Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Lupita on December 15, 2007, 10:18:47 AM
-
I decided to make another thread since the other took a different direction. Which is OK. That is why we are here. It does not matter.
From Observer:
The problems with Dr. U, other teachers, your son and mother, do you think that these are just the frustrations of life? That things are imperfect and frustrate us? Of course things could be better and we can make things better (improve our relationships, find a better job, etc), but some things take time to improve and some things we cannot improve and our happiness or wisdom lies in knowing the difference between the two.
I think one of my goals in healing is to learn to live with and tolerate my frustrations and disappointments and not let them drive me crazy or depress me. There’s a wonderful saying (I think it is Buddhist) that “Pain is Inevitable, but Suffering is Optional”. We know that life brings pain, but whether we SUFFER due to the pain is sometimes our choice. My therapist told me about her patients who are dying of cancer, yet they are happy for each day they are alive. That gave me a lot of perspective. This is related to what I meant when I said to you about thinking about your philosophy of life.
Thank you Observer, I am aware I am discounting the positive. All black and white, no shades, generalization, personalizing, emotional reasoning, fortune telling and mind reading.
I was very mad at the world because my mother accepted my son taking his girlfriend to her house and she has never allowed me to take anyone, not even a female friends, she said do not bring a woman that is going to flirt with my husband, etc. And my son told me, she will say yes to me. My son robbed it in my nose. My son told me she does not want any guest from yours, but she will take it from me. The girlsfriend mother is so ignorant, and she came to the airport and she told me how come you do not get along with tour mother, what did you do to her, and that really triggered me.
I am playing the cantata in church, more than 100 pages. Very stressful.
At least I recognize that I have nice things and the joy is not there it goes away.
My mother told my son that he is welcome and she write me e mails complaining of his visit, I tell my son and now my son and the girls friend mother doubt me. They don’t understand that the things that my mother tells me she only tells me. Nobody else.
Nobody believes me. How could this woman tell me that why I do not do something to gain to earn the love of my mother, she is so stupid.
Dear Lighter, I do not have energy to think of other jobs. Simply cannot.
I wanted to teach younger children. There is a position open in a school close to my house, I drive one hour to where I work, and the head master told me that it is unethical that she would interview me when I work for another school, that they do not still teachers from each other. So they can fire me when they want but I cannot even apply to another school.
Anyway, I am teaching a piano lesson right now. Be back later.
Please do not tell me to open a piano academy, I have tried that before they fight for students.
I am starting getting frustrated. I know you are trying to help, it is my fault. I feel trapped.
I wish I had somebody to offer a job to me. Like from the sky. Like the piano job I gut from the church. They just called me. I did no look for it.
-
((((((((((((Lupita))))))))))))))))
-
Bornfree said that frustration is a result of not getting what we want. So here I am pouting and crying because my son's girlfriend's mother has no idea what my situation is and here she is judging and telling me what to do, and because my mother does not love me the way I would have wanted.
The boos says, it might be better if......... etc. But it did not happen that wat. So, how much good do I do to my self by suffering for that.
I know, the books says it. Very explicitly. I just cant do it. But the fact that I see it and understand it it is progress.
Gracias Obeserver.
Something else that triggers me very badly is that some people tels me that "I am fine because I have God in my heart, you feel bad because you do not have God in your heart" I hate when somebody tells me that. That is very troggering to me.
Like the book says, it would be better if people did not tell me what I do not want to hear, but they do, so what good does it do to me to be suffering for what people tell. I cannot control what people say. They can say whatever they want. I can disreargd it or ignore it if I do not like it. But not suffer for it.
I am trying. I am awya from that woman since two hours ago and I am still very mad because she told me that I shousl earn the love of my mother. She has absolutly no idea what she is talking about. She is so ignorant.
-
Observer, where are you? I need you.
-
Lup...
earn the love of my mother
?? :shock:
Not terribly understanding, that "friend" of yours.
I think you need to let go of the hope that your mother can love you better.
I wonder if when she was a child somebody taught her that witholding affection, constant criticism, and putting a child down was "good for the child." Yarks.
You yearn for it, but you can't earn it.
"It" isn't something your mother knows how to do. So she's not witholding anything. She doesn't have healthy nurturing affirming mother love locked in her jewelry chest. Just old beads in there.
How are you doing with her mean emails, Lu? Do you still get those in your Inbox every few days, with critical mean messages?
love to you,
Hops
-
I know that Hops, it is that lady, the girlfriend mother who told me that. She told me that I should earn the love of my mother. That is why I posted today so frustrated and mad and upset and sad. And my son is so in love with her daughter. That woam triggers me very much. I have to get away of her. On top I have to spend Chrsitmas with her because it was a previous commitment.
The e mails, I am not writing to her now beause I am so mad that she told yes to my son. Not because I am mad that my son takes his girlfriend, but mad about the inequality. Mad that it is only me. Only to me. So I have not written to her. In sevral days.
On top she wriotes me complaining about my son visit. Her back hurst because of driving him, etc. I forwared to my son all her e mails.
But I am going backwards, I should pay attention to observer. No no no, should statement again, it would be better if I did not duffer for things i cannot control.
Thank you hops. I am needy right now.
-
Dear, very dear Lighter, It is easy for me to see how you feel. I could tell you what to do. I cannot solve my own problems but when I see others I think I see it correctly. Of course I mgith be wrong.
I think you are looking for affirmation. You are looking fro validation. But since here we are all victims of Nism, we did not receive it so we do not know how to give it.
So, you are getting frustrated because you are not receiving the so much needed validation.
The only thing i can tell you is that your posts have been very helpful to me. Many times I come just looking for your responses. Even if I tell you that I do not have the energy to look for another job, maybe I need somebody to show me like a kindergarde child. But I do appreciate your posts and there was a time when I thought you had a degree in psychology because you were so accurate in your analysis.
I guess if you can help one person, it is worth it to stay and I really want you to stay and keep helping me even if I fight with you, it would be like the fights with my son, I fight with my son and I never sotp loving him.
So, the only thing I can tell you, please do not leave here because of another person. Do not do what I do. I need you.
God bless you.
-
Lupita..... I was suggesting that you do a little research into the HOMESCHOOLING aspect of teaching.
Not the options you've already familiarized yourself with.
I'm actually thinking about that route myself..... maybe you could research it a little for me... and yourself?
Again.... if you had 4 to 8 students.... different ages but younger than highschool..... get paid better and have the appreciation and cooperation all the parents involved.... the cooperation of your students..... would that be better?
you're very well qualified and you speak many languages.... educated. Bright. Active and you love to dance, lol.
You sound like someone who might be sought out and appreciated in another arena of teaching..... I think it's worth it to do some research.
ps I wasn't yelling when I typed caps... I just want you to understand I wasn't talking about another job teaching 30 kids for low pay in a class room. Teachers in private schools aren't paid what they're worth, IMO. Eh.... are any of them?
