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Narcissistic mom and weight comments revisited

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sKePTiKal:
Oh my, NLS... yes, when people don't think about what is coming out of their mouths, they say some really stupid things that they don't really mean!! (me included) I can see where you might think she's an expert on relationships and "how to get one"...

But, I would disagree with your friend about a.) being hot ALWAYS works and b.) that this would be a relationship you would want. Hops is better at explaining the social pressure behind all this, that I am. I found out through experience that this is just an opt-repeated myth. Yeah, I can look back to my 20s, when I was 5-7 and 110 lbs, and think that I was "hot". I was also overwhelmingly insecure about how I looked, didn't know thing one about makeup or hair, and always felt I looked like a hooker when I dressed up... so the options were, don't dress up or try to play the part and be outrageously flirtatious. And while there were a couple of guys who saw through this disguise, the playacting and hiding the real me... for the most part this only attracted guys who were incapable of relationships... or such jerks, with real and sometimes serious "problems"... well, hail... that didn't "work" at all! LOL... I ran as fast as I could.

Through my Ds, and my new exploration of having a social life... I'm meeting a lot of younger guys now. Guys with real jobs, careers, who've already given up their crazed 20s, the world is my oyster, wreck havoc and plunder and pillage days. They know, that sometimes, "pretty is as pretty does" - that the outside doesn't always accurately reflect what is inside - and they've had their egos slammed against a wall, run over & left for dead, set on fire and run over again. They've been deeply hurt, in other words. And they're very, very cautious now... because they want the same thing women want: someone to care about them, their feelings, to be a partner in life, someone to comfort, protect, and nurture... who will return the favor. Really, I'm impressed with the "quality" of guys I'm meeting... oh - and they still like to have fun, but within reason. I didn't find these guys back when I thought I was "hot".

They know not to judge a book by its cover because it's fallen on their foot and broken bones - and sometimes left them poorer, financially and spiritually. They don't value "hot" nearly as much, as someone with character, a life of her own that's interesting and intersects with their interests, they want some someone with some depth, who can collaborate, communicate, and who is going in the same direction that they are. That said, attractive doesn't hurt - but it's not "the" most important thing. Love does funny things to perception, and how people rate physical appearance... and I find that "generous perception" remains, long after middle age sets in. It's funny how these guys will describe their ideal woman as "the girl next door" - someone who's pretty and takes care of her appearance, but who isn't just that; there's way more to her than the "outside".

There seem to be a lot of different - and different kinds - of reasons women will latch onto the idea of and turn into a need, being in a relationship. Not all of them are "bad", to my way of thinking... or selfish & self-interested, at the expense of a guy. Not everyone is made in such a way, that they can live alone - be without a relationship - for a long time. Maybe it's biological thing, too. It really helps to know what your need is and to review that every so often, even if it's not something you discuss with a current "guy". If it's a guy who's mostly "right"... you could probably talk to him about it, without setting off his "break up" alarms. His perception could be very helpful to you, again - if it's a guy who's mostly "right" for you and whom you trust.

One mistake I made, that sabotaged my relationships/marriages, was that I unconsciously expected the guys to fill that hole of the mom I wished I'd had... my "ideal" mom. Big mistake!   ;)   I wasn't aware, at the time, that this is what I was doing or needing. That came only years later and with the help of T. What's wrong about it, is that a romantic relationship is different from the mother-child relationship by miles and miles. Apples & oranges. Not only that - but guess how many guys could live up to that need I had of the "ideal mom"?? In typical beat head on brick wall style, I kept trying... and always, I would realize that damn hole just wasn't getting filled by this particular guy... and then I was on the search for the next one. Once I started to realize my expectations weren't fair or suited to the type of relationship... things got easier. Guys have "radar" for this kind of thing, too - especially if they've been hurt before. They'll run before you do, if there is the slightest evidence that some unconscious scripting of the present, is going on.

The other problem connected to the above attempt to find someone to fill the role of "ideal mom"... is that, well - my real mom scared me so badly that she caused serious emotional issues for me. I can't relax, can't let down my guard, can't enjoy a relationship... as long as it's bearing any resemblance to a mother-child relationship, where I'm not the mom or where boundaries aren't clear and respected. My poor patient hubby has been waiting years for me to finally figure this out, you know? Giving me my space... though he's not shy about telling me, in many ways, that he doesn't like it and it's not fair. He's right - it's not. (I do have to make this up to him, you know? I owe him.) Yet somehow, we still work well together.

Clear up your relationship with your mom - get those boundaries in place and make no exceptions!! - and I think you'll find that you'll also see the guys and those kinds of relationships in a whole different light. It will get easier, if you have the "mom" problem solved first.

</end mommy-lecture> 

** My Ds & I have always called this kind of historical example, experiential lessons & advice "mommy-lectures". I try to be as honest as I can about me... and if I'm not, they're allowed to tell me so! and also question my logic, premises, etc. They are allowed to flat-out disagree, too. This kind of "socratic method" of letting them be adults and choose for themselves, is finally turning out well - for them. And it lets us both recognize that we can love each other and still different people who believe and choose to do, differently. It is one of the characteristics I would design into my "ideal mom", if I could.

sKePTiKal:
OH HON... you're so brave!! Really... I'd no more let my mom stay with me, than invite a bunch of armed crazies to my house for a pool party! I'd need valium - and I'd have to bribe a hotel, to even put up with her, too. The last hospital she was in wanted to see her go, too... and she was sedated then and STILL a problem. I'm REALLY that allergic (mentally/emotionally) to my mom... even though I'm more reassured than ever that she can't really hurt me anymore.

