Ns reactions to world events?

[Portia]

Hello all. How does your emotionally-challenged N react to big world tragedies when they are not directly involved? E.g. 9/11, shuttle disaster, Madrid bombs, train/plane/boat disasters, earthquakes etc.

I’m not getting into news reporting/media manipulation type stuff - just the simple N reactions. You know, once we think about these events, we start to modify our reactions but I’m interested in the first, basic, immediate emotional responses. I.e. do they have any show of empathy whatsoever?

Or is any emotion they show simple plain fear? (probably fear that something has happened, it’s getting lots of attention and it’s outside their control).

Tricky question I know but one I’ve been mulling over for a long while. Your experiences? Or web writings on the subject? Thank you P

[Wildflower]

Hi Portia,

I saw this posting and I just had to reply immediately!

In another posting I mentioned that my father and I were fighting a couple of years ago. Well, sometimes I lose track of how long it's been, but we were actually fighting in the wake of 9/11.  I live in NY and my office is kind of caddy-corner from the Trade Center (we can see the site from our office).  I also worked in the Tower 1, 86th floor in 1999.  I hated working there for a number of reasons that aren't really important - and I hated my job there even more.  So I complained a lot during that time.

Anyway, I wasn't at my office or anything when the planes hit, so I was very, very lucky.  But my stepmother works down there, too, and I was worried about her.  So I called my dad and told him the news (two planes have hit...possibly terrorist...etc).  He immediately replied, "Did you have it arranged?"             I told myself this was a knee-jerk reaction and told him it was very serious and I was worried about my step-mother.  He listed her planned errands for the morning (no, she wasn't home - and the phones that day were completely useless     ) and said he'd call back when he'd gotten in touch with her.

Well, over the next day or so (it's so hard to remember timelines from that month, though), he MADE JOKES about it.  I couldn't bear it.  I was traumatized and overwhelmed, like so many others, about how huge this was.  And I was outraged that anyone would DARE attack the city I love so much (but I won't go further than that for obvious political reasons). So I wanted to reach through the phone and bang his head against the wall until he understood how unbelievably...well...horrible he was being.  

The week before, we had made plans to have dinner on the Thursday after 9/11, but I'd obviously already had WAY more than enough of him, and the thought of being NEAR him during this time for fear of being sent to jail on murder charges.  And as it happened, all of my friends were getting together that night to have dinner, but really just to sit and stare in bewilderment while being supportive - and together.  I called my father to cancel dinner and man, did he have a tantrum, and he tried to rip new holes in me by saying this was so like me and blah blah blah about how much I hurt and torture him (ha!).

And a week later, I went to his site where he writes about how glorious and wonderful he is and how stupid others are (okay, sometimes I'm really hostile when I think about him) - and he was comparing OUR FIGHT to 9/11, wondering which was worse.  Poor, poor him.  Oh, never mind the THOUSANDS of other people who were devastated, if not worse by this.            

So I cut him off for a year.  The intention was to cut him off forever, but that's complicated as most of you know.

Rrrrrrrrrrr.  So, that's one N's reaction to world events.  Rrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Wildflower

P.S. - Thanks so much for the posting Portia.  Letting it sink in, but I just had to post this  

[Portia]

Wow, Jacmac and Wildflower, you both took my breath away, thank you for your posts. It’s a great area to find out what is ‘normal’ and what’s not! When we have outpourings of communal grief, look around and see who isn’t bothered and avoid them like the plague!  Maybe it’s a good question for future partners (re: a previous thread): “what did you feel when you saw the pictures on 9/11?”.

Jacmac, were you okay? Did you have PTS as a result? Sorry, I’m being very nosy but you painted a picture covered in soot and shocked me. And your N was weird, sounds a bit hyper too. Did he ever ask you about your day, seriously? Your next N sounds positively dangerous. That’s a strange story you relate! Wow.

Wildflower, gulp, your Dad’s knee-jerk reaction says a lot. What it says, not sure, but one thought I had: project all this bad news and emotion right back on to you, don’t deal with it. Make it your fault “Did you have it arranged?”. It’s a weird reaction however you look at it. And the rest of your story – well, it speaks for itself. But he really did that, compared your fight to 9/11? So 9/11 really threatened his sense of omnipotence and he had to somehow make it all to do with him, or make it the same size as his problem? Wow!!!!

This is amazing and very educational for me. More please! (My own contribution is tiny by comparison - I’ll keep it for now.) P

[Wildflower]

Hi Jacmac,

I know 9/11 may be hard to talk about and I completely understand it if you don't want to, but I'm also wondering if you were/are okay.  Did you have anyone around you besides the N to take care of you?

And I can't help wondering...does the second N's son live with him?  And how old is he?

Wildflower

[Hguest]

Reading this has taken my breath away...I was with 'my' N when the WT centre disaster happened,and,I hate even to write this,but he was thrilled by it,really elated. We were on a train at the time and he was moreorless shouting out; I felt so awful.
He is also very anti-Semitic;he denies it but it's obvious.
And,he told me many times that Hitler was a genius,for his ability to get so many people to follow him,and for his organisational skills.
I have often wondered why he had these opinions...reading these other posts on the subject is really unsettling. I couldn't believe my ears when he said these things.

[Wildflower]

Hi Portia,

Yeah, my dad's one real sick puppy, but now that I know about NPD, it's so much easier to deal with him because he's so obviously sick - nothing to do with me at all.  Before knowing about NPD, though, I used to take those accusations to heart.  His first response has always nagged at me, though, and I hadn't thought about him dumping his pain on me by making it my problem.  I think I'll have to mull that one over a bit.