-
No, I am waiting ofr a public position to open to apply. I want to go back to public schools with reirement plan and benefits, good isurance, and much higher salary.
-
Hola Mi Amiga,
I think you are doing MUY, MUY BIEN :D. I see you have become very conscious of your thinking:
I am aware I am discounting the positive. All black and white, no shades, generalization, personalizing, emotional reasoning, fortune telling and mind reading.
But the fact that I see it and understand it it is progress.
Like the book says, it would be better if people did not tell me what I do not want to hear, but they do, so what good does it do to me to be suffering for what people tell. I cannot control what people say. They can say whatever they want. I can disreargd it or ignore it if I do not like it. But not suffer for it.
I am trying.
But I am going backwards, I should pay attention to observer. No no no, should statement again, it would be better if I did not duffer for things i cannot control.
Dios Mios, Lupita!! Did you write this, or did a serene Zen Buddhist write it??? :lol: Lupita, look at the incredible progress you have made; it’s wonderful!! :D
You have become aware of distorted thinking and you are now conscious of the thoughts you are thinking.
You are aware of how your EMOTIONS affect your THOUGHTS and how your THOUGHTS affect your EMOTIONS.
You have become aware that it is POINTLESS to MAKE YOURSELF SUFFER about things over which you have NO CONTROL.
Congratulations, Lupita!! This is a big and important accomplishment and you achieved it so quickly. Muy, muy bien.
Can you be nice enough to yourself to congratulate yourself and tell yourself that you did a great job? If you had a friend who achieved a goal very quickly, wouldn’t you tell your friend that they did a great job? Can you be a friend to yourself and tell yourself that you did a wonderful job by learning so quickly to identify distorted thinking?
I think you are not recognizing your accomplishment and you are making like it is no big deal, but it is a big deal. So I hope you will celebrate your accomplishment by doing something nice you yourself, just like you would do for a friend. Lupita, please learn to be kind to yourself.
Now, let’s talk about the girl friend’s mother (I will call her “GFM”). I think that the real problem with the GFM is that YOU are letting her IGNORANCE aggravate you. Remember, you have NO CONTROL over the GFM, in fact you have NO CONTROL over anyone EXCEPT YOURSELF. We have no control over other people, we only have control over ourselves.
So, the question becomes, why do you allow GFM, who is obviously an ignorant person, to aggravate you?
Here’s a couple of things I want to say about people like GFM, Dr. U, your mother and all the other annoying people in your life: Use Filters and Boundaries.
First, I think you need to develop a Filter to separate out what is “truthful, relevant and accurate” from what is “bullsh*t, untruthful or inaccurant” when people speak to you.
Lupita, you seem to be treating the “bullsh*t, untruthfulness and inaccuratcy” which GFM said to you AS IF it were “truthful, relevant and accurate”, otherwise, why would you be so upset?
GFM does not know you, she does not know about how much your mother has hurt you, GFM doesn’t know ANYTHING true about your relationship with your mother, so WHY do you give her any credence? GFM doesn’t know squat, right? GFM certainly does not sound sympathetic or kind to you, because if she was, she wouldn’t have said what she did, right?
You are upset because YOU are giving GFM CREDIBILITY which she has not earned and does not deserve.
So, whenever someone says something to you, you must run it through your FILTER in order for you to decide whether the information is CREDIBLE, ACCURATE and RELEVANT and whether you should accept it as TRUTH.
For example, you know that GFM did not take into account your point of view concerning your mother, so WHY would you give credence to what she says? GFM does not understand (or discounts) your feelings, so why give her any credence? If you don't give her credence, then GFM becomes like an annoying little fly that you can shoo away. Of course, don't be hostle or mean to her, but try to ignore her whenever you can.
Likewise, use the filter as your boundary. For example, since you determined that what GFM said to you is “bullsh*t, irrelevant, untruthful and inaccurate”, now put up a Boundary to protect your feelings so that her words do not hurt you.
Try to use this filter and boundary combination for things said to you by Dr. U, your mother and anyone else. Use the filter and boundary combination to protect yourself so that you won’t let these people upset you or hurt you.
This filter and boundary combination is another way of saying trust your intuition, trust your gut. If you think someone is gaslighting you, then trust your intuition because they probably are gaslighting you. So, make a mental note that you will have to filter whatever this person tells you because this person is not trustworthy and then put up a boundary around your feelings so that they CANNOT hurt you. Use your boundaries to protect yourself.
And, if the person is not trustworthy, it’s not worth it to get aggravated over them. Just be very cautious when you are around them and don’t be inclined to believe what they tell you.
I have to go out now. Hope this helped.
PS: Spending Christmas will be a way to test your skills with GFM. On the other hand, do you really want to spend Christmas with her? As I myself heal from N abuse, I've decided that I will try to avoid spending time with people I do not like. I understand that you do not want to hurt your son, but please be true to yourself. Will it drive you crazy to spend Christmas with GFM? Can you handle her? Will you feel guilty if you don't go?
Con mucho amour.
-
Hello Observer,
May I ask, have you posted on the board previously under another name?
For some reason your voice, your way of writing, feels familiar.
You are not obligated to answer, of course.
Would you like to start a thread to share a little about yourself?
What is your living situation now? Are you coupled, on your own, a parent?
Who is the N in your life?
What has worked best for you?
Was there an event or moment when things began to turn?
best,
Hopalong
-
Dear Observer,
Please would you be so kind as to let me know the source or resource regarding your post, so that I may study this subject area.
Truly, would be very much appreciated.
And I feel that I need to know if you are a previous poster under a different name, as that kind of throws me of kilter a bit.
Thank you.
Leah
-
Hi Obeserver-
I agree with Leah, as so often happens.
Thank you,
Changing
-
Dear Observer, thank you for your time. The filter was presented to me by lighter long time ago. But I was at a different stage of development and could not internalize it.
Now that I can identify my thoguhts I am in a better position to think about filters. In fact I am filtering discounting the positive.
She is not a bad person, she bought me flowers for my birth day and gave me a gift card for an apartmemt store. Also, for some reason, she calls me and wants to spend time with me. We went dancing one night and she paid everything. She lost her husband fo thirty years, three years ago. She did not have a mother, she was raised by a very selfish stepmother and run away from hom at 19. But she drives me crazy, she is very controling, she wants to say what everybody is going to do. She triggers me. But I wish i was a mature person and handle it gracefully. If I could. I see her as a threath because I think she is stilling my son. I am afraid that my son will spend more time with her than with me. She is also worried for her daughter.
Now, why, if I know that she is not totally bad, that she is worried about her kid, that she is good with my son, etc. I still feel she drives me crazy for one thing she said? I know why. She pushed a very hurting botton, and she has money, and she invites my son constantly to restaurants which I cannot do.
I will study my book more, and will prepare for Chrsitams with her. I will consider it an exercise.
