Boundaries - and Faith

[Hopalong]

Ohh Carolyn.

pure gratitude for not being squashed like a bug

Allow me to gush just enough to tell you that you are a beautiful dragonfly.

I have loved reading this thread. You walk it, talk it, think it.
I love your Christianity.

It ministers to me. (If it can be an it. I guess I mean YOU.)

I ain't saved.
But "safe" feels like saved to me, and I know you won't squash me like a bug and love you for it.

Hops

[Certain Hope]

((((Hops)))) thank you. 

You have treated me - and I have seen you treat others - with more respect and Christian love than the majority of the churchy women I've known all of my life.
As I recall, you were the first one willing to look within yourself and see what was happening between us... so long ago.
I'll never forget.

About being saved...
it's funny, it was never about hellfire, for me.
It's not that I didn't want to go to hell... because I really didn't want to go to heaven, either.
Just being me felt pretty hellish... always trying to be so good and so right...  always filled with such responsibility and fear.
It wasn't everlasting life that I was after...
it was a death of all that had made me so miserable, for as long as I could remember.

That soulish stuff dies slowly... but it's the life of the spirit which keeps whispering - I'm new, brand new!
I just have to remember to listen.

Love,
Carolyn

[Certain Hope]

These lyrics, from a song by Casting Crowns, have really touched my heart.

This was me...  both as a young woman... and then, again, in middle age.... twice, no less.

No one on earth really saw, except those who would take advantage... but God...
He saw and He cared and He reached down to save me when I couldn't help myself.

So... what has become most clear to me after all this, is that - - - I was my own worst enemy
and needed to be rescued - from myself.

Carolyn


She is running
A hundred miles an hour in the wrong direction
She is trying
But the canyon's ever widening
In the depths of her cold heart
So she sets out on another misadventure just to find
She's another two years older
And she's three more steps behind

Does anybody hear her? Can anybody see?
Or does anybody even know she's going down today
Under the shadow of our steeple
With all the lost and lonely people
Searching for the hope that's tucked away in you and me
Does anybody hear her? Can anybody see?

She is yearning
For shelter and affection
That she never found at home
She is searching
For a hero to ride in
To ride in and save the day
And in walks her prince charming
And he knows just what to say
Momentary lapse of reason
And she gives herself away

Does anybody hear her? Can anybody see?
Or does anybody even know she's going down today
Under the shadow of our steeple
With all the lost and lonely people
Searching for the hope that's tucked away in you and me
Does anybody hear her? Can anybody see?

If judgment looms under every steeple
If lofty glances from lofty people
Can't see past her scarlet letter
And we've never even met her...

[teartracks]

WOW, Carolyn,

Those lyrics.  Powerful and so true.  They make me cry.   

Under the steeple, no less!

Love,

tt

[Certain Hope]

tt,

It's not a new song... but yesterday was the first time it made me cry.
Guess I had to fully identify with who I was... in order to walk fully into being who I am now?
hmm... well, it makes sense in my head.

Hugs,
Carolyn

[Certain Hope]

This is just a book review, written by an ordinary person who'd read the book by Cloud and Townsend,
titled Boundaries: When To Say Yes, How to Say No To Take Control of Your Life

I'm including it here because so much of what she said was true for me... and, besides, it really is a great book.

Carolyn


This book is highly recommended. It's one of the most valuable purchases I've ever made.
Saying we should not set boundaries is saying that we should not be human. Traffic lights are boundaries. Laws are boundaries. Work hours are boundaries. Marriages are boundaries. Bounced checks are boundaries. Prisons are boundaries. Locked car doors are boundaries. Those reviewers who argue against setting boundaries are themselves, most assuredly, setting and respecting boundaries every day of their life. So let's be honest here. Let's not live in ivory tower concepts, twice removed from reality.

None of us is Jesus. If we were Jesus, we would not need Him to begin with. Codependency is * not * Christian love. Being a doormat is not spiritual. One cannot expand boundaries if one does not know how to set boundaries to begin with. This book is about learning to do just that. Boundary-setting is about being authentic to your own heart: "I am a child of God, and my feelings do matter here. I am being led to do this, even though it may contradict what you desire me to do." Do people sometimes bristle at the truth? You bet! It's human to want our desires fed, even if it is at another person's expense. It's not pretty; it's human. That's why we need boundaries.

In my experience, failing to set boundaries was a form of people-pleasing, and people-pleasing was a form of unconscious deception and false idol worship. I tried for many years to be a "good girl." That got great reviews. Never mind that I usually did things for other people without checking to see if it was what God was instructing me to do. Instead, my impulse came from selfish reasons, "I'll do this for you. Don't I look good? Now do you approve of me? If you do, then maybe I can approve of myself." What rubbish! My behavior was not motivated by Christ. My behavior was motivated by refined selfishness.

You see, I wasn't interested in you. I was interested in what you could give me: your approval. I was an approval junkie, and I was no more morally superior than a drug addict, no matter how much praise my actions brought me. I was worshipping a false idol -- the approval of others over God's direction -- and that false god failed me time & time again. Sorry folks. That's not Christian love. No wonder I hurt all the time! God never intended for me to be dishonest and unhappy. God never intended for me to get my worth from man.

