Ovens, old recipes, & emotions

[sKePTiKal]

So, OK - I've taken on the task of trying to come close to MIL's "hot rolls". I have these fancy new ovens that I don't know well. They have a real proof setting - that's worthless. Especially since there are cold spots in the oven. I'm better off with the oven in the gas range... I think. Not sure yet. Lots of ovens to try. It's a new house.

I used to bake bread on a regular basis. Knew how the dough should look, feel, be... and when to take it out of the oven. Now: not a friggin' clue!! It's like a piece of knowing has evaded me... damn it.

Can't get the rolls to raise enough - maybe that's just patience?? - to even look like rolls. They look like bisquits. Flat.

Emotion: it's like the world is upside down and the old "rules" are worthless. Did I ever think to try to make the rolls while she could still tell me what to do? That would be NO. Is that my fault? Maybe.... did anyone else think of it? That would be NO. I was lucky that she gave the recipe to another SIL. But I still don't have it right.

Is it really this important ???? Well. Maybe. But not for me - for being able to provide the "sustenance" that's missing... for those that grieve more than I do.

I don't think I'm even ready to process how much my MIL has changed how I see things. About my bioNic Family...

there is an ocean separating what "I'm used to" and "what I've found". And yet, what I've found - isn't complex, isn't fraught with snake pits, isn't one those velvet glove gotchas.... it's so simple it takes my breath away.

Makes it all the more remarkable that the BioNic family didn't know enough - or care enough - to give it.

[CB123]

Oh, PR...I have LOTS of fool proof bread recipes....but I looked online for a couple that might be what your MIL would have made.  I found this one:

Nanas Yeast Rolls

1/4 cup sugar
1 tsp salt
1/2 cup vegetable shortening such as Crisco
1/2 cup hot water
1 pkg yeast
1/2 cup warm water
3-1/2 cup plain flour
1 egg.

Dissolve sugar, salt & Crisco in hot water. Dissolve yeast in warm water.
Mix all ingredients and let rise to double. Shape into rolls and bake at
425F.


I was trying to imagine a woman of that era and what she would have used that would have not occurred to us ((Crisco!)

Also check out the recipe books of that era, esp. Joy of Cooking or Betty Crocker. 

Your "biscuit" rolls sound like the yeast failed...not the right temp water? ????  I always made sure the water was the temp of a baby's bath....too hot will kill the yeast, two cold will not make it grow.  Also check the expiration date on the yeast.  I had a lot of success with rapid-rise yeast. 

I'd love to know how it goes--let me know.

CB

[lighter]

(((Amber)))

I wish you'd had the pleasure of baking those rolls with your dear MIL too, Amber.

I remember asking my Grandma to show me how to cook her pork pot pie, homeade donuts and apple pie.

Makes me sick I didn't ask her to show me 15 other things, but we hold on to what we have.

Lighter

[sKePTiKal]

two cold will not make it grow

CB: I think this is part of the problem/solution. The first half of the recipe is dissolving yeast in water - with another bowl dissolving a stick of margarine, salt & sugar in boiling water; they get combined after the water cools - then add all the flour. I think I was too "tepid" on the yeast water. This batch was lighter than the first (different recipe) just not "tall", so I'm on the right track.

The ovens are another key, I think. I had a nice sticky dough for the first rise - which I associate with lighter breads (maybe incorrectly?). And I'm thinking I'll lightly grease the bowl and dough ball, on the next try. (yeah - Crisco was a staple in my house!)
I know I can set my big oven to 200 - then turn it off to rise the dough and that's going to be my next step. I think the proof temp on the other oven is actually too low - takes forever - and lets the yeast "rest" too long. So that, when I've cut out the rolls and sent them back to rise again - the yeast doesn't react again.

One other variable I'm thinking about is how long I'm kneading the dough initially. I think I could probably get away with another minute or two (by hand) and wind up with a smoother dough which will end up more integrated & elastic - and maybe boost the height some.

And there's one more magic ingredient - getting my head in the right space. I'm making this into one of my do/die campaigns... it's TOO important to me, despite the words coming out of my mouth that I think I believe... so I'm overthinking, second-guessing, and doubting myself and the process. Time for me to walk away for a little bit and do some other things... then try again. One other mistake I know I've been making is starting too late in the day - and so I'm rushing to bake because of dinner time.

Light: ya know, I can't remember at this point if this was my idea or Hubs'... sometimes he has an idea and I get all the" joy "of executing it! It really would've been a good thing to make these with her; we were talking about bread not long before she went. But then, I didn't know the whole story behind the rolls either. Nothing huge is hinging on my conquering the recipe or the ovens... so, I've got to take a step back from this and figure out how it got to be soooo important to me. And breathe a little bit.

[lighter]

Maybe taking your time, figuring this out step by step, will be walking meditation for you, Amber.

I look forward to the post where you're sharing those warm familiar roles with your loved ones again.

Lighter

[Hopalong]

It makes perfectly poignant sense, Amber.
The bread of life, bread is life, you wish you could bring back her life.

It's a beautiful struggle and you've made the connection.

She would be very touched by how much love and determination you're putting into these biscuits and she would admire them if they were tough as leather and tasted like socks.

I can imagine how the family would enjoy it if you amazingly replicated her biscuits, and I can also imagine that impulse comes from your desire to "fix" their grief.

You are a lovely human and you're still surfing.

love,
Hops

[sKePTiKal]

your desire to "fix" their grief

SPOT ON AGAIN, HOPS! (smacking forehead... I should've spotted this sooner, huh? OH WELL.)