Again, filtering. It now works with my students. They say "this is stupid" "this is retarded" and I was hurting becasue my students did not appreciate my work. Of course, they do not want to work. It took me severla years of teaching to understand that I do not have to feel bad becuase teen agers do not want to work. Now it is automatic. When they say this is stupid I say, "well, too bad, if you wantcredit for it you have to do it" and I do my best to not angage with students in discussions. I tell them I am here to teach you foreign language and not to debate about controversial issues. But it took me ten years to get to this point.
So the filtering my mother and friends so I can have a social life "normal" so i can go out with friends and not feel triggerd by every single sh*t they say, I have to train my self. Little by little.
You knw something. just writing here to you, i feel motivated.
People tell me, go volunteer, and if I do not do it I get punished. i have friends, people want to be with me. But I run away all the time because something they say. I have been running all my life. I had to stop going to a very nice book club because I did not know how to deal with a couple of Ns there. They troggered me so badly.
But I am going to find Ns everywhere. According to a book i red recently 8% of people are Ns. So if I go to a group of ten, at lieast one will be an N. Then that person tells me something triggering and I come back home crying and do not go back there again.
I wasted the best opportunity of my life years ago of an important scholarship in research because I could not deal with the N supervisor. They banned me from that because of leaving in the middle of a project.
My life has been ruined up until now because I cannot deal with Ns.
Just last night. Choir rehearsal. They brought a new director, she is very knolegeable, college professor, but a horribel diva. The people there love me, but I am almost about to resign if she stays. So, I am just about to do it again. I know she will treat me like sh*t. She just did it last night. But all choir directors are like that. if I want to play in a choir I have to deal with the choir director.
So, I analized my feelings like you said in the other thread, and founf out that all my depression from yesterday was because of the cantata and the new director. I knew that hse was going to be bad to me. I was afraid. It happened, and I do not feel as bad today.
Thank you for talking to me in a way that I do not feel judged, critizied, and punished. Thank you for talking to me in a way that does not make me feel triggered.
As you said before because of your years of therapy, you are very knowlegeable person. God bless you and Muchas Gracias.
Looking forward to see your responses.
-
Observer, I came out with something else very important!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
She bought me flowers for my birthday and took me out etc. That makes her feel the right to hurt me. That is the confusing thing of some Ns. They do nice things to you so you stay and put up with thier sh*t. My mother did that to me all the time. And she always said "after I have given you roof over your head, feed you, lower your fever when you had meassles, etc etc " then she kicks me in the face with very hurting things.
That is why this woman treggers me so badly. She is just like my mother. When I try to have a conversation with her daughter she answers, she does not let the girl answer. The girl is totally mute in fron of her mother.
I need to learn how to deal with these kind of people so i do not run away anymore.
It is so important not to run away!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Of course if we are not prepared for the problem we will get overwhelmed but I have to try. I have one week till Christmas, with the book and your help, I will make it a usccessful visit.
-
No, I am waiting ofr a public position to open to apply. I want to go back to public schools with reirement plan and benefits, good isurance, and much higher salary.
Ok.... but I'm not sure that you wouldn't be able to get all those things in a homeschooling position with the right group. I just think it wouldbe so wonderful to go to the beach for a week long lab and have everyone set up on laptops so they can work at their own faster pace and it just sounds like 100's of time the work could be completed in the time it takes to shuffle all those kids around and teach to the middle of the class over text books.
You sound better today though..... ((lupita))
-
Hi Observer, I played the cantata. Was not perfect but very beautiful. I am proud of my self. They gave me flowers. The choir director told me I was a very good pianist. The choir did an excellent job. I know I was not following her, too difficult music to be able to take my eyes away from the musci sheet. I feel so much better. Exhausted.
Lighter, it is too much trouble. Licenses, special exits, fire department has to aprove your home, neighbors do not like cars coming to leave kids, etc. If a kid gets hurt you are in big trouble. No nono no. I do not want to get involved in that. I give piano lessons at home. Just have a couple. Not easy to get students. Many piano teachers. But I remember that few years ago a kid hurt him self in my house with a piece of wood that came out of a piece of furniture. Only because God is big and protected me, the mother was very understanding, but I could have had huge problems. Nor only that, but sometimes kids invent fantasies and unless you have a union like in public schools you are in huge trouble. They give more credibility to the kid than to an honest teacher.
-
Hi Lupita,
You are another person that I wanted to tell that I do read your posts when I get on the board. Every once in a while I add a
comment, as with your citizenship, and the other day, on the post you made that you said took a different turn.
I am glad that you find certain posters to be of help to you, and I see you learning to apply cognitive principles.
The other thing I want to say is Merry Christmas to you, Lupita.
cats paw
-
Cats!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thank you so much. I love this thing of cognitive therapy. It makes you feel better almost immediately.
And Feliz Navidad.
-
I'm so glad to hear you're feeling better,
and that you've used your music to lift your heart.
(((((((((Lupita)))))))
love to you,
Hops
-
Me too, ((((( Lupita )))))
Wonderful to * see * the work that you have done in you, from one who loves music also.
So glad that you have connected with Observer, whoever he/she may be, and that all as been evidently to the good, for you.
Sincere love & best wishes to you along your life journey.
Leah
-
I wasn't talking about your home, lol... Lupita.
I was talking about parents homeschooling and hiring a teacher to come in and teach in a classroom environment inside one of the parent's homes.
Homeschooling's a big movement now and I've been considering it for a while. Other parents have thrown in their two cents and made it clear they'd be interested in joining the group if I put one together.
Hiring a full time teacher and bringing in special teacher for a day here and there..... going on trips to shark labs etc.
I'm sorry I haven't been able to make myself very clear but...... I hope you don't mind that I keep trying, lol?
-
I homeschooled my eldest daughter through 3rd-5th, tried with Ndaughter but then put her back in school cause she was too nasty to handle, homeschooled 13 year old through 5th and 6th and she is now being homeschooled by a close friend in 7th grade.
It's a great choice if you really enjoy one on one time with your children and they are cooperative.
~Laura
-
Sorry Lighter, that is not appealing to me. Still waiting for a public school teaching FL to younger students.
Anyway, yes, I am feeling better. Semester exams this week, and two weeks vacation next. Cant be any better.
On January will start again with fears and disappointments of teaching sixth period again. Hopefuly with more skills to deal with it.
Today I identified a thought that was making me feel bad. I thougt of my son getting from my mother all she denied to me. Then I thought, what good does it make to me to be sad. My son will come back in a few days. The girl friend probably will not be his girlfriend for a long time. What good does it make to me to be sad for what my mother did not give me. It is to suffer double. When she refused and now again. No reason for it.
Where are you observer? I need to share this feeling with you.
-
I'm sorry it's still hurts fresh like it did years ago, Lupita.
I think that bc you still have hope that she'll be able to give you the love you deserved.
