What is the difference

[alone48]

I ready most of the post on being a victim and the mentality, but honestly I don't think I'm a victim I believe I had choices all the way, just made the wrong ones. Maybe I was blind to N's deception, but I still had a choice the whole way and chose the wrong one. Does that make me a victim? I never thought I was, just stupid.

[Gaining Strength]

If you didn't think you were then you probably weren't.

I saw something on TV tonight that made me realize that some people do choose to call themselves victims.  It was an alcoholic who blamed all of her problems on others but who refused to try to do anything to help herself.  There is a very subtle difference between people who have been victimized and people who love to be victims as a way out of taking care of themselves.  Very subtle.

[alone48]

Maybe that's what it is, but I think I just wanted N to love me so badly that I made the wrong choices. Was I manipulated, now I think that might be a different story. Did he take advantage of my feelings, by all means. I believe that I choose the wrong people and set myself up for failure in relationships. A victim, to me , is someone who is totally unsuspecting and not aware of the situation until it's too late. I could have left at any time, but just kept hoping he would love me too.......never was going to happen. He took advantage of my weakness, but I allowed it.

[Gaining Strength]

Oh, I was definitely suggesting that the description I gave had anything to do with you.  I was just putting some thoughts about being victimized on the board.  I guess I wasn't thinking clearly when I did that. 

I fully get your point - that you were not a victim and did not consider yourself one.

I didn't consider myself one but now realize that I was victimized by my parents and my brothers.  Now that I know that I can let go of holding onto the role of victim that I did not even realize I was holding onto. 

Sorry to stick my own two cents worth in on your thread.  I think I have gummed up what you are trying to express.  I didn't mean to change the focus.  My bad.

[alone48]

Not at all, you had very good points and made me think about it and try to sort it out. I believe as  a victim, I let myself off the hook. I would like to go that route sometimes, but it doesn't solve why I continue to do what I do. Maybe as you said, some people enjoy being the victim. If that's the case do I look for N's to create the situation? I think I need to consider this. Thanks.

[Juno]

Maybe it's not so much enjoying it as being used to it.  Then improving the situation becomes the challenge because it is THE UNKNOWN (which is scary and difficult).

[Ami]

Dear Alone
 When the thread title changed to your name I said,"Yikes". It is not easy to be singled out. I think we ALL have the issue of being victims. Not having your voice is essentially about being powerless i.e. a victim.
 I think that you are going from Point A to Point B, from a LV(little voice) to your own powerful voice, as we all are,on the board(IMO)
 I hope you keep writing as your journey proceeds. You have a beautiful voice and so much to share.    Love   Ami

((((((((Alone)))))))

[Certain Hope]

Alone,

What you've said about feeling like you just made some stupid choices...
well, that's how I've felt about it.
It wasn't till my ex-husband dragged me through court, trying to punish me for his own offenses, that I felt victimized.

Mostly, I've always felt that I was a victim of my own co-dependent drives, which made me a glowing target for NPD and other abusers.

It's not his fault that I was so desperate for love, to be needed, to merge with another human being...
and it's not my fault that I learned to be codependent...
and I don't feel a bit re-victimized by taking that attitude.

What I felt llike was a target, plain and simple.

Choosing to unlearn bad old habits and to stop seeking fulfilment from other people is the best way to erase that bulls-eye from my back, I believe.

I hope that you will forgive yourself for the choices you made. You are SO not alone in that...  so please don't victimize yourself, after all.

Love,
Carolyn

[Overcomer]

I have said this before and I will say it again.  Some people are victims and some people play the victim.  I had a boyfriend who played the victim.  When I first got together with him he was always lamenting about how his exwife did this or did that.  Then I realized over the years that it wasn't his wife at all.....it was him.  She made the right choice by divorcing him.  He was a raging alcoholic that would fly off the handle.  He would be blitzed out of his mind and end up in jail after trying to fight three policemen.  Then he would talk about how his work was not there for him during his divorce.........they let him have over two years of disability...........paid for nothing just because he was going through a divorce.  I would say, Bill, one out of two people go through a divorce............you are not alone..............

I find myself playing the victim, too.  Saying things like "it is all my mother's fault..........etc."  You know?  She was awful to me but if I continue to let her be awful and then blame her for my problems.......I am playing the victim.  Better to NOT let her close enough to be awful to me..

[Gaining Strength]

Some people are victims and some people play the victim.

Well said - It took me a paragraph or two to say what you said in one sentence.

[LilyCat]

Some people are victims and some people play the victim.

Yes, that is very well said, Overcomer.

Alone, you don't sound like a victim to me. I mean, I think N's make everyone their victim, but none of us has to stay that way. (Refer back to "play the victim.") You are really strong and incredibly honest to admit that you made bad choices. Who of us doesn't do that?

...for what it's worth, my therapist said that victims stay victims when they fail to speak up; that by not talking and wrapping their arms around themselves and silently walking away, they stay victimized. So in whatever way is appropriate, speak up! Or as I always like to say, Sing out, Louise! (From the musical "Gypsy".)

[Overcomer]

But for a long time I WAS a victim.  I had been brainwashed and so to openly defy my mother was something I couldn't do.  I still have a bit of this brainwashing.  Like I told the mother-in-law of my daughter, I have NEVER had a glass of wine in front of my parents.  She said, "What?  Kelly you are almost 50 years old and you will not drink in front of them?  Next time we go out you and I are ordering a glass of wine right in front of them!!"  But the disapproval I get from them is hard to take.  So I guess I am a victim of brainwashing.......guess that it is why it is hard to put children on the witness stand and have them finger the perpetrator......too scary.....

I have made great strides but I still blame my mom for so much...........and part of me says to myself, "Self?  Time to take back your power!!"

[alone48]

It's all very insightful and maybe at one point in the relationship I was a victim, I do know that I am a codependent and I believe he saw that early on and took advantage of it. Now, I need to change so that I am not so needy and it is not so obvious to the N's in the world, maybe then I can have my voice and not play victim.

[lighter]

alone....

now you need to figure out healthy boundaries....

and put them in place.....

never let them down....

never compromise them.

Not one little bit....

like a mama tiger....

defending her baby.

That's where you failed....

you weren't stupid.

Forgive yourself and research boundaries and asserting yourself.

Most of us made the very same mistakes you did.....

 though some will choose to identify themselves as victims.....

 and some will not.

Lighter