite sane. Not easy to understand at 12 when the adults around me didn't understand and didn't know how to help....

Darren & all...

I believe that as humans we have the task of "working on ourselves"... of transforming and changing and growing. Doesn't matter where you are when you start - or what your life circumstances were, except as the starting point for beginning this life-long journey. We're all on the same path.... all at different places... all have the same potential for "becoming"... who we really are.

I'm glad Lise, that you've gotten this validation... it should help a lot.

[Ami]

Dear Lise,
 The other thing I hate about labels is that WE are not static, as human beings, but lables get put on us ,as if we are. We change all the time and a black and white label doesn't , as I see it.
 I think a label can be a prison sentence from which the person may never be released,in their own mind. That is just how *I* see it, as an individual, not a "professional"        Love   Ami

[Gabben]

Lise,

I see you stepping forward and living your life despite your fear... making you an embodiment of courage, in my book.

In fact.... apart from faith, I almost think that a real symptom of craziness might be the absence of anxiety! I mean - whether a person uses addictions to mask it or denial to hide it, the anxious feelings are there... not far from the surface (except in a sociopath, I guess).

2 Timothy 1:7 is what first popped to mind tonight when I read this, and so I looked up the word used in the original Greek, which is often translated discipline, self-control, or - as in the KJV - "sound mind".  It's "sophronismos" - defined as:  an admonishing or calling to soundness of mind, to moderation and self-control ....
self-control, moderation.

That's the Spirit in you, dear Lise... and I see you walking in Him.

Love,
Carolyn

Dear Carolyn,

You are such a strengthening Angel to me. Christ said that the true Christian would be hated and rejected by the world. He was right.

However, I still have so far to go in order to be able to call myself a true Christian. I need to work on being more gentle and that is an understatement!

However, It makes perfect sense to me that others would find me abrasive at times which is my thirst for righteousness.

This morning I was reflecting on how people shun. It occurred to me that when someone is around someone who is of high moral character we have to either reduce them in our minds as something far less, or we have to simply just cut them off from our reality in order to save ourselves from the painful awareness of our moral turpitude and the pain of our envy.


Deep down inside we just all want to be good but it takes real courage to be good, it takes real sacrifice to be good, it takes real perseverance and determination to be good, it is not easy but it can be done.

Here are some C.S. Lewis quotes that I really like:

"[The natural life] knows that if the spiritual life gets hold of it, all its self-centredness and self-will are going to be killed and it is ready to fight tooth and nail to avoid that."

--Mere Christianity

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"A young man who wishes to remain a sound Atheist cannot be too careful of his reading. There are traps everywhere--'Bibles laid open, millions of surprises,' as Herbert says, 'fine nets and stratagems.' God is, if I may say it, very unscrupulous."

--Surprised by Joy  C.S. Lewis



Thanks for always being there ((((((Carolyn))))))))

[Gabben]

OY! Lise, dear... your fear of being "crazy" is why I detest labels. A label de-humanizes you, contains you in a "final" state of being, with no hope of transformation, healing or change. No, you're not crazy at all...  People really DON'T "get it"... that we are just human beings trying to become whole, healthy, and our SELVES.

Thanks (((((Amber))))) I appreciate this !!!