You wouldn't begrudge your son anything..... but watching your mother give something to him.... that she denied you as her child...... there's bile in that, anyone would have a hard time swallowing.
It doesn't matter if she knows what she's doing to you.
I don't think she can do any better, Lupita.
What matters is that you teach your son to do better and you somehow release the hope that she'll ever be the good kind mama who takes you in her arms and rocks you while she aplogizes and takes it all back.
Cry and keen and let go of the hope, if you can.
Forgive her, if you can.
You're stronger than you know.
-
Dear Lupita,
When I was in my twenties, I had nightmares 3,4 times a week about frustration. It was always the same theme - THEY knew something I didn't know and I had no idea what IT was. I do not believe the frustration is you or about you or because of you. I experience you, here on the board, as highly intelligent and sensitive. It is hard for such intelligent people as yourself to understand why people mistreat you. YOU know your motives; YOU know your heart - why can't they know it as well??? I have read much of the literature that says it is hard for someone of higher intelligence to understand those of less intelligence. Please do not think I am belittling you or anyone in your circle. I just know that it is hard when you are an intellectual. And a highly sensitive person. Have you read the book - The Highly Sensitive Person ? It helped me.
-
Thank you Tow, still reading cognitive therapy, 700 pages. One by one. I work full time, play at a church and teach piano lessons. But That book is in my list. The next after this is the ones recommended by Bornfree about depression.
But I do feel better today. Thank you.
-
Dear ToWrite,
Someone else spoke of that yesterday, Hope you don't mind my asking, do you have the name of the author?
As I had a thought of maybe purchasing a book such as that, as a gift for someone, who is such a sweet sensitive soul, and it may be just the right thing, as she is having an awful time at work, coincidentally.
Thanks, Leah
-
Can't remember, Dear, off the top of my head. Will be glad to look for my copy (if it hasn't disappeared) and let you know. It is a fascinating book, with true stories and all.
-
Thank you, ToWrite, that is so very kind of you, and is appreciated. Love, Leah
-
Today ofr the first time in my life I identified a negative thougt, I identified the feeling provoked by the negative thought and I said to my slef, why to feel bad because my son is with my mother? why to feel bad becayse my son GFM is stilling him? My son can enjoy my mother and his GFM. There is nothing wronf with that. I do not have to feel bad about that. I feel flat now, wich is much better that sad and depreesed.
For me that is a huge step.
-
So, I was driving, feeling very lonly, thinking how muhc fun my son was having at our beaches. But I combated that thought because my grand mother was very bad to my mother and I enjoyed very much being with my grand mother and I cannot prevent my son to enjoy his grand mother. He has the right to enjoy his grand mother. And I do not have to feel bad ofr that, content, because he is healthy adn having fun. I am going to have a drink to celebrate.
-
Lupita,
What a wonderful Christmas present you are giving yourself- a way to find healing.
Cat
-
Flat is better than sad.
I think relief is next.
-
Hola Lupita,
Lo siento that I haven’t answered you sooner, but I am exhausted, mucho cansada. Preparing for the holidays is killing me. Shopping for gifts, trying to finish work before the year ends and on Thursday, I’m going away for 10 days. So, I am frazzled & tired.
Thank you everyone who said such kind words about me.
Lupita!!!! I am so amazed by you!!!!!!! :D :D You have so quickly absorbed this new way of consciously looking at HOW you think. You are wonderful, so intelligent. You are a success.
You’ve been on my mind and I wanted to mention some things to you:
First, check out the Pubic Television station in your area. They are fund raising and in my area are showing Wayne Dyer, who talks about the importance of being consciously aware of our thoughts.
Also, I wanted to turn you on to, what I think, is a helpful web site: http://www.hayhouseradio.com/. It’s very “New Age”, but I think there are some great radio shows to listen to.
Also, I read a post on another board written by a woman called "Oxdrover", who at age 60 has finally come to realize that her mother is a narcissist (http://thepsychopath.freeforums.org/viewtopic.php?t=6843&sid=736caff5e1037a5ab44e25ce4b34a1cf
). I thought you could relate to something she wrote. Here it is:
“ I was actually….laughing at myself for being "60 YEARS OLD FOR GOODNESS SAKE AND WANTING MY MOMMIE'S LOVE"---GOSH you'd think by age 60 I could have blown the witch off sometime in the past…here I am a sniviling, whinning, crying immature little 4 year old crying her eyes out cause "mommie doesn't love me." Because mommie is an N incapable of loving anyone. And to be honest about it, it makes me feel shame that I can't handle this better than I do, that I can't just "blow her off" and get on with it---that I deep inside WANT her love and that there is NOTHING ON THIS EARTH I CAN DO TO GET IT.”
Try to read Oxdrover’s posts. I think she’s great.
This web site focuses on N Mothers and Fathers. Check it out if you’ve never read it: http://thepsychopath.freeforums.org/viewforum.php?f=28&sid=736caff5e1037a5ab44e25ce4b34a1cf
Getting back to you, I am happily stunned at how rapidly you have absorbed this new way of thinking. Obviously, you are extremely intelligent (and talented in music and dance) and I’ve got a feeling that 2008 will be a very successful break through year for you. By the way, I agree: go for a public school job: it’s higher pay & full benefits.
But I run away all the time because something they say. I have been running all my life. I had to stop going to a very nice book club because I did not know how to deal with a couple of Ns there. They troggered me so badly.
But I am going to find Ns everywhere. According to a book i red recently 8% of people are Ns. So if I go to a group of ten, at lieast one will be an N. Then that person tells me something triggering and I come back home crying and do not go back there again.
Lupita, give yourself time to absorb your new way of perceiving other people and processing your reactions and thoughts. You are aware that you run away and you want to stop doing that (however, on the other hand, running away from N people is often a GOOD thing). You’re searching for a new way to express yourself to people who trigger you, while also maintaining your integrity and dignity. I understand. First, decide whether you want to respond to Ns (& triggering people) at all or whether you just want to walk away and avoid them. If you decide to respond to them, first, think before you speak, use “I” statements and express yourself in a soft, non-confrontational way, while remaining true to yourself and your feelings. It takes practice because it’s a skill, but once you figure out how you want to do it, it will be second nature for you.
Another thing to think about is not to act out of fear and try not to let your fear depress you. Try to confront your fear and figure out what is really frightening you. Instead of focusing on the worst, focus on the best. There’s a wonderful book called “Feel the fear and do it anyway”. I don’t remember the author, but I find it helps to simply repeat this to myself: “Feel the fear and do it anyway”.
We will always encounter the Diva choral directors, the Dr. Us and the MGF types who trigger us and frighten us, but we cannot allow these people to steal our joy. We have a right to be happy and joyful and we cannot allow them to rain on our parade.
