Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: bigalspal on July 03, 2007, 06:05:17 PM
-
Hi folks,
Let me explain what I mean.
I meet a total stranger & after we've talked 5 mins, they know my whole life story!
Warts & all! My husband has been mystified by this for 15 years.
It really is inappropriate & very unsafe in today's world.
When I was in treatment (for pain pill addiction) the dr told my aunt that I "weave a web of words".It was family week & my 2 aunts came to support me. Of course my N mother refused to participate.
I think I feel if I tell you EVERYTHING, surely you'll find SOMETHING to like about me.
I just got back from the store & I did it again! Told the clerk everything about my day & how I was gonna spend the 4th. I sure wish I could get a handle on this. It could be dangerous!
How about you folks. Do you do this too?
Thank goodness for this board! I've been reading through the old posts & really getting some relief.
Finally, I have a voice!
Love to all,
Bigalspal
-
Dear Bigal pal,
BTW,is the 'Pearl" in your quote - Jesus?
I know what you mean by talking too much.I have all these same things ,too,so I am "talking" to myself as well as you. I think that it is several things. One is a desperation to be liked .It is a huge fear of disapproval and anger. It is like a gerbil running on a wheel. We are trying to out run rejection.
The other thing is a lack of a strong inner core . A strong core would provide us with a buffer from outside pain and rejection.Our buffer would be a sense that we are O.K. even if others don't approve of us.
I think that it is basically fear and pain. When ,we get whole, it should really diminish. I think that for me, the old tapes that you mentioned in another post are a big part of the problem. The tapes are always telling me that I deserve nothing b/c I am such a despicable person. I really just want to go in to a hole and give up. It hurts so much to be combating all this pain. For me, the pain is worse in relationships than superficial settings. It is awful with woman. My friend, Maria, is the sweetest girl you could ever meet,but I feel all these things with her. She just supernaturally loves me.It was really hard today b/c I am fighting this huge war with these tapes and i am discouraged Love Ami
-
Hi Ami,
I'm so sorry you feeling bad today. I had one of those days yesterday & you really helped me.
I guess that's the way it works.
The "Pearl" is The Black Pearl. Capt Jack's boat in Pirate's of the Caribbean.
My quote is what Jack says when he's asked about freedom.
I am a Christian, though. I do pray every night to be released from this hell I'm in. I think he granted my request. He brought me you & all the other gentle, kind people on this board. Sweet freedom!
I read about "Magical Thinking" on this board & I know that's what I'm doing with my icon of Capt. Jack. I just sail away on the Black Pearl with him when I feel stressed. I guess it really doesn't hurt to do that. I'll just make sure & monitor myself in the future. Maybe I just shouldn't take my self so seriously! :lol:
Ami, do you want to talk about your day? I'd be GLAD to listen. I know I'll need you again soon!
Your friend,
Bigalspal
-
THANK YOU.Bigalspal
I am hurting.
I can't stop these tapes of worthlessness. My friend,Maria,is wonderful,but she does not understand how my mother has poisoned me.. It is like cancer that eats away at you --inch by inch.I am a poisoned person Maria said that you have to "forgive".DAH-- I know that.
I hope that this is just a stage. I am so angry that I could kill her over and over again a thousand times. I REALLY want her to go in to Hell- literally. I just have buckets full of hate. I have an ocean full of hate. . She used to say, Everyone abuses their kids."
I just hate her face and her smirk. When I saw what she did- about blaming me for being a victim when SHE was the one abusing me, I snapped. I see how she used all her intelligence and psychobabble to try to take away my reality and make me insane. She is trying to make me mentally ill. She was disappointed when my son starting doing well,emotionally, in college. She loved it when he was having a bad time .she is jealous that I have a trained dog, when she screwed up the dog,too.I am just FILLED with hate.
I don't know what to do at this stage. I wrote that post about punishing myself. I am hoping that I am "working" through this pain and will find peace at the end.
I hope that someone can relate Love Ami
-
Ami, oh sweetie!
I know EXACTLY what you are feeling! I, too, am filled with RAGE!!! I want her dead! She abused me horribly! But, then, my faith sneaks in & I guess I'm supposed to forgive. What a emotional rollercoaster! Up down, Up down! GOD does say we are not to be "door mats" And I've read on this board that many religious scholars say we can't honor that which in unhonorably. Oh, my head hurts!