And you're also right, that MIL is telling me - they're just fine, it's OK, you did good. The first time she did that, I spent a lot of time protesting that my results were awful... etc... it would never do. A little bit of letting go... working on some other things... and I'm almost ready to check the second rise; first one was way higher than the other 2 batches. I am switching ovens for rising - and baking. We'll see if that helps too. A bit worried about how loose & sticky the dough was after the first rise, but Hubs got to help by sprinkling flour for me to knead in, until I got rollable dough - and maybe that'll help, too.

I don't get to "own" these rolls - I'm just borrowing them.

[Hopalong]

Some people plop their dough in a crockpot set on Warm to rise.
I hear that works pretty well...

xo
Hops

[sKePTiKal]

Well - the recipe works. BIL was able to bake some respectably pretty rolls and loaves last night and sent the pictures to prove it!

I'm very glad that someone was able to, even if it wasn't me. And perhaps it's better that it wasn't me. Hubs probably won't let me give up even after 3 tries... but we have some new info which helps explain what's going on with my attempts.

BIL used rapidrise yeast.
His rising times were twice as long as mine - in a 150 oven. Like 90 minutes.
And while hubs insisted that I only put a dozen rolls in each pan; BIL put 2 dz. in.

(one other detail - BIL barely worked the dough; just punched it down; floured top/bottom; rolled to 3/4 in thick and cut out - leads me to believe I might've shorted a cup of flour in my last batch - lost count - as my magpie hubby kept flying in/out of the kitchen distracting me; yep-yep it's HIS fault I can't count and won't let him "watch me"!     )

The first one - was an assumption on my part, since the recipe didn't specify; I used regular yeast.
Again, I had no times in the recipe - only till "double", which I was able to get in the first rise OK @ 45 mins... but nothing in the 2nd. no matter how long I waited... and it's possible that putting the cutout rolls so close together helps force them Up - rather than Out, tho' when the dough's as loose as mine was it would've spread into a cake, I think.

This recipe has been like trying to draw an elephant from the description of people who've only known one aspect of it! BIL remembered lots of kneading - but didn't do any in his successful batch. Neither hubs or BIL remember the potato flakes in the recipe. Hubs claimed authority over the process  - and has never made bread in his life, while I thought I knew a good bit because, yeah, I DID make bread quite frequently... a long time ago. And yeah - we're all pretty competitive...

so I learned a whole lot about my ovens. I'm figuring out how/where to work in the kitchen. And as long as one of us can bake these... the rolls will keep on rollin' on....

[sKePTiKal]

CB:

10-20 years ago, I used to live up to my elbows in brown rice, granola... and baking. All the time. Sort of in-between the first time it was fashionable and the latest. LOL! (just a wee bit out of sync, I am).

I'm just glad someone got them to come out... so I'll give it another shot, another time. I'm fair with pies & cookies - only took me 10 years to master basic pie crust dough after avoiding it due to catastrophes. Cakes - well, I make Charlie Brown cakes unless they're sheet cakes. They still taste the same, they just always look a little "homemade" if you know what I mean! Thank god for cupcakes!!!!

[Hopalong]

Oh my.
The King Arthur web site IS amazing, CB.

It also made me fantasize about moving to Vermont to work for them!
(Naaah. Too cold. But what a terrific company...just amazing.)
And would that be the perfect place for YOU, or what?

xxoo

Hops

[sKePTiKal]

Oh yes! It's a great little company. My shopaholic hubs, has of course obtained a catalog... and I think we're on their mailing list now.

SO... at the reception-family reunion-"after party" at the second service yesterday for MIL... her fav niece lets me know that there is yet ANOTHER recipe, which is the "right" recipe. The one we've been using is one she sent MIL from a magazine... which is good, OK? But it's not "the" recipe... which is to arrive via email soon. And CB - you'll be glad to know this one uses Crisco. The technique is strange - but it makes sense, too. You heat the crisco... adding butter & sugar... then add the proofed yeast... then flour.

I don't think the actual recipe is the point; it could ANY recipe at all... but it's the idea, that MIL was able to sense who was in need of her special "hot rolls" and she would go out of her way to make sure they got some. That's the biggie that we were losing in the details - success or failure.

[sKePTiKal]

CB -

the "magic ingredient" is fun, love, caring... you know. The amazons closing ranks to buoy up one who needs it... until it's someone else's turn. Food = sharing, nurturing, life.

Sometimes the Alice Water's - pure food... sometimes totally unhealthy but oh so comforting "comfort food". Like bacon!

I think maybe this is like the alchemical "fifth element" - a physical force of nature that science isn't interested in, because it's impossible to quantify!   (and seriously - we don't want them to - it would ruin the effectiveness & magic...)

[Gaining Strength]

for being able to provide the "sustenance" that's missing... for those that grieve more than I do.

I suspect that those don't grieve more but differently.  I also suspect your grief is deep, deep, deep - for MIL and for all that could have been and wasn't in your life.

[sKePTiKal]

You are right, GS. But the comfort is the same facts, as well.

Nothing can ever replace, diminish, or remove the memory of the small kindnesses she showed me and those small things will forever outweigh the void and lack that I have in relationship with the bioNic mother. And there is a type of miracle in it that I don't completely understand - I don't have to solve this mystery:

that kind of simple human kindness spreads and travels throughout life, the universe... from person to person... without degrading, becoming less, or changing. It remains pure and potent. And it overcomes many, many ills, injustices, difficulties. Just by being and being given freely.