Ironically, it is the Ns who are very fearful people. Ns act out of fear and depravation and that is one of the reasons that Ns make other people feel miserable and triggered. Ns are afraid, so they put other people down so they can feel better. Instead of confronting the root cause of their fear, Ns project their fear onto other people. It’s very sick and sad. So, next time someone puts you down or triggers you, ask yourself if that person is acting out of their own fear and if you think they are, don’t let it get to you. Put up a boundary around your feelings so that you will not absorb their fear.
I’m so happy the cantata went well and the Diva told you that you did a very good job. You see, the Diva was afraid that things wouldn’t go well, La Diva was worried, so she dumped her fear on you, but in the end, everything did go well. So, it just doesn’t pay to worry. You will feel much happier if you keep a positive mind and know that God will protect you (which you know already).
She bought me flowers for my birthday and took me out etc. That makes her feel the right to hurt me. That is the confusing thing of some Ns. They do nice things to you so you stay and put up with thier sh*t. My mother did that to me all the time. And she always said "after I have given you roof over your head, feed you, lower your fever when you had meassles, etc etc " then she kicks me in the face with very hurting things.
That is why this woman treggers me so badly. She is just like my mother.
I was really amazed at the connection you made between GFM and your mother. Bravo!!!!! It is so important to make connections and see our patterns. Did you ask yourself “what is it about GFM that I don’t like and who does she remind me of?” You probably sensed her vibe of “look what I did for you, now you owe me”, you felt the guilt and made the connection to your mother. You’re doing such excellent work, Lupita!!! You are developing so much insight into yourself and others. Look how wise and deep you are.
Today I identified a thought that was making me feel bad. I thougt of my son getting from my mother all she denied to me. Then I thought, what good does it make to me to be sad. My son will come back in a few days. The girl friend probably will not be his girlfriend for a long time. What good does it make to me to be sad for what my mother did not give me. It is to suffer double. When she refused and now again. No reason for it.
I love that you are identifying your thoughts and asking yourself why they make you feel bad. This is so wonderful!! Exactly: Double suffering!! Life is way too short for single suffering, let alone double suffering!!
Today ofr the first time in my life I identified a negative thougt, I identified the feeling provoked by the negative thought and I said to my slef, why to feel bad because my son is with my mother? why to feel bad becayse my son GFM is stilling him? My son can enjoy my mother and his GFM. There is nothing wronf with that. I do not have to feel bad about that. I feel flat now, wich is much better that sad and depreesed.
For me that is a huge step.
Donde esta Lupita? I think a Zen Buddhist wrote this!! Oh My, Lupita!!! Listen to you!!! You are a NEW PERSON. It is Amazing!! You have really absorbed this thinking so quickly. YOU ARE AWESOME!! That’s right: you have no control over who your son will be friends with, fall in love (?) with, no control over your mother, nor GFM, etc. You are “letting go and letting God”. You are freeing yourself from the unhappiness and burden of worrying about things and people over whom you have no control. Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Fantastic. I think you have found freedom, your freedom: YOU HAVE FREED YOURSELF!!!!!!!!!! That's double joy!!
Mia Lupita, I don’t know when you will respond to me, but as I said, I leave Thursday for 10 days. I may not be able to answer you porque tengo muchas cosas hacer (I have a lot to do before I leave).
In case I don’t speak to you again, I wish you a Feliz Navidad y Feliz Ano Nuevo. Pienso que usted esta una Mujer Nueva, una Mujer Nueva por el ano Nuevo y su Vida Nueva. I hope you will enjoy the holidays and enjoy your new found freedom, La Nueva Libertad.
VIVA LUPITA!!!
I wish all of you a very Merry Christmas and a very Happy New Year.
-
Hello Observer,
You are giving Lupita such a tremendous amount of attention and intense motherly affection. And speaking her language too! It must feel wonderful to her to be the recipient of your intimate concern. And she is the only person you have spoken to here.
It's a little confusing, to hear this grand voice, focused so intently on Lupita alone, but not acknowledging anyone else. I apologize for this, but I am willing to be wrong: I am wondering if you have been here before under another name and do not want to be honest about that.
I might be oversensitive and feeling protective of the board, but something feels unsafe in this exchange. I tend to have intuitive skill at recognizing familiar voices, in the subtle shades of language. But it's not infallible.
That is why I am checking it out with you openly, because I may be mistaken. If I am wrong, you can of course say so. And I will be glad to apologize.
I remember asking you two questions a little while back, but you never responded:
1) would you like to tell us a little about yourself?
2) have you ever posted on the board under another name?
I am looking forward to learning about you. I hope you will respond. If you do not, then my unease is confirmed, and I will remove my nose from this dialogue and just tend to my own boundaries. I hope there is not something deceptive going on.
(Sorry, Lupita. You need and deserve much support and attention. I know this may be upsetting to you, and if you are angry with me for my concern, I won't blame you at all.)
Hops
-
Hello Hops,
I was about to turn off my computer because, if you read my post, you’d see that I said I’m dead tired. But I see you posted, so I read it.
If you notice, I chose the name “observer” because I like to observe. I was a luker. I used to read Lupita’s posts and I felt badly for her. She really seemed to suffer. So, I jumped in. Seems like I’m helping Lupita. Now, she’s really amazing me because Lupita is mastering her unhelpful thinking patterns very quickly, so I feel encouraged. Why did I intervene into Lupita’s life? I don’t know. Kismet? Synchronicity? Who knows, but, I think it’s a good thing.
Now, please understand I’m really tired, so sorry if I sound rough. If you read my post, I did thank people for saying nice things about me. But, I find your latest post irksome. Why are you pushing me so hard? Am I not satisfying you? Do I have to satisfy you? No. This is Lupita’s thread, so I am communicating with her, Si? Mais non? Mais Oui! Ecco!
As mentioned, I’m an “observer”, I like to observe more than get involved in the action. I feel like you are some kind of sheriff out for truth and justice or some dime store detective bent on nabbing the shoplifter or a member of the House Unamerican Activities Committee. What’s up with you? What did I do to you? Why are you after me? What crime did I commit? Did I kiss a Communist?
I share what I want to share and I don’t like the way you seem to be pushing and pressing me. You seem very self rightous.
If you read my post, you’d ascertain that I’m short on time. I’m leaving in 2 days and have a million things to do. I simply don’t have time to respond to everyone.
Now, there’s been a lot of disharmony on this board and, although I didn’t want to add to the disharmony, you keep pushing, so I felt that if I didn’t answer you, it would appear like I had something to hide and I don’t. I just don’t like nosy nelsons. So, even though I did not want to add to the disharmony, you’ve pushed me. Why did you do it? Didn’t you post about how you wanted harmony? I don’t understand. Seems like you contradict yourself. You say you want peace, but you provoke.
Again, what did I do to you? Why are you breathing down my neck? and why do you care if I want to help Lupita or speak to her in Spanish? No comprendo.
So, this feels like “High Noon” and I’m Gary Cooper. Super duper.
