Bringing out the worst in us...

[Gabben]

[b"]I am a flawed, self centered, egocentric human being who has to try to walk in the Spirit ."[/b]

Me too.

[Ami]

You know, Lise. I am seeing s/thing really empowering. It is the opposite of  N thinking. N's have to be sp perfect b/c their self is so small and not defined. For me, if I can accept all my "flesh"(ie self centered, petty, egocentric, jealous etc etc)  then I can stop cycling in the "I am Bad" thing and just let the Spirit shine through.I don't have to keep negotiating if I am bad within my own head.
 Sometime, I can feel that happening. Do you know what I mean?    Ami

[Gabben]

Dear Lise
 I am so glad you feel better after the letter of amends. I think it shows  that we know what to do in our deepest gut and have to follow it. If we do, it will turn out well.

Ami - here is a video of one of my favorite thinkers...

You will appreciate this.... click on the big screen on the page.

http://www.wordonfire.org/

The video is a short one 6 min. It relates to the idea of making an amends to an enemy or to someone who has done you more harm than you have done to them...reaching out and wiping out all harm, giving all a fresh start. Sounds nice doesn't it?

[Ami]

I listened to his message.He said some wonderful things. I can see why you like him. It seemed like he was talking about Grace vs the Law.
I have had problem when perfectionism got mixed up with  I was trying to be too perfect and made myself crazy. So, I am  trying to love God first, myself second and then my neighbor.
 I really don't know what I am doing half the time . Recovering from the NM's abuse makes it hard to figure things out, for sure.
                                                                     XXXOOO    Ami

[Ami]

I guess what I am struggling with relates to what you were saying.
 I try to give to others. I try to love others and I think I do OK at it,probably just OK. However, it is SO hard to nurture myself. I feel like I MUST punish myself for some reason to keep the world safe.
 I am better than before but still loving myself seems so forbidden, on the nature of a crime.
 "Who do you think you are?" was the mantra of my life. I feel like I must be loyal to it.
  I am hoping I can see the door out of this. I am hoping the door will open and I will see how silly it is to punish myself and I will walk to the other side and look back and not be the same person.        Ami

[Gaining Strength]

lise - what a thread.  I think part of Nism is getting those around them to do the acting out.  It is part of their mask.  And man does it describe my life until a year or so ago.  Boy did I hate that acting out and I didn't understand it until I began to understand the forces of Nism in my life.  I still fall for the bait but only once or twice a year instead of once or twice a day - big difference.

How I got here today is too long; not relevant, really. It's important to nail down just what your fear is, I think... because I think you'll find - as I have - that there isn't anything to fear once you KNOW what that fear is. Once you can name it... you can face that pain, too... breathe in and out the reality... and go on - letting that go, too. I'm trying... it's not easy.

ahh PR yes, yes, yes - not relevant.   keep focused.

[Gabben]

I feel like I MUST punish myself for some reason to keep the world safe.
 

Ami - imagine that you were being spied on, watched by say the Vatican or somewhere that is very dignified for some that dignified group might be celebrities, right?

So image that people see you in your melt downs, your really horrible lashing out Nish melt downs, what would you do? How would you feel?

[Ami]

Today, at the Messianic Synagogue, the rabbi was talking about Jesus and what He did for us.  I felt the love He had for us. This is the key ,I think. Perfect love casts out fear. Most of our problems, Lise, are probably fear--fear we are not OK, fear that we  really ARE what our NM's told us we were, fear that we will not be loved, accepted, fear that we will not be able to get "life' right and be failures. I could fill the page with fears.
 I could really feel what Jesus did. How we suffered for pure love. I know this is the answer but I fail so in being satisfied with it.
       Ami

[Gabben]

Perfect love casts out fear. Most of our problems, Lise, are probably fear--fear we are not OK, fear that we  really ARE what our NM's told us we were, fear that we will not be loved, accepted, fear that we will not be able to get "life' right and be failures.

Ami --once again, you hit the nail on the head. It is all about fear. First, though, thank you for the reflection on Christ and how moved you were at your temple.

Today, I'm in mostly frustration but the frustration IS from fear. I have been on unemployment for 3 months but in that time they have only sent me 3 checks and have been delaying in sending me money. It is almost impossible to get through to them, I've sent letters, emails etc, just when I start to think that they will send me a check, optimistically checking my mailbox, I am let down and led more into frustration. It is getting more than I have ever experienced which is teaching me about just how spoiled I have been most of my life. There are people out there in this world who cannot get jobs or healthcare or are denied far worse than my life of comfort. I mean I have a cozy place to live, there is money for me if I need it, I have family, there are plenty of job opportunities for me, if I work hard for them. I have tons of friends, tons of things to do here, I have my health...unless I smoke myself to death anytime soon, then there is my relationship with God....in reality do I need more?