I think the reason I don't go NC with her is that I know for a fact she will never contact me. It is always her way. So...if I go NC on her I will never get to be "mommy's little girl" Which I know will never happen anyway. But...I'm a child of hope. I have made through this world on just that ONE word! HOPE! ARRRRGGG!
Ami, we just have to hang in there TOGETHER! ALL of us!
Thank you DR. Grossman for starting this board. I might rage here, but I know it's a safe place. Unlike my childhood. I feel like a balloon. With the hate slowly hissing out of me. Will I ever recover. I doubt it. BUT...I am getting better!
Love,
Bigalspal
-
I HAVE had some good things happen as a result of facing the things that i have faced prior to this. Yesterday, I saw that I had CHOICES. I never realized that I could chose anything. Today, I realized that I could choose friends. I just "took" whoever came my way, in a sense.I decided that I wanted to make Maria --family. I told her that I was going to "love" her the way that I love my kids---freely and honestly..IOW, I was going to be real and not try to be perfect. I will let her in to my heart and if I get "screwed". so be it". If she hurts me--- so be it. This is new for me. It is SO painful to have an ongoing relationship with a woman. It is painful to my body and soul. It really is,but I am going to let someone in and chose who it is-- not just take "anybody"
So, I am getting better. It just hurts today--- working through this anger and feelings of self punishment Love Ami
-
Hi bean! Another new friend!
Hey Ami & Bean & all the other women out there.
Check this out!
http://www.mtoomey.com/theshamed.html
I found this in another post on this board. Powerful stuff!
I believe it is true in many ways.
It gave me chills.
Bigalspal
PS: Ami, I don't have but one or two women friends. And one of them is an N. Been friends with her for 9 yrs.
Nice lady most of the time, but very selfish. It's just another one of my patterns I have to break.
I do get LOTS of support from my Aunt. I LOVE HER!
-
BGP,
Uhmmm. We humans are strange critters! I'm the opposite of you. I don't talk very much. I often second guess myself when I think I've talked too much. Sometimes I keep quiet when I really shoud speak up. Since I'm the opposite, I can't really speculate about how to help you stop talking so much, but if you have any tips that will help me talk more, I'll listen. :)
I like what the others have to say. I don't think we've ever discussed this topic on VESMB. Thanks for the thread.
Big smiles and a friendly handshake to you.
tt
-
Hi Teartracks!
You are right on, Sister!
We are strange critters!
I wish I had the secret of my big mouth to share with you. I just open it & out comes the flood!
You know I really do get defensive when people tell me I talk too much. There's that "tape" again.
I KNOW I talk to much. They don't have to tell me that.
I can do the out of body thing, & to my horror I "see" myself babbling on & on & on.
Oh, well. You know what? I'm gonna start telling myself I have great communication skills & leave it at that! LOL!
I used to get paid for it. I was a announcer on the radio until May 10. 2006.
I quit because I was at a small station for almost 9 yrs & made no money. But, I had fun!
Your friend,
Bigalspal
-
Bean- Thanks so much for understanding what a HUGE step it is to let someone in. I have been really
honest with Maria when she tells me about her life. I was always afraid to be honest. Today, I told her that I thought that she was putting too much pressure on her older D.I bring this up just to say that I used to be a "yes" man but I decided that she was "family" to me and i would treat her as family--- honest and real.She appreciated it b/c A real answer is so much better than a "fake" on-- even of you are wrong--at least you are giving your best shot.I want to love someone and let some one in-( other than my kids)-- If she hurts me--so be it..It feels so good to decide that you will care. Today, when she came over,I made her a glass of natural,fresh apple juice( from the juicer) and a cup of organic Mexican coffee.I wanted to love and serve someone. I have been so afraid to give. I just wanted to stay in a 'ball' and not risk hurt.Maria is special. I am choosing to bring her in to my life and it feels like I am a real person making a decision,NOT an N's garbage pail.Also, we can discuss things that would cause most people to get in to a fight. Anyway, I have decided to risk and it is a HUGE step.
However, I think that I will confine my deep feelings about N's to you,guys. People who don't have N's don;t get that you just can't "get over it"
Bigalspal--- Thanks for your understanding and validation
Thank you to all the greatest cyberspace buddies Love Ami
-
I do that sometimes because I feel relatively guilty and obligated to provide information if asked. People generally ask and I generally answer, as a rule.