OK. Got that off my chest. I apologize. I don’t want to bring negativity. It’s quite ironic, because I wanted to post to you about my method for dealing with overwhelming mail and then you give me the Mickey Spillane. Ah, what the heck: Put a nice big basket (a pretty one) by your entry door; dump all your mail in it. Once a week, take the basket, turn of the TV or listen to nice music and separate the bills, junk and magazines. Now, throw out all the junk, so only the bills and important letters are left. Take a 15-20 minute break. Then, commit to yourself that you will spend one hour paying bills. If you need more time than 1 hour, take another 15-20 minute break and finish the bills. Wash, rinse, repeat. This way, you can get through your mail in 2-4 hours and then you’re FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YIPPEE!!!!!!
Sorry if I didn’t respond to others who posted. Mea Culpa. I’d love to if I had more time. Lord willing, I will have that time come the new year.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all.
-
Hops,
The more I read your post, the more ticked I get.
Who died and made you Queen? Is this board your realm? Are you a supervisor? What an ego.
Now, I see how fights on the board occur. It's terrible. I let you suck me in. Great. Here, I thought I was doing something nice for someone (Lupita) and you have to ruin it. Why? Don't like to see people happy?
Hops, please take a good look at yourself and ascertain your motivation. I'm mad at myself for engaging with you. I should have let it go and let people reach their own conclusions.
-
I've just decided that I'm not going to post anymore.
Hops: you are poison and toxic. I read your post again and see how jealous you are. And what a hypocrite, saying you want peace on the board and then subtly spewing your venom. I pity your daughter.
Lupita: you're on the right road, just keep going.
-
I pity your daughter.
Pure class.
mud
-
I am wondering if you have been here before under another name and do not want to be honest about that.
Bingo. Just wanted you to know that: You are correct! Trust those instincts Hops.
WHEN will it be clear to everyone who posts here consistently that there is NO obstacle to people posting here as ANYONE?
There are no rules, no one to answer to -- people come to this board and say and do what they want, good or bad.
And they get away with it too. All the time.
-
Yes, I felt nosy. It was twitching like a beagle's.
I didn't feel jealous, but something didn't feel right.
(Again, Lupita, I'm sorry -- I took the risk of hurting you but I hope I did it for the right reasons. I care about you. Please feel free to vent anything you need to. I will understand.)
And I can see self-righteous.
But still. Something didn't feel right.
I don't think I can offer a better explanation. I am always able to be wrong.
I am sorry to anyone who is angered or disappointed or confused by my post.
I know it was rude in a way, to ask for a story or identity.
I don't know how else to show Lupita and the board what my unease was about.
Anonymous, if you'd please PM me, I'd be grateful.
I'll butt out now,
Hops
-
Observer: But I am going to find Ns everywhere. According to a book i red recently 8% of people are Ns. So if I go to a group of ten, at lieast one will be an N. Then that person tells me something triggering and I come back home crying and do not go back there again.
And many of you on this board find it almost impossible that there are narcissists posting or at least lurking about? unreal
~Laura
p.s. I agree with Mud...what class...sheesh!
-
I don't know........ for an observer, who's just passing through with no time at all.... I'd say Observer was more invested than she knew, herself.
The response to Hops was a surprise.
I was expecting something short that explained a little about Observer just as a friendly traditional hello to the board.
-
> Just voicing with my own independent voice, that's all, WYSIWYG.
Well, I have only just come onto this thread and I am :shock: and so surprised to see that Observer has gone!! And in such a way.
Why?
Whoever he/she was, had only offered tremendous support and encouragement to Lupita, stepping in at a time when Lupita was floundering, as we all could * see * and were struggling, as none of us could seemingly offer the right support and signposting at that time.
And, personally, I too have gleaned so much from Observer's posts, as I am sure others (guests maybe) have to.
Some of us, myself included, glean and benefit much from Signposting to sites, Articles and Books, I respect that they are not everyone's cup of tea, but, on a worldwide scale, the content of which brings insight, learning and subsequent life changes to the good.
Did anyone PM Observer at all to enquire? For the record, I did not. (but, then as you may know I don't PM that way it's out on the board)
Admittedly, Observer's response has surprised me also, but then, in light of the fact that Observer said that he/she was tired, just maybe, that could have some significant bearing on Observer's response to the questions put directly to him/her.
Observer did seem to show genuine care and compassion for Lupita, in stepping in with sound insightful articles and resources, the book etc. Which evidently has been beneficial to Lupita as we can clearly * see *
((((( Lupita ))))) you have been working so well with your book; working hard at it for you, and my heart's desire is that you will see full growth and be as you wish to be. You are an intelligent, wise woman, you are more than you realize, and so I have no doubt at all. Sincerely.
And just a thought, who is the "guest" Anonymous ?? Hops, you have asked the person to PM you, shall you then be advising us to the identity of this guest, bearing in mind all the recent discussions against the use of "guests" to drop 'ripples into the clear water' etc etc. As recently, I have been reading through 2004's postings and other's too, and there was a "guest" Anonymous there, with a similiar voice.
Just wondering and thought that I would ask the question.
Oh dear, don't know what to make of it all, really.
Love, Leah
PS> Just read again, and Observer's first post was intelligent, thoughtful and well written, a lengthy informative encouraging post, which would seem to have been time consuming, given the time restraints mentioned, and all of which included website links that look useful. At the end of it all, clearly, we were all on the board wished a Happy Christmas and New Year.
Maybe, just maybe Observer was tired, maybe just maybe, Observer did not have the time to spare in full posting engagement on the board??
There was only good stuff in Observer's postings to Lupita on Lupita's threads, that I can * see *
YET, we have had someone else join as a member with a name who used us all like objects in a boardgame with various moves and tactics.
As I said, sincerely, I am not sure what to make of all this really, but, I will have a think about it.
-
Hops in light of the fruitful ongoing conversation between Lupita and Observer, whatever possibly undisclosed past that poster may or may not be trailing around behind her, what in the world made you prioritize your inquiries over their discussion right now?
As Leah has already mentioned, their conversation has already rendered great inspiration, motivation and new learning for Lupita, assisting her in ways that no one else has been able to. I'm saying that, whatever else you may suspect about Observer is very marginal and tertiary compared to the important and relevant aid she was providing in that conversation. Additionally, however rude, irascible and immoderate Observer's reaction may have been - she was still engaged in a fruitful dialog with Lupita.
Next time, I hope that as a person with a conscience you will weigh the pros and cons between the manifest benefit to others, on the one hand, and your own need to know, on the other, and save it for an actual issue in the here and now instead of a vague and nebulous possible something of the there and then or the when and where? It's just not important here whether you are right or not about Observer. I couldn't give a toss whether Observer has been around here before, but I do care very much that Lupita is making such progress.
Also, Lupita is a brave and accomplished adult woman and not in need of chaperonage whilst conducting a public conversation. Would that such a consideration had been placed in the weighing of the balance.
