Why did my former N husband say weird things to our son?

[Amelia Rose]

Hi Everyone, it's been a while. I used to go on the Board not too many years ago and received valuable support - which I truly appreciate. After 30 years (I cringe everytime I think of HOW LONG I stayed, anyway . . .) I divorced.  My former husband - a true Narcisst and I have remained friends (he was never a friend when I was married to him- he wants to be my friend and be in my life after I left). I remain  friends primarily for my sons - and for "me"- so I can experience family time.  Anyway - early in our relationship - my husband (at the time) told me some strange things.  How he "didn't wear deodorant" (I thought it was because he thought it was bad for  him). He also told me that when his girlfriend before me broke up with him - he became very skinny.  Reason being - he said she left him for a skinny man. (I learned to doubt that.)  He said he ate only berries and apple juice and "everyone was worried about him."  (this is leading up to his new "strange" comments)   Well, years later of abuse - about 20 years worth - he lost his job, and went thru a difficult time.  And, as our relationship declined (or as I became stronger and began to distance myself emotionally) - he intentionally lost a lot of weight. To where he looked anorexic - but he thought he looked great.  At that time, "words from the past" also started to come out of his mouth.  He told me "he didn't wear deodorant" (he had worn it up until this time after we married).  Then one day he declared (in front of our 12 year old son and I)  "I don't bathe."  To which I quipped "you better bathe!"  His eyes got big and he never said that again.  Now that I have been divorced for 3 years - our son (21) lives with him.  There have been a few times that I was around my ex that I "couldn't believe the horrific smell and couldn't figure out where it was coming from."  (Naive me)    One day- my son said to me "Did Dad tell you that he wore the same socks for 2 weeks?"  My mouth dropped.  All I could say was "why?"  My son shook his head.  ***I never say negative things about my sons' father - in front of them, or to them, or to anyone who knows  them.  That's my sons father.  I also don't tell my sons how ill their father is, nor do I tell him the abuse he directed at me.  One time I started to and realized - it was not a good idea.  **I worry about my son living with him at times.  Does anyone have an idea as to "why" he would say that to my son?  Why - would out of nowhere - he'd say to my son "I wore the same pair of socks for 2 weeks."  And I believe he did.  That was the incredible stench I smelled and couldn't figure out where it was coming from.  Emotional manipulation?  Looking for pity?  What's the deal?  Early in my marriage - he fooled me.  He pulled the wool over  my eyes.  He pretended to be someone he was not. He lied to me and I believed him.  He was a clean man, then, so I thought. That's one of the things I liked about him. Now as the years have past, he wears a pair of Socks for 2 weeks?  This man has a washing machine and he has more than enough money to wash his socks.  Please - someone enlighten me.  In all fairnes, I think he is more sane now - than when I was married to him.  I think he tries more now to be stable.  Thank you.

[teartracks]

Hi AR,

My first thought is that your exN has some quirky behaviors that fall on the dark side.  You say he is N.   I bet he has layered or comorbid disorders, meaning more than one.  Being disordered is why he said those things to your son.  Has he ever sought therapy?   

I'm glad you have separated yourself from the disturbing circumstances you were in.  I hope things improve for your son too.  I hope exN can find help as well.

tt

[Amelia Rose]

Teartracks, Thank you for your response.  There was a time when I did a lot of research when I was married to the N and divorcing. I wanted to try to figure out what it was all about. During my marriage, I gone to therapy off and on- but therapy is only as good as the connection.  Not one therapist "saw" the situation for what it was or came close. Once I decided to make the big move and finally divorce - "information poured in for me."  It was incredible. At that time, in my heart - I saw that he had many disorders. I could name them. I think, at that time, BPD omnidepressant, narcisst, and  I can't remember what else.  You mentioned "the dark side". Would you pls elaborate. I have many reasons for asking.  The most important - "my sons" and what, in particular, one of them experienced.  I truly hope you reply "and" I would like to share futher with you. I could share many things - some are almost impossible to believe for some.  ***My former Ex - "hid" who he was for most of my marriage.  I gave his "depression" far too much credit.  One day, at the end of the relationship, and in a "family therapist" office - it came out.  He was "very much" aware of his abuse towards me.  The "isolation" "the depression".  Later, I also was told bits and pieces of "in high school they wanted me to see a psychiatrist" etc.  I think he hid himself very well from me.  For one- he "withheld information, conversation, and affection."  and he did a very good job of "putting it all on me" - as I was the one with the problem.  AS I went out the door to go to therapy - to try to figure out "what the hell was going on" - he told me I was the one with a screw loose - since I was going to therapy.  DARK SIDE?  I've remained close to him - for my sons - primarily. One lives with him. This man - almost NEVER talked with me.  He bullied me. He went into RAGES.  Understandably - I walked around him like i was on eggshells. And when he went to sleep EVERY NIGHT at 6:00 p.m. in the chair while watching tv?  That's when my world began.  Isn't that so terribly sad? But I can't beat myself up. I was VERY MUCH AWARE that he was prone to violence. One time - when I disagreed with him - he "sat" on me.  Some may think that's  funny and no-big-deal.  It was one of the most terrifying experiences of my life. I could not breath and he was drunk and would not get off.  Some how - some way - I pinched him in the right spot and he got off.  I later read - this is what a therapist told a woman to do to her unruly child.  She weight 200 lbs.  She killed him.  **Dark side?  He never showed any sign of spirituality and when I divorced him - he told me he was going to go on the Astral Plane and visit me in my bedroom.  Manipulative?  He told me he stopped - he woke up with claw marks on his chest and was fearful of where he had been.  I could go on and on.  I hope you answer my post. In a world where I have felt so very much alone, it means so much to think someone understands and can offer some insight.   I was  touched by your name.  I hope  you can find happiness.  After all the abuse I have been thru - I am starting to hear my self laugh again.  I hope I can reclaim myself.  Like the Shamans who reclaim the fragmentation of their souls.   Take very good care.