Remember - the magic word - is NO. And ever since you were a teen, you were well within your rights to tell mom NO about WHO you are. How she feels about it is HER problem - not yours. You only own your own feelings & foibles. She has to fix or deal with her own. Give all the crap you took inside you that she put there... and "give it back". Even if this is just a quiet time mental exercise... it'll help you with the boundary stuff.

On the body-image stuff - I like where you're coming from. It sounds like you're getting pretty comfortable with your body, how you dress, etc. I can really relate... having worn platforms and skirts up to there, too (many, many years ago)! At a deep level, I "beat up on myself" for allowing myself to have gained weight, on the downside of "middle age". My inner-Twiggy is still having a tantrum, that she will never, ever and no way, no how wants to look like her mom... who has been overweight as long as she can remember back... and that would be 1958. So... a couple weeks ago, my D had a big-city, engagement party in a hipster area. Her friends are all artists, musicians, theater-folk. We were meeting his parents, too...

needless to say... I bought 4-5 different "looks" in my insecure indecision of what I wanted to feel like and project via my clothes. As if it mattered!! The place was pretty dark... and my D let everyone off the hook by saying there wasn't any dress code and even she was thinking of wearing jeans (she didn't; she looked amazing!!) So I ended up wearing what I thought I would wear - before shopping - a pair of tight stretchy jeans, cami & long, sheer tunic... and flats! And it was "just right" - my D could be the obvious star, I didn't look hopelessly frumpy or unsure of myself... nor did my look compete with hers for attention. I blended in, pretty well which was just what I wanted. I was jealous of Hubs - he decided what he would wear, right before we left; it wasn't that important to him, at ALL...

I most definitely "get it", about the body-image stuff! Here's a question for you - when you have a chance to get back here - maybe you know (I don't)... is it common for sexual assault victims, to have these kinds of image issues? For me, I guess, no matter how I look, I just don't "feel" completely comfortable with my look (especially since I do resemble mom - even before we get to how many extra pounds I've gained). I'm trying to decide if there are 2 parts to this, for me - the obvious "mom" one, and perhaps something more primal with the other one. What do you think?

Redhead Erin:
Your mom is coming to STAY with you---my goodness, you're brave!

About your dating expert friend---are you sure she didn't mean something more along the lines of "present yourself in your best light, with the body you have NOW, and don't worry so much about attaining a physical ideal"...?  That seems more like something a dating expert would tell you. 

I can attest to the fact that women who present themselves well are FAR more attractive than women who have "perfect" bodies but either have lousy attitudes or seem as if they have a lot of baggage or don't seem to care about themselves.

nolongeraslave:
The visit went well for the most part.  She helped me decorate my place, which looks very comforting and relaxing now.  

She did make a few off color comments, such as "You look great and you lost a lot of weight, but you could lose another 5 lbs."     I was able to let it go though. I don't know how, but I was able to observe it and let it go.  I noticed that she also let it go and changed the subject when I didn't react to her.  

I tried something that was helpful to me that some people wouldn't expect. When my mom preached, I said "Okay, mom. I will think about it.  Yes, mom." IT WORKED! It shut her up and she didn't have to overpower me.    Even though I verbally agree with her, I can do the opposite with my actions. She can't literally physically force me to do something.     She was trying to lend me clothes that I didn't like. I kept saying "Thank you, but not this time". She then said I was stubborn, but I ignored it.  She never mentioned it again during the weekend.

This technique may not work for everyone, but I know that aggressively setting boundaries and trying to get my way makes things worse. We both end up feeling frustrated and angry.    

When I dropped her off at the airport, I cried a lot.  I had a lot of bad memories come up in my head, but there were memories of other people and not her.  I think that was my mind's way of coping. I had to "shut myself off" when she was here, but all of my emotions released when she left.


She also said "You're really confident now. I'm really proud that you live on your own now", which I'm surprised to hear.  Since I broke up with a man that she didn't like, she may have a hidden agenda.     The visit is done with and I can go back to living undisturbed.

Hopalong:

--- Quote ---I was able to let it go though. I don't know how, but I was able to observe it and let it go.  I noticed that she also let it go and changed the subject when I didn't react
--- End quote ---

This is really impressive to me, NLAS!

Maybe one way of setting healthy boundaries is also setting them with oneself.
You chose to NOT be reactive and to NOT "take the bait" by having a big emotional reaction to her obsessive remarks.

And then, later, when it was safe and appropriate, you let your feelings and grief about her compulsion (and how it affected you) come out.

I think this all sounds pretty huge. A big step in being real. Being yourself, not a twinging membrane of percussive reaction.

You stayed in charge of yourself and did not let her problems (her limits) overtake you.

Kudos!

Hops

Hops

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