Personally, I am not at all taken aback that on the internet there are anonymous posters and posters who pop up under different names or that they might come around at any time. though it is amusing that an anonymous poster will come proclaim how dire it all is with the implication that the unaware sheep are munching grass while the storm gathers. What drama!
-
Points taken.
I think you're right. Thanks (oof), Iphi. Clear light of morning.
I think I was being invasive and meddlesome and trying to control something.
I did feel uneasy, but maybe that's my problem. I guess if I had the strong serenity-boundaries I talk about, I would've let it go.
In (mild) defense, I think it may have had something to do with recent activity on the board, as Leah described. But still.
Maybe there was subterranean jealousy I wasn't owning. I am not sure.
(Inspecting navel, removing lint.) And intuition can be over-rated (nope, never heard from Anon., but that's okay, don't need to.)
So I apologize to you, Observer. I have preferences about how we greet and treat each other but that scrutiny ought to include the railroad tie in my own eyeball. And you're right, I don't own the place. I am sorry. You are engaging and supporting Lupita very generously and it was wrong of me to assume anything nefarious without clearer reason.
Please accept my apology, and I hope you have a good vacation.
I don't understand who you are yet, but you must have your reasons.
I will get to know you when you're ready to share.
And thank you for the paper chaos taming suggestion. It's a good one.
With sherrif's badge back in the cereal box,
Hops
-
Thank you Hops for your non-reactive response. I'm only human too and an ACON to boot, with lots of work to do on my communication skills.
Further to that thought, I think it is eminently understandable that a pack of ACONs have a lack of practice, even a lack of working knowledge, even a lack or recognition, of the benefits of, diplomacy and mending disputes and letting things go. I, for one, never learned that at home. I recognize it as a real deficit in myself. In short, I suck at it. I also recognize it as a real deficit in lots of people here. No doubt we will continue to find that we suck at it.
I also think we all have trouble surrendering our trained-in desperate survival desire to attempt to make things safe, even things (perhaps especially things) that you can't take the risk out of. So let's all wear our helmets and just continue to try.
With that disclaimer, and the further disclaimer that I was an English major and continue to proof and edit for clarity and best expression in my current job, I propose to you this edit in your otherwise forthcoming and well written apology:
"You are engaging and supporting Lupita very generously and it was wrong of me to assume anything nefarious without clearer any reason."
I think that will go over much better. Imo, qualifying language does not go over well in apologies.
Now if only every self-appointed sherriff would get wise and surrender their cereal box badges, we could let our hair down, eat popcorn and paint our toenails. Mud first. Will it be green sparkles or purple iridescence?
-
Oh dang. Iphi, I believe you. For an apology to work best it is better for it to be unequivocal.
I am trying to walk a rope covered with peanut butter. I am no saint. I'm just...quivocal.
I do want to apologize to anyone upset by my post, and especially Lupita. And Observer. How do I know why Observer wants it this way? To be someone "new", to break continuity, to not really be known? Just to be a voice in Lupita's ear? Eeek. See the dilemma...I want to be compassionate to Observer's need to be who s/he wants to be. Okay, that's my want. But my innards are having another reaction. It's not black and white. I am feeling a mix of motives. And maybe I'm MISSING Observer! Maybe I don't even know who I'm missing! Oy, confusion.
I do not want to discount my intuition that Observer is a previous poster. Which may or not equal Up To No Good. It may be some issue that's private to Observer about previous self-disclosure. I really don't know. And as you say, there's no rule or promise here that folks won't do that. That it makes me uneasy is a personal issue, not a board issue (I tried to make it one, and I am sorry I did). As you say, though, that's just the nature of the world, and of this microcosm. Maybe it doesn't bother others else, and I did have the option to note and observe my unease in silence. The personal serenity goal would be not to be bothered enough about it to hop into someone else's thread and pot-stir. Oiks. I flunked.
(Not that Observer is up to anything nefarious. Personally, I'm ill at ease when people seem to want to know and "direct" others in an intimate way--particularly others who've stated they're feeling needy as Lupita just did--but it's all one-way, they do not want to be known themselves. Even though anyone, particularly on the Net, has every right to be cloaked, in this board context where people are wounded, it sets off my lack-of-reciprocity and/or boundary alarms. Probably because I have a history of such wounds and problems myself -- so eager for any affection or attention that I never noticed that I was disclosing like crazy, sharing my vulnerability and loneliness and neediness like mad, and the person who was cheering me on and making such intimate assurances had told me literally nothing about themself. Unless they were really cruel to me later. I also have had times in the past when I was invasive. Err, maybe also in the present. UGH. Aha. So it does come from my experience. Maybe I'm unconsciously identifying with something in Observer that's got my id wiggly.)
I wanted to apologize to own up to wanting to control things, and acting sherrify. And being rude to Observer, and disrupting a conversation that was helpful to Lupita. It was NOMB, and I did intrude.
But if I changed it to "without any reason" rather than "without clearer reason" I'd be saying I had no reason at all for it happening in the first place.
Random as my brain can be, there was reason. (Doesn't mean a good reason or an objectively accurate one, but that in my brain, there was a reason.) It was fallible intuition, unprovable, and I think your most important point was...unecessary. I could have chosen not to stick my nose in. And I could also have chosen not to cast doubt on Observer's character. Which is rude and unwelcoming. My character isn't perfect by a long shot. I had tried a softer invite for Observer to be more open but that hadn't worked. Not sure why I decided to be the self-appointed "Introduce yourself before advising Lupita so powerfully" bossypants. In part, I was feeling protective of Lupita. And as you say, that may be inappropriate. "feeling protective" doesn't mean that Lupita needed my protection, and it's even sort of condescending. (I'm sorry, Lupita.) Maybe Observer's got nothing murky whatsoever mixed in with the desire to be nice to Lupita. That's perfectly possible and I was too quick to judge. I'm a nosy-noisy bystander in this instance.
Still, had to apologize as I did, because otherwise I would've been completely cancelling out my own flash of intuition. I can't take it back because: a) I already stirred the pot, and b) because between me myself and I, although my intuition's fallible, when it's signalling persistently I have promised myself to at least not discount it completely. (Have to apologize once the horse has broken through the barn wall though. Nothing else I can do.)
So in considering your response in particular, I am modifying my overconfidence in my intuition but not discarding the whole enchilada so as to still be respectful of myself. I can apologize for a behavioral thing, if not a reasoning thing, and reconsider things in the best possible light I can.
Thanks, Iphi. I know this was convoluted. And I have worked it to death.
Again, Lupita and Observer, I apologize for interrupting. If either of you want to start a fresh thread to continue your conversation, that would be great. I promise you I will not intrude there at all.
Gasp, wore myself out and probably bored and annoyed everybody else.
