what mental illness looks like

[seastorm]

My sister is sinking into mental illness I think. She is so angry at her friends and at me and everyone. She gets easily triggered and interprets things in a way that is frightening people and driving them away.

This is painful because usually we are very close. She will not see a counselor or go to Mental Health. That is the worst insult to her. So we are at a stand off because I cant take the angry attacks and her fears that I am destroying myself. I am actually taking time out to take care of myself on a leave of absence from work. So hearing that I am destroying myself is crazy making. I dont drink, do drugs, eat bad food etc. I have ok friends. Her fear that I dont exercise enough is true and I will smarten up.


I cant help her because I think she is too sick for me to handle. It is like having an alcoholic spouse. She wont get professional help.
At the same time she helped me when  I was in the depths of despair over my exN going off with another woman. I want to be there for her but she attacks me and tears me to shreds.

Does anyone have experience with this? Please reply

Sea storm

[Gaining Strength]

At the same time she helped me when  I was in the depths of despair over my exN going off with another woman.

She helped you because you were open to help.
You wrote that she has refused your help.

There is nothing you can do except protect yourself.
Unfortunately I have had too much experience with this.  My dear aunt went through psychosis during a profound depression in recent years.  I called her long distance and she railed at me for coming to her home and stealing from her.  The fact that I was home almost 1000 miles away made no difference.  This was from a profoundly kind person who never expressed anger or unkindness toward me in any form.  It was her state and had nothing to do with reality.  Today, she has no memory of it.

The person who used to post here whom CB refers to had a very stable marriage and that had to have been a great help to her in managing her illness.

As difficult as it is in the midst of your sister's crisis I do encourage you to find a way to protect yourself from the attacks.  They are not based in reality and so there is no reasoning that will bring relief.

My heart is with you as you struggle through this.

[seastorm]

Thank you Gaining Strength,

It is hard to detach and try to be objective. She is furious that I suggested medication. She is on thyroid medication for low thyroid and I suggested she get that checked but that is an insult too.  God, this is sad and frustrating. For my sister who is a lovely person and kind in every way, this illness is cruel beyond belief.  Some of it is from our dismal childhoods and some from chemistry. I cant tell which is which.  That is why she need help from professionals.  She has experience with Mental Health and they were horrible. Now it is worse in some ways because of cutbacks and the emphasis on medication. But medication sure has its place when the black dogs are unleashed.

CB.

Yes, it is so much like living with an alcoholic. And I know what that is like.
I have been talking to her on the phone and through internet but the attacks and the rage dont stop. Her attacks DO contain kernels of truth so I listen but then they go too far and she starts thinking I am an evil, attacking bitch. I am trying to stay calm but I told her to knock off the attack because I cant stand it. It is starting to destabilize me.

I feel frustrated that she wont take medication. Instead everyone ( me and her two friends are supposed to put up with her being triggered and flying off the handle over every other  comment. I think I need to go to Al Anon. and get a dose of reality. I feel like a very cruel person not being by her side in this.
If I detach, then what will happen to her?

Sea storm

[Gaining Strength]

Sea - detaching is  different from going No Contact.   Detachment is a state of being present but not responding emotionally.  It is not a natural experience but it can be practiced and learned.  I often think that people who deal with trauma wounds in E-rooms have a great ability to detach while being very present.

Meditation definitely leads to detachment but I am certain that there are other ways as well. Keeping in mind that your sister's mental illness doing that talking and that it is NOT reality can be a start.  Imagining that you are watching the intereaction between the two of you on TV rather than being in the midst of it can give you some space to observe with detachment.  These are some times of exercises that can help you get that detachment which mmight allow you to hear her without taking any of it personally.  It is difficult but it is not impossible.

[Sealynx]

Sea,
These folks are right. I have two friend who are bi-polar and  I agree that there is nothing you can do but stay out of harms way if they do not want to seek help. Luckily mine both admit to the disorder, giving me some measure of influence, especially with the woman who will check in with her mental health professional if I suggest that her mood seems a bit off. That is about the most I have found I can do for either one of them, just let them know when I find their mood starting to go up or down. Once they are in the grips of a full blown manic or depressive episode they usually aren't open to input.

[Gaining Strength]

Here is a link to a Youtube video about mental illness that I'm told is excellent.

I am having trouble with my connection and cannot view videos.  So the link is to a youtube list.  The video I am referring to is the first one.  I hope you find it of value.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=what+is+mental+illness&aq=0

[seastorm]

I watched the doctor talking about the myth of mental illness. He speaks in such a ho-hum, bored way and seems so beyond the whole idea. Obviously, his auntie griselda is not nashing her teeth in the next room, nor his his first born dropping out of college and joining the Nazi party.  He lacks conviction.

I agree that there is no real diagnosis but nevertheless people seriously get derailed. Much of what happens can be understood through, poor lifeskills, impulsive behaviour, poor diet, extreme stress etc. But I am not talking about the worried well here. When someone starts hiding knives and getting paranoid that is another matter. When talking does not work......

I will keep looking at the youtube stuff though.

Also detachment is very important. I do take it personally. I live alone, get lonely, get unbalanced myself. I am not the rock of gibraltor but I am studying Budhism and trying to look at other ways of managing myself and my reality.  I value compassion highly but I find this mentally ill raging beyond me to tolerate.  But if I dont who will? No one.

Sea storm

[Lollie]

Hi, Seastorm,

Both of my parents have PDs. (Mom uNPD, Dad dx BPD). At his very worst, my dad would have psychotic breaks. He would also hallucinate. At his best, he would rage and threaten and get physical...well, it was pretty awful.