Now that I've begun to listen to my heart, I am learning to tell the truth to myself and to others. I am learning to accept my limitations -- be humble -- and learning to be balanced. The truth does indeed set you free. This process has brought me what I never got from others' approval. It brought me the fruits of the spirit: joy and peace. It has also made my relationships with others more genuine and peaceful. People do approve of me, now, but it's the * real * me. That's how I know that this book teaches principles of truth.

Incidentally, it's wrong to hate people as you are setting boundaries. That's not what this book is proposing. Your intention in setting boundaries does matter here.

[seasons]

In my experience, failing to set boundaries was a form of people-pleasing, and people-pleasing was a form of unconscious deception and false idol worship. I tried for many years to be a "good girl." That got great reviews. Never mind that I usually did things for other people without checking to see if it was what God was instructing me to do. Instead, my impulse came from selfish reasons, "I'll do this for you. Don't I look good? Now do you approve of me? If you do, then maybe I can approve of myself." What rubbish! My behavior was not motivated by Christ. My behavior was motivated by refined selfishness.

You see, I wasn't interested in you. I was interested in what you could give me: your approval. I was an approval junkie, and I was no more morally superior than a drug addict, no matter how much praise my actions brought me. I was worshipping a false idol -- the approval of others over God's direction -- and that false god failed me time & time again. Sorry folks. That's not Christian love. No wonder I hurt all the time! God never intended for me to be dishonest and unhappy. God never intended for me to get my worth from man.

Now that I've begun to listen to my heart, I am learning to tell the truth to myself and to others. I am learning to accept my limitations -- be humble -- and learning to be balanced. The truth does indeed set you free. This process has brought me what I never got from others' approval. It brought me the fruits of the spirit: joy and peace. It has also made my relationships with others more genuine and peaceful. People do approve of me, now, but it's the * real * me. That's how I know that this book teaches principles of truth.

Incidentally, it's wrong to hate people as you are setting boundaries. That's not what this book is proposing. Your intention in setting boundaries does matter here. 
 
 

Thank you for sharing Carolyn.

 This spoke volumes to my heart.

 My heart is open and happily ready to receive, learn and love. seasons

[Certain Hope]

((((((Seasons)))))) Thank you.

Love,
Carolyn

[Certain Hope]

The most important boundary of all…
for me... has been recognizing where I leave off - - - - and God begins.

This one has so many ramifications that it’ll take awhile to sort through, but for starters… here’s an excerpt from John 5 – Jesus speaking:

You search the Scriptures because you believe they give you eternal life.
      But the Scriptures point to Me! 
Yet you refuse to come to Me so that I can give you this eternal life.
Your approval or disapproval means nothing to Me, because I know you don't have God's love within you.
 For I have come to you representing My Father, and you refuse to welcome Me, even though you readily accept others who represent only themselves.

One day, I realized... Jesus was speaking directly to me, there. Searching and studying and trying to learn enough about the rules to make myself presentable….so that I could feel better about myself and not like such an incompetent, bumbling fool.
In parochial school, I was taught to study and I was taught to heed rules
~  Study to show myself approved to God, a worker worthy of her hire.
By the way, that word study as used in Scripture has a completely different meaning from what I understood. That one little word incorporates putting the book-learning into practice and making it a part of daily life, not just prep-work for one big test, but the stuff it takes to get through all the little pop-quizzes that each day brings.

The bottom line of all this, for me, is that I needed to see that I could not make myself presentable by packing my head full of knowledge – not knowledge about the Bible or church history or any other factual info pertinent to my religion, because all that was left at the end of that road – was religion.
I’d been trying to fill myself from myself… instead of recognizing that I needed to come to the end of myself, in order to be filled.
Can’t fill a vessel that’s already overflowing.
First, it must be poured out, emptied.
And that was the gift of NPD-ex. He emptied me.

Carolyn

[Certain Hope]

Emptied me... well, almost.

No sooner was NPD-ex out the door than I discovered his online profile, announcing to the web that he wanted a woman who'd wake him up early, love God, and be good to his dogs.
I can laugh now... okay, chuckle… sometimes…
now that I thoroughly understand that when he said, "love God".... he meant, "love me".

Well, what's good for the gander, I thought...
and so I made myself an online profile... and met another man - a nice enough man, with a truckload of red flags, but at least he's not a letter of the alphabet, I thought...
and what difference does it make that he's not a Christian? After all, the last one claimed to be and that was a load of malarky...
and this one was so very thoughtful and helpful...
and isn't that what it's all about, after all? Just be a "good" person.

But as I set sail for a new la la land - where moral relativism reigns supreme - my spirit would not settle. It brewed and stewed within me, threatening to jump ship if I didn't wake up and recognize that if I reduced myself to this level, then N had accomplished his goal and effectively destroyed me. I could choose to be just like him... or I could choose life.
So I ended that relationship… thank God.
More detail on that when I get the nerve.

Carolyn