[Hopalong]

Hi AR,
I appreciate why you stay "friends" with this man if your minor son lives with him.
When that son is safely away, I hope you can get away yourself.

I can't know, but he sounds sadistic and psychopathic to me.

I think sometimes in children's lives it is a relief to hear the truth.

I waited until my daughter asked me (she was a teenager) before I said anything negative about her dad.
All my effort went into helping her cope with the divorce before that. When she finally asked (I guess it's confusing to a kid to hear nothing but kindness about their other parent...on some level they must wonder, then why divorce?) -- I told her the truth: I left because he yelled so much and I couldn't take it any more. It was just the way he was wired--his mother yelled all the time too, and in my house nobody did. Later, I also let her know that he is alcoholic and was never home. She saw his selfishness first-hand so that didn't need explaining.

What you describe with your exN is horrific to me. So much so, that I don't understand the friendship.

How old is the son who lives with him, and did the court award custody of him to your ex?

thanks,
Hops

[teartracks]

Dear AR,

I think my use of the term dark side may have been too strong a one to use. 

My first impression upon reading your first post was that your exN  had some pretty quirky ways like wearing the same socks for two weeks and not bathing.  Then I thought these  probably weren't  benign quirks, but maybe OCD or a phobia of some knd.  Please remember I'm just a lay person looking in from the outside.   If there is any way to get him to therapist and a physician, for a work up, that would be the best way to make a diagnosis concerning the things you're observing. 

Much love and best wishes for increasing peace as you deal with this very difficult situation. 

Feel free to share the perspective you have now compared to when you were in the marriage and how things have changed.

tt


 

[debkor]

Hi AR,

I thought of terms (the dark side) also.  Although mine really had a DARK side (criminal behavior) it is pretty much...(another side) that we see, as you spoke of, when he was first with you...the clean part is the only part you saw and then or now...the socks (his other side) and one So very different then the other..with many years of being divorced and still seeing/hearing things that you are still overserving (from a distance) but just as bizarre as they always have been (safely) and without direct emotional confusion or harm.  Clearly I guess I would call it, yet, sick.

I have been away and my children from my ex for almost 20 years.  Way back when, 20 years ago, there was an address found in a very exclusive area with his name as a resident.  I had went there waiting to see if it was him or a fluke.  Never found out and thought I was on the wrong track and going over board.

Now 20 years later when he showed up at my son's job after not seeing him (with a birthday card, money, note about inheritance, be safe, have fun on his birthday) out of the blue....his address was the same as above....20 years Later!

So all I can tell you is, Who Knows!!!!  They are bizarre and the only thing I can or advise is that ....Don't try to figure them out....You never will.  You will just get trapped into that same world of ...What the...again.   

I do understand your concern about your son being there and the Craziness if even in talk alone. 

I do believe my ex is somewhat more stable now also and I use that term lightly because I think with the removed pressure of someone WHO knows the people behind closed doors (such as all of us on here) they can go on and appear, normal, even play acting it, copying others, to get by.  When others would hear what we have heard and not by our ears of living experience they can blow it off...oh that is just disgusting...when we really know, No, that is really Sick along with the other things they have done.

I would really like to be able to answer your question, as well, as my own and the only thing I can answer is ..They are Sick.  I really don't know why they do the things they do.  Say the things they do.

Mine blurted out one time at Thanksgiving, I wonder what the pilgrims would be doing now?  He also slicked back his hair to look (sneaky) changed his whole look and I even found a journal he started that he started to write about how (he) fooled everyone and really was not the person everyone thought he was.  Written with some kind of *high* satisfaction, a kick he got out of it.
It was not an admission to guilt or getting real it would have been left with the same *tactics* of Shock when other people saw what I call....(the dark side)...the other side.

I am not who you think I really am..with little things said..that I do believe (they slip up) and say things and not for you to directly know it...they just are talking outloud..for they only exist and sometimes they are off guard and not even aware of it or bothered by it BECAUSE they do not Think or are Normal. 

They truly are sick.  They are disordered. 

In all fairnes, I think he is more sane now - than when I was married to him.  I think he tries more now to be stable.  Thank you.

I don't know if it's stable he is trying to be.  I don't think they can.  If they are more stable (as mine appears to be also) remind yourself he is not and that is why you are hearing such disturbing things (still).  I just think that maybe the pressure is *off a bit* for he can now be who ever, hide who ever, copy others, live somewhat (appearing to be normal) to others and just Slipped up and showed (his other side) again. 

I understand your concern for your son living with his dad.  Your son is Now experiencing (directly hit) with his odd behavior and comments. 

Maybe it's time to explain things so he can self protect.  I don't know AR.  It is a difficult situation. 

As TT says, I'm just a lay person looking from the outside also but I am familiar with some of the things although mine are not the same.

I spoke the truth to my children like Hops.

One day- my son said to me "Did Dad tell you that he wore the same socks for 2 weeks?"  My mouth dropped.  All I could say was "why?"  My son shook his head.

I'm wondering if your son is looking for truth and is seeing that something is not normal and looking for guidance and validation that something is wrong?

love
Deb

[teartracks]

Hi AR,

Did you tell your exN that his smell is unpleasant and that it's unpleasant being around him?  Who knows, it may inspire him to bathe.

It keeps going through my mind that he may have some undiagnosed problem having to do with a disease of his body.  There are so many things that can cause a person's behavior to change in bizarre ways.  Just a thought.

tt