It really is about giving up (an old FOO baby denial of needs wounds) which I was just not ready to do now...my life has been trauma and in the midst of it I want comfort yet that comfort is being denied, sort of...there is still plenty of it, just not on my terms.

Anyways...I threw a tantrum this morning, now I feel like crap because I beat myself up when I have an expression of emotion. I beat myself up for not acting like a 12th century saint...they did not have, ipods, Comcast, unemployment benefits, computers, all the options and choices that we have, they had it easy, at least from my perspective, they had less to give up because there was just less to give up.

Teresa of Avila writes a book The Interior Castle....I'm going to write a book called the Interior Spa, it will be more appropriate for our times, we do not need castles to help defend against the outer world of fears...we need spa time, massages, pedicures, sleep in the sun, mud baths, facials etc...hugs and group therapy where we can pull ourselves out of the wicked shame spirals with story tellings and laughter...how to translate this to an interior experience I have not figured out yet but I better start trying...soon, I am almost out of money.

Lise

[Ami]

For me, Lise, a wonderful Interior Spa would be to get my NM out of my head and be able to see life from my own belly button and to trust myself.
 I feel like the unemployment checks will work out.
 We have many blessings but the NM voices must be exorcised for us to have a quality of life, I think.            Ami

[Gabben]

Ami,

I'm watching Lupita's thread on the ego....please watch, it relates to exactly this....it is interesting.

[Gabben]

You know, Lise. I am seeing s/thing really empowering. It is the opposite of  N thinking. N's have to be sp perfect b/c their self is so small and not defined. For me, if I can accept all my "flesh"(ie self centered, petty, egocentric, jealous etc etc)  then I can stop cycling in the "I am Bad" thing and just let the Spirit shine through.I don't have to keep negotiating if I am bad within my own head.
 Sometime, I can feel that happening. Do you know what I mean?    Ami

Ami -- I did not really respond to this. The answer is yes, I know what you mean. That is a very powerful insight, you are so close to Christ, really doing the work of facing yourself and your past.

"N's have to be sp perfect b/c their self is so small and not defined."

Right, they seek definition of self through perfection and achievement. Jesus does not define us by our worldly achievements or even how perfect we are, He loves us exactly was we are, fully flawed, fully human, fully in complete need of Him. He can see right through us and into our hearts. I think that your letting the spirit shine through is a reflection of the Christ love, letting Him shine through you in the spirit of truth and humility, that humility of facing ones self.

Never had I ever felt so fully complete, even in my flaws and failures, than when I bring all of myself to Christ in prayer, His love fills me up. Just knowing that He wants to heal me, completely, is a reflection that I can spend hours thinking about.

[Gabben]

I am better than before but still loving myself seems so forbidden, on the nature of a crime.

exactly.

Loving myself feels like a crime.

Ami - I was re-reading this old thread to see where I was a week ago in my thought processes. When I read this line I realized why it is so hard for me to love myself, in all my imperfections. It is hard for me to love and accept myself because I feel that loving and accepting me, as I am, in my dysfunction, is wrong. I stil tell myself that in order for me to love myself I need to be perfect, meaning fully saint like loving, in all of my responses. What a load of crap! That is me pointing the finger back at me.

Love,
Lise

[Gabben]

I feel like the unemployment checks will work out.
 

I'm praying. Being so close to broke has some major spiritual growths towards detachment and faith but it is also terrifying. I am thinking that I may never receive benefits, have to go back to work, which will be OK for me, but without rest and some downtime to process what feels like hell at times I need some money. Yet, I can honestly say that this deprivation has forced me into another letting go and another deepening of God in my life, a deeper realizing that I need very little of the material world to be fully happy in this lifetime.

It is becoming the art of suffering and simplicity. However, if you have spent a life of indulgence and running, then it is not easy to turn the opposite direction. I kick and and scream. Then I beat myself for kicking and screaming. Ugh... Surrender, again.

[Meh]

Thank you, Gabben!

That confirms something for me.

I can be good..good..good..good.. and then can't take the Nar-person anymore, and I end up losing dignity.

I totally agree. another breath here

Yes, they do bring out the worst in us and then we are remembered for our "worst"  not for our best.