I'm tired of feeling obligated and guilty so..... I've started taking the position of "observer" in the world. I observe myself and how I'm feeling first. I validate myself and concentrate on wha's making me feel the way I'm feeling.
I've started paying attention to my feelings...... to stopping the anxiety before it takes over my thought processes.
I focus and I pay attention to my surroundings, the light, the temperature. I seek out pleasure and identify it. I focus on positive things and expect to be approached by bad people, as well as nice people. I don't assume anything about anyone. Taking the position of an observer is new for me.
When I'm approached, I slow down and continue to think/observe, not react. I've grown to expect that the people who are typically bold enough to come up and insist on gaining my attention and compliance, are generally controlling self entitled pushy people I need to handle. I don't need to please and entertain them. I don't feel complelled to please them anymore.
If I talk too much to a cashier or someone I run accross, who isn't seeking my attention, maybe I'm feeling a bit manic and need to discharge some of that energy to someone else? I feel like I'm doing that sometimes. Maybe it's ME seeking out the attention from someone? I've noticed it's never anyone who would feel entitled to it, it's always someone who wouldn't approach me with a self entitled air about them.
-
Hi lighter,
That's some good advice! I need to become an observer, too. SLOOOOW down.
I'm sure the reason I talk all the time & tell strangers intimate details is that I never felt "heard".
You know, I've read alot of posts where NMothers wring their hands & demand attention from their kids. But I absolutely cannot relate to that! My NMother is stone cold. I can't remember EVER having a conversation with her. Never. Oh, there were PLENTY of words spoken. All one- sided. In anger or coldness. Just no normal human interaction. I'm sure that's why I talk talk talk. Look at me. SEE me. I'm HERE! I matter! My loving aunt always tells me. "You belong on the earth." "You have a right to exist." I know I am sooooo lucky to have that support. I know it & I feel it. BUT...it's not from the one who matters. And I have a double whammy. My bio dad took off when I was 9 months old. Can't say I blame him. Just wish that when I called him at age 24, that he didn't try to stick his tongue down my throat. He's been dead along time now. I can't say I care. We never bonded anyway. ARRRGGG!! Such is the cruelty of humans. To their own flesh & blood.
All that being said, for the first time it doesn't seem as important that "she" hears me. You know why? It's because of this board. WOW! I finally have been "Heard". THANK YOU!
I love you guys!
Bigalspal
-
Another thought.... as an INFP I strive for authenticity in my life. My reality must reflect my inner self and feelings and vice a versa. I can imagine that you're probably a very honest human being who wants people you come in contact with to get the real you, warts and all, (and then judge you worthy or reject you?) I know I want an honest opinion based on the facts, not on my version of them.
I definately can give a rundown of my situation rapidly and fluidly, warts and all, and my T said he'd never gotten so much information in such a short span of time from a client before. I tend to tell just as much about my warts, maybe more, than the beauty marks, kwim?
-
I get a lot of support from this board also. I don't know if I'd be doing as well as I am, to tell you the truth, without it.
You're articulate and I hear you, pal.
Keep posting and growing..... we're here for you.
-
dear Bigals pal,
How are you doing today? Love Ami
-
Hi Ami,
Happy 4th! Thanks for asking.
I'm doing so much better. My husband is a truck driver & is stuck out on the road. But that's really OK. We've been married a long time & we are used to being apart on holidays.
He has never missed a Christmas, though!
We talk on the phone for hours! Most everyday since I've been off on WC.
If I go back out on the truck with him, it's really great. Remember I just starting teaming with him last year. It was a minor adjustment for him & a BIG one for me.
That sleeper in the truck is pretty small! I didn't realize how much STUFF I wanted to take out with me. All in all, it a a positive experience. I was just starting to get the hang on wrangling that BIG truck around when I fell. The money can be outrageous!
My last 3 paychecks AFTER taxes, (before I fell) were over $800! Per week!
Plus, HIS check! But, you give up soooo much for that life & that money.
We had just bought a new house & a new car & I missed both terribly.
I missed my TV shows. I missed my bed & my own shower.