But even then, I didn't want to give up on him. I felt sorry for him because it is mental illness. It's not a "lifestyle choice" or his just choosing to be an a@#hole. That pity (or love or blood bond or survivor guilt or refusal to "abandon" him) kept me engaged in a situation that was harmful for me. It IS hard to detach from a family member, especially with a sibling, but you need to take care of yourself first. Detaching emotionally is a way you can protect yourself. And you do deserve to be protected.

Here's a saying from AlAnon that helps me.

You didn't cause it.
You can't control it.
You can't cure it.

Wishing you peace,
Lollie

[seastorm]

Thank you everyone for your kind, informed responses.

Seems I have been down this road before where I felt I just had to toughen up and take it. That did not help.

Lollie,

You have been down the road too. You are too right about not causing it, contolling it, or fixing it.
I am here for my sister but I wont be abused.

When do I draw the line about accepting her anger? She keeps saying she is entitled to be angry, to be critical, to be sad.
I get lost in it.

So I am taking care of myself today. Went Nordic walking with a pair of old bamboo ski poles my ex left behind. It was pretty uncoordinated but I felt good. Then went singing.

Hearing all those psychiatrists saying that there is  no physical diagnosis for mental illness makes me wonder.  What is their training????? Some of them must have gone into training as doctors and dont have much inclination to heal the wounded mind, except with medicine. The DSM folks have another orientation and some of it helps to understand what is going on.

Maybe there is no test for alcoholism but it sure exists. Maybe the mentally ill are the same ones in an insane society.
Too bad Mental Health is so inhumane. Families are left to flounder.

Sea storm

[Lollie]

There are also often personality disorders.  Personality disorders are not the same as mental illness, but it is possible for both to exist in the same person.  That muddies the waters, doesnt it? 
CB

CB,
Would you be able to clarify what you meant by "personalities are not the same as mental illness"? From all I have read, experienced, and heard from professionals, personality disorders such as BPD are serious mental illnesses.

Lollie

[seastorm]

Thank you so much CB. I read your post and what you say is good advice and makes sense to me. I will write later. She has two friends who live close to her and care a lot for her but they are at the same place I am at, as far as being verbally beaten up.

I feel so much better after listening to what you all have said.


Sea

[Gaining Strength]

my father has been diagnosed with PD nos, bi-polar, OCD, ADHD, depression and anxiety.  The psychiatrist called them all mental illnesses.

Sea - I wish I had watch the video first.  It sounds as though it was unhelpful.  I apologize.

[mudpuppy]

 

From all I have read, experienced, and heard from professionals, personality disorders such as BPD are serious mental illnesses.

(Sticking my nose in) It depends on your definitions.
IIRC the predominant way of classifying these things is;
mental or thinking disorders such as schizophrenia which involve disordered thinking or mental processes manifesting as delusions or hallucinations;
mood disorders which obviously involve problems with mood, such as depression and;
personality disorders such as NPD etc which involve some defect or disorder in how the personality formed but not necessarily involving mood or hallucinations.
Lot's of different causes of course and lots of overlap as well even between organic, physical illnesses and environmental or developmental ones. All presuambly can be clssified as mental illnesses.
I'll leave CB to explain what she meant but I presume she was making the distinction between PDs which seem to arise from some type of developmental problem and seem fairly intractable and others such as bi-polar and schizophrenia which appear more likely to be primarily physical in nature but at least can be treated and often controlled if not cured. IOW, I doubt she was downplaying the seriousness of PDs vs other disorders, just marking the distinction between them.

mud

[seastorm]

I appreciate the time and thought of all your replies. It can feel pretty lonely to have my dear sister, eccentric, smart and funny really go off the trolley whether it is PD, or Bi Polar.  I just wish she could get levelled out. For all I know she needs to grieve and rage over some horrible thing in her childhood.
I cant seem to detach enough to help and her powerful feelings and blame render me helpless. I feel guilty that I am not able to fix this but know that I cant.

I realize that my own anger must be hard on people close to me. I feel blessed that I dont rage the way that she does to almost everyone and anyone.She thinks its ok.   There are people that she does not lash out at. One is my rich aunt.
Maybe it is all biochemistry but I dont think so. I have been reading Alice Miller and she talks about the damage done by cruel parenting. She also says that most people would rather die than see that their parents did not love them or failed to love them etcc.

Thank You Lollie, Gaining Strength, CB, Mudpuppy.  You are so dear.


Sea storm

[mudpuppy]

As far as ADHD being a mental illness...it seems almost cruel to label attention deficit a mental illness.

Curious as to why CB. Because of the unwarranted strigma that is placed on mental illness?
I've struggled with that stigma with my schizophrenic step son. To me there should be no more cruelty attached to a dignosis of a physical illness of the brain than with one of the lungs or spine. In fact, mental illness with a physical cause should often have less stigma attached to it IMO than some other diseases, because schizophrenia and ADHD, for example, are seldom the result of bad choices whereas many lung, heart and other non-mental, physical illnesses are.

And since I'm disagreeing, might as well go whole hog.
Do PDs have in any real sense of the word a choice over what they do?
At one theoretical level they certainly do as they are human beings who can either do evil or do good when presented with a choice.
However are we sure that someone with a strong PD is any less ill simply because the root of their illness isn't organic?
Do they have any more choice to behave normally than a schizophrenic? I'm not sure they do. I do know they're mostly miserable people, wholly petrified with fear who, one would think, would choose to be not miserable, not petrified people if they could.
It's a tough question because, despite their illness, they do know good from evil; I've watched them calculate the diffence. But I'm coming around to accepting they may not be able to, in any real sense, choose the good. Makes me somewhat easier on them morally although I am still of the position that they should be held legally accountable whenever possible to make those they harm as whole as possible. Whatever the Ns level of choice, invariably their innocent victims had NO choice in being seriously harmed just by being within their orbits.

mud