(BTW, your point about the unrealistic desire to create perfect safety--including asking for reciprocal disclosure--is spot on. All one can do is ask for what one wants, and let go of the outcome. IOW, not try to control everything. Heist on me own petard.)
Hops
-
(((hops))) it's the same for me too. And I'm sorry to be all 'hey' when you are having a challenging week. And remember our context - it is the dreaded holiday season. What I'm trying to say - as far as you and me - is I have the same feelings - we have the same background. Many of us on this board are working the same issues and their ramifications and it seems like these very issues trip us up, especially when they go unrecognized and unclaimed.
-
Hello Observer,
You are giving Lupita such a tremendous amount of attention and intense motherly affection. And speaking her language too! It must feel wonderful to her to be the recipient of your intimate concern. And she is the only person you have spoken to here.
It's a little confusing, to hear this grand voice, focused so intently on Lupita alone, but not acknowledging anyone else. I apologize for this, but I am willing to be wrong: I am wondering if you have been here before under another name and do not want to be honest about that.
I might be oversensitive and feeling protective of the board, but something feels unsafe in this exchange. I tend to have intuitive skill at recognizing familiar voices, in the subtle shades of language. But it's not infallible.
That is why I am checking it out with you openly, because I may be mistaken. If I am wrong, you can of course say so. And I will be glad to apologize.
I remember asking you two questions a little while back, but you never responded:
1) would you like to tell us a little about yourself?
2) have you ever posted on the board under another name?
I am looking forward to learning about you. I hope you will respond. If you do not, then my unease is confirmed, and I will remove my nose from this dialogue and just tend to my own boundaries. I hope there is not something deceptive going on.
(Sorry, Lupita. You need and deserve much support and attention. I know this may be upsetting to you, and if you are angry with me for my concern, I won't blame you at all.)
Hops
[/b][/b]
Hops.... you asked for more information from this poster on at least one other occassion.
You were ignored, which is Observer's right.
By the same token, you have the right to feel safe and ask questions on the board without being accused as pretender to the throne, in an attempt to shame and punish you.
I felt Observer's response was drastically over the top, considering the tone of your questions and post, which I provided here for reference.
Please don't feel guilty for asking questions and trusting your instincts.
You quite clearly exprssed gratitude, layed out your concerns and asked for clarification, which I didn't find innapropriate.
Observer's hostile response, however, struck me as very innapropriate.
You have a right to feel safe here.
Fortunately, you don't need anyone's approval to use your voice.
Giving yourself permission ... is enough.
Lighter
-
Sad really, as I thought Iphi and Hops engaged wonderfully well between them, as two voicing mature adults.
Now, I just don't know what to think, really.
Leah
-
specific details all aside, I'm sitting here wondering WHAT DOES IT MATTER WHO POSTS WHAT TO WHOM? Why are people so concerned about this stuff. I don't get it, Hops. I don't get it at all. Why is it so important to you about whom Observer talks to and why is it so crucial that Observer remains anonymous. Helllllllllllllllllllo, this is a computer chat board. Yes, there are real people here...people who are behind a screen, hold NO POWER over you whatsoever, can't decide what you do or don't do, hold no rule-making power against you. I just am not getting why some people on this board are so hung up on this stuff. please enlighten me.
Ugh
~Laura
-
Dear Laura,
Sad really, now, as I felt that Iphi and Hops had engaged wonderfully well between them, as two voicing mature adults, and that it was all resolved. Having realized and acknowledged that Observer only ever posted good stuff, which I received much from, the intelligent clearly written informative posts, with articles, signposting to good sites and a book. All of which, we could all clearly * see * evidently benefited Lupita, on Lupita's own thread, to which Lupita was engaging with, and enjoying. I feel sure others (guests) too, as myself, enjoyed the context and content also.
Observer may have a busy life, not able to sit and type much, who gives a lot of time, with understanding, in the postings.
Observer registered as a member, after much talk about guests posting. Observer explained time restraints, and tiredness, and also greeted everyone with seasonal greetings. The person, Observer, obviously wanted to post to Lupita last night due to going away for a holiday for a couple of weeks, so as to not leave Lupita wondering. And included much encouragement, and further valuable intelligent information.
Lupita is an intelligent, wise woman, of maturity and is well able to look out for herself, as she does, evidently, here on the board, which is all to the good and to the credit of her, as a mature adult human being.
Maybe, Observer, the person, does not feel comfortable in sharing, divulging, personal private matters, at this point in time? Now, we won't know in any case, as Observer has said that they are no longer going to post onto the board. So Lupita loses out, as will others too.
Observer posting, has been okay with me, given what I * see * in the postings made on the board, which have only had good intentions. My hope is that, Observer posts again, after holiday break.
No one here on this board ever "fails me" as I am not here for a therapist or a carer, but rather, I am here as an independent mature woman with my voice for a voice on a voicelessness board.
Leah
-
It's okay, RM.
I take your point.
Don't want to re-stir and I don't think I can enlighten you any better.
And sorry for the confusion, Leah.
thanks,
Hops
-
Dear Hops,
Rest assured, I don't feel any confusion, none at all, only clarity.
Love, Leah
-
I understand, Leah.
As I've tried to say in several different ways, I'm sorry I broke up a conversation that may have been beneficial to Lupita and/or Observer.
I hope they'll talk again on a new thread.
I think I've made all the amends I can.
I'm sorry it distressed you.
love
Hops
-
Hi Observer,
Just wanted to say that I am not clear on what is going on here. :?
In all honesty, I was shocked by what you wrote:
Hops: you are poison and toxic. I read your post again and see how jealous you are. And what a hypocrite, saying you want peace on the board and then subtly spewing your venom. I pity your daughter.
You seem so stable and on target with what you post to Lupita, and yet to say something, which IMO is so very cruel? I don't understand. Were you triggered by Hops?
Frankly, I thought that if you didn't want to reply, a simple response such as the following would suffice: “I appreciate your concern for Lupita Hops, especially given the recent board conflict, but at this time I am not willing to answer your questions. Perhaps in time I will be more forthcoming. If Lupita or anyone else prefers that I don’t post to them without having more information about me, then I will gladly refrain from posting. Please let me know.”
Mostly, I am concerned for Lupita. She does not need any more hurt or upheaval, she has had more than her share I think.
From another observer who is very concerned by this exchange,
Peace
-
Just a terrible punishing response that was intended to shame and blame Hops for having instincts at all, much less voicing them.
And it took some time to pen them too :?
-
I understand, Leah.
As I've tried to say in several different ways, I'm sorry I broke up a conversation that may have been beneficial to Lupita and/or Observer.
I hope they'll talk again on a new thread.
I think I've made all the amends I can.
I'm sorry it distressed you.
love
Hops
Dear Hops,
You have no need to apologize to me, none at all, as I was not distressed.
Honestly.
Merely, voicing what I perceived to be something that was to the good for Lupita, and others maybe (incl. guests), in Observer's postings.
That's all.
Love to you, Leah