But, I've seen sunsets in Florida, Mountain ranges in Colorado, the desert in Arizona. You name it, I saw it. We have a laptop in the truck so I can keep in touch with my new friend on this board if & when I go back out. I'm thinking I will, but I'm not sure yet. I have a few more months to make up my mind.
ENOUGH about ME!
How are you, Ami?
How will you spend the 4th?
Love,
Bigalspal
-
I feel really happy today. Last night ,I read a scripture in Job about God making you "whole". I think that God was "speaking" to me that I will be whole ,after all.Then, I will really be able to be a true counselor. I am trained as one now,but don't have much to offer b/c I am still so unhealed.(IMO) Love Ami
-
Hi Ami,
You must be so smart! How in the world did you manage to become a counsellor with a NMother?
It's a wonder that all of us are not in mental institutions.
My hat's off to you, girl! That'd quite an accomplishment.
You don't worry sweetie, you will be healed someday!
We'll do it together. Do you have any family members who "hear" you about your Nmother?
That's the main thing (besides this board) that has helped me. That my family knows now that I'm not crazy. And that just recently happened. And I didn't feel awhole lot of relief until I found this board. I really think there are 2 pieces to my particular puzzle. Acknowledgement from my family, & finding a community of fellow sufferers. Survivors, really!
Think of the poor people who have not made it here. I shudder to think of their misery!
Love,
Bigalspal
-
I am also guilty of talking too much. People always say they find me very friendly, and I am. BUT I give away so much. I think there is a link here with desperatly wanting intimacy and trying to create a pseudo intimacy by revealling all so early...... thoughts
axa
-
Hey guys, Ive definitely had this issue and its anxiety for me, probably anxiety caused by N abuse resulting in zero social/self confidence. Now I am feeling more relaxed and happy with myself this talking too much/over sharing/too much disclosure is diminishing rapidly, I dont feel the need to talk non stop anymore/fill in silences, in fact I make myself stay quiet when in the company of strangers and leave gaps of silence, this either results in both parties staying quiet which is nice and peaceful or its the other party who tries to fill in the silence and not me which is much better.
James
-
Hi James & Axa!
2 new friends. Nice to meet you both.
I so much appreciate all the replies to my post.
James, I'm like you. I feel like I can start to get a handle on it now.
This board has in 3 or 4 days, done more for me than ANYTHING!
Axa, I know you are right as well. I so wanted emotional intimacy with people! Although..there is this LONER side of me as well.
I think the trick is to blend them together!
Ami, did you get my reply to your private message? I ask because I wasn't sure that I was doing it right. And, of course, hoping you are OK.
Love,
Bigalspal
-
Hey bigalspal nice to meet you too :) Yeh this board is fantastic, enables us to kick our own mental booty :P
-
((((((((((bigalpal))))))))))) ((((((((((((Ami)))))))))))))))
I think it is a good sign that you are in touch with your rage. Anger is such an uncomfortable feeling.. I've had to release mine too, so I know how it feels to do so. Its scary to admit. I'm always afraid I'll be admitted (some residual shame left over from my N Mom, I'm sure). It will seep out in toxic ways, on those you love (rather than you N Mom, who deserves it), I believe, if you don't get it out in a way that's not hurtful to anyone. So its a good thing you're working on it, I think.
Naming your rage is the first step. Owning it the second...then comes release.
bean
the key i think might be discerning righteous anger from self righteous anger and too recognizing when frustrating people that frustrate us...the best response is to learn loving rebuke and righteous anger...
the bible says....be angery and sin not
and be slow to anger...
both be good advice...
sayeth i ..a reincarnation of shakespeare..
and yes i confess i was just a front man for sir franci bacon..bastard son of queen liz..he was....
-
Hi Sunny,
Sounds like you love Shakespere as much as I do.
Love the last part of your post!
And I think you are right. We have to own our feelings, but be aware of anger. The WRONG kind of anger. It's just so draining! And it really gets us nowhere.
Guess what you guys?
I talked to my NMother today. She's fighting with the neighbors again. Talking about getting a petition going to kick them out, or something like that. Here's the cool thing. I asked her ONE question :"How do the other neighbors feel about these noisy kids?" She said: "Well, they are just waiting for ME to do THEIR dirty work!"
Which tells me it's HER! That's a BIG break through for me. Being her child, I just could NEVER see when it was HER problem! KWIM? I just made little consolling noises & it was actually a pleasant conversation! I didn't feel the anxiety in the pit of my stomach. I just let her talk.
That was a first! I actually didn't feel bad taliking to her. You might think it was because the focus was on her neighbors instead of me. But, that's only partly true. This board has freed me from alot of crap I felt about my mother. WOW! And, I know ONE thing. I'm NOT gonna be controlled by her anymore. She doesn't feel bad, I do! How stupid is that???
Love,
Bigalspsal
-
Hi Sunny,
Sounds like you love Shakespere as much as I do.
Love the last part of your post!
And I think you are right. We have to own our feelings, but be aware of anger. The WRONG kind of anger. It's just so draining! And it really gets us nowhere.
Guess what you guys?
I talked to my NMother today. She's fighting with the neighbors again. Talking about getting a petition going to kick them out, or something like that. Here's the cool thing. I asked her ONE question :"How do the other neighbors feel about these noisy kids?" She said: "Well, they are just waiting for ME to do THEIR dirty work!"
Which tells me it's HER! That's a BIG break through for me. Being her child, I just could NEVER see when it was HER problem! KWIM? I just made little consolling noises & it was actually a pleasant conversation! I didn't feel the anxiety in the pit of my stomach. I just let her talk.
That was a first! I actually didn't feel bad taliking to her. You might think it was because the focus was on her neighbors instead of me. But, that's only partly true. This board has freed me from alot of crap I felt about my mother. WOW! And, I know ONE thing. I'm NOT gonna be controlled by her anymore. She doesn't feel bad, I do! How stupid is that???
Love,
Bigalspsal
so was hamlets ma a narcissist and was queen liz... bacons ma a psychopath or narcissist...
clue ....
methinks my lady protesteth too much...
so what do u think ifn shakespeare was just a front man for a secret society of which bacon was the head ..
and bacon was the bastard son of queen liz..
for more info see sirbacon.org :)
oh i have been having some rotten times with what seems like tho some break thru attitudes..
part of dealing maybe with the saturn transits opposite neptune
u know free floating anxiety that can be hard to pin down
first opposition of saturn and neptune was august last year and last one is this 28 year or so cycle was a week or so ago
-
Hi Sunny,
No, I'm leaning towards the Christopher Marlowe theory. But Bacon has definitely crossed my mind. What I really want is to believe ole' Bill wrote everything himself!
Whoever wrote it, I love it!
My favorite is Merchant of Venice. Gotta love Shylock!
I also love Othello & MacBeth.
Heck, I love it all. I just hate when people "modernize" plays like Richard III. I HATE that. I want it set in the time period when it was written.
You sound like you might be a "Rennie". If you are, you'll know what I'm talking about. My husband & I went on our first date to a Faire. Didn't dress up, (still don't) but i always get into it.
Take care,
Bigalspal
-
dear Bigals pal,
I got the message.i was involved with the dogs.( Read my new thread). I think that you have too much on your plate right now to be worrying about other "problems" or dependencies. I am healing-- step by step. It feels really slow ,sometimes, but it is happening. I think that you will ,too. In time,your various problems wil take care of themselves. How do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time.
I think the "medicine" to heal is "you shall know the truth and the truth will make you free."
I think that you are in so much physical pain that it is hard to even address the emotional things as well as you are. I see strength-- not weakness.
It was great what happened with your mother.today. You " saw the truth" and you were"set free" a little bit. I have these same"flashes of intuition". I think that it is Divine guidance.
I am praying for everything to work out well for you Love Ami
-
Hi Ami,
I guess we've been cross posting on 2 different threads. I know how dogs can be. That's full-time job!
I'm glad you are ok. Hell, I'm glad I ok. :mrgreen:
You know, I really like this journey I'm on. I love it when those flashes of divine light penetrate through the fog. Thanks for listening to my personal message & not judging me. Like you said One thing at a time.
Love,
Bigalspal
-
Hi Sunny,
No, I'm leaning towards the Christopher Marlowe theory. But Bacon has definitely crossed my mind. What I really want is to believe ole' Bill wrote everything himself!
Whoever wrote it, I love it!
My favorite is Merchant of Venice. Gotta love Shylock!
I also love Othello & MacBeth.
Heck, I love it all. I just hate when people "modernize" plays like Richard III. I HATE that. I want it set in the time period when it was written.
You sound like you might be a "Rennie". If you are, you'll know what I'm talking about. My husband & I went on our first date to a Faire. Didn't dress up, (still don't) but i always get into it.
Take care,
Bigalspal
well now that last line i believe in the last sonnet of that collection of 150 some of shakespeare..
goes i believe
love's fire heats water, water cools not love...
which i think might in a kind of alchemical symbolism
where the elements of the holy trinity fire air and water.... earth is just of the temporal realm i think
and does not carry over as the other 3 into the eternal infinite realm..
well now how might that line relate to narcissism...
i think could be that
it is about all failed things of one's lower nature where enneagram 3 where narcissism and psychopathy best fit i think
where success that 3 seeks becomes too much of this world tho it might claim to being in this world but not of it...
anyways
love fire heats water
love be about the son of god attitude being of god the fire's creative and purifying nature..
and such kind of heat develops the subconscious as a pure heart... water be symbolic here for emotions subconscious heart etc
and when one's heart or subconscious has been cleansed by the holy spirit
it does not detract from divine love...
-
Hi Sunny,
Boy, you are alot deeper than me! :? But that's not hard to do!
It's funny you wrote about the Enneagram tests. I just took it. I was a 5 on the short version & a 4 on the long test. I believe I am a mixture of the two.
For those folks out there who don't know that is, here's a link.
http://www.similarminds.com/test.html
Try it!
Happy 4th, everyone!
Bigalspal
-
bigalspal,
First, I want to say, may the Lord bless you immensely for being the special person you are. You are one who has endured and is now able to walk through to victory. Bravo for that! You are what we call an INSPIRATION to many, whether you see that yet or not. I love reading your posts; I really do. I sense that such a precious human being is on the other side of them.
You said: I just hate her face and her smirk. When I saw what she did- about blaming me for being a victim when SHE was the one abusing me, I snapped.
I notice this about my husband as well. When I start yelling about something that is just not right...bills not getting paid, spending my days working a concessions business that brings home about $20 per day, the fact that he goes around looking like a slob and doesn't care...when I yell at him about these things (after trying to talk in a normal voice to which he responds "huh? speak up I can't hear you! but he refuses to have his hearing tested and wear a hearing aid if he needs one)...when I finally yell at him, he sits there with a smirk on his face and then looks up at me so innocently and says "calm dowwwwwwwwwwn, what are you getting so upset over." (and he says it in a really sloooooooooooooooooow way that makes me almost dizzy if that even makes sense.
I have sensory issues with things that go round and round, are repetitive or very very sloooooooooow. I also have trouble with putting my thumb and forefinger around a cylinder-shaped object without feeling really creepy and wanting to run away. I know that sounds strange but it's time to be transparent and maybe even begin a new thread on sensory issues.
-
Hi Bigalspal,
Coming in a bit late here -
I read the topic of your thread – how to stop talking so much, and I thought to myself WOW I wish I could talk a lot. I am the opposite. I don't talk enough (can write a book – but in the 3D world I am very, very quiet).
I love meeting people who can talk a lot. I love listening to their stories, and it makes social interaction for me a lot easier.
My first reaction was that I don't think you should try to stop this – this is a wonderful gift. But you are right, it could be dangerous. Is there a way you could allow yourself to talk, but censor only that information that could be dangerous?
An example would be that if you are going on vacation, you could talk about your vacation plans, with the exception of giving out any details of departure dates? Something to that effect?
Don't know if this is making sense – but for me, people who have the gift of conversation are a breath of fresh air!!!
Peace
-
Hi Finding Peace,
I REALLY like your username. Isn't that what we all want.
Thanks for the kind words.
I am going to try to be careful without losing who I really am. My sweet husband always says he love the way interact with people. He just wants me to be careful.
I'm sorry if it took me awhile to answer your post.
I've been on a voyage with Capt. Jack for a couple of hours. Getting ready for part 2. (Check out my Icon). I really think a little "magical thinking" has been earned by all, don't you think? :wink:
Hope you had a good 4th!
Bigalspal
-
Thank you-- S and S
You are right. It seems to be dissipating, naturally,if I just let it be. Love Ami