My own contribution is tiny by comparison - I’ll keep it for now

Sometimes it's the little things that gnaw away at us and do the most harm, so I hope you do share your story.

Wildflower

[seeker]

Fascinating subject--pretty illuminating.  

Jacmac, the Jew-hating weirdo is just a classic I-get-to-dish-it-out kind of N.  Pretty anti-social in the DSM textbook sense of the word.  My NSIL is like this in a much milder form with the verbal abuse (not physical violence).  Sheesh.  I would have run for the hills listening to that story   Wildflower, congratulations on "beating the rap" (kidding!!   )  Aren't Ns just incredible?!!!

How about a lighter historical reference?

Have you heard of the Winchester Mystery House in California?  It's a very funky Victorian built by a widow/heiress of Winchester Rifle fame.  She was told by spirits of all the people killed by Winchester to build this house.  It is quirky to say the least.  She used to spy on her servants and no one was allowed to visit.  Even President Theodore Roosevelt was told to use the servants entrance (he left, instead).  She bought whole bolts of fabric so no one could buy the same fabric she had (even though she never went out and no one came over).  Held seances every night.  Slept in a different bedroom every night so the spirits couldn't find her and kill her....

So when the tour guide was explaining the damage the 1906 earthquake did to the house, I kept waiting for the obvious.  I wasn't disappointed.  She had been trapped in  her bedroom for hours by fallen beams and stuck doors.  The earthquake happened because the spirits were unhappy with the progress she was making on the house.    It was looking too good, so she left the damage as it was and turned to a different wing of the house to work on.  

One N in my life still hasn't recovered from Watergate.  Gets really tense and clenches his teeth over the fact his guy was smeared.  Can't laugh at parodies about it or anything.  Of course, he deflects with Monicagate. As for me, I think both Nixon and Clinton were rather vile in their own unique ways.  But that's me being disloyal again but not agreeing.

  Seeker

[Anonymous]

Hi guys.  Thanks for the inquiries.  You guys are so sweet   .  I work close to the Ground Zero sight, and at time worked within the buildings, but wasn't in the building at the time.  Wildflower, can you imagine?  You and I have probably passed each other by and didn't know it.

Anyway, the day of I took an unusually early assignment, usually I start at 10:00 a.m. but went in to work on that day for 9:00 a.m.  I got off the train just in time to see the second plane strike the building.  But our vantage point was at enough of a distance that we thought it was like a news copter or something.  

Anyway the soot thing.  I went into work like nothing was wrong.  New Yorkers can jump over a dead body and thing nothing of it, we're dissenticized to violence, just as long as we're not late for work.  Now that's unacceptable.  I was told, somethings going on in Washington, too.  No work today.  So I thought to myself, great, I'll go the gym.  On my way out, they were evacuating the Court House to the cellar.  I have HUGE control issues, and being locked into a cellar is a no, no for me.

I said to myself, literally, "You see how people panic for no reason."  I was so calm and cool and impressed with myself.  Well, the people were yelling and running the opposite direction of where I was walking.  I was actually walking, Duh! in the direction of the WTC, which was about five minutes away.  Seconds later, the sky darkened.  
It was like a scene out of some Sci-Fi movies.  That's when the first WTC building fell.  That's why I was covered with soot.  I ended up walking home.  
Took me about three hours.  But I walk over the bridge all the time, so that wasn't the horrible part.  But you know what, I don't know what was in that soot, but I was sick for days after.  Maybe post traumatic shock?

Anyway the N I was invovled with at the time NEVER asked how I was.  NEVER called.  And it's funny ,because his mother, who enabled and coddled him to no end, actually called me to tell me thank God, my son wasn't working ( I got rid of him because he WOULDN'T work); never asked after me as well.  So I said Well, he's an able bodied young man, why doesn't he go down and join the rescue effort, it's not like he's doing anything.  Needless to say, I never heard from her again.

As for the 13 year old juvenile delinquent turned N, he is very abusive to his son -- always trying to make him into a "man", which is heart breaking because the son is really passive by nature and what he's doing is only making him even more sensitive.  But of course doesn't see it.  

He's a true Archie Bunker.  Don't like nobody!  And of course, everyone is out to make a quick buck, everyone is plotting and planning.  No one has any good motives, and I'm such a niave "woman" to believe there's good in the world, God bless my little soul.

[Jacmac, as guest]

DRATS!!! Stupid computer!  That's me above, Jac mac

[Wildflower]

Hi Jacmac,

Glad to hear you made it through okay!

I said Well, he's an able bodied young man, why doesn't he go down and join the rescue effort, it's not like he's doing anything. Needless to say, I never heard from her again.

  Nice move!  I'll have to remember that one.

Very sad about the son of the N.    I hope the kiddo has some good friends around him.  Maybe someday in the future more people will know about the crippling effects of having N parents and it'll be considered the kind of child abuse that brings in the social workers.  

Wildflower

[cj]

He's a true Archie Bunker.  Don't like nobody!  And of course, everyone is out to make a quick buck, everyone is plotting and planning.  No one has any good motives, and I'm such a niave "woman" to believe there's good in the world, God bless my little soul.

I've heard that sort of thing in my family a lot. About their being few 'good' people, or it all being 'a racket' with everyone out to get what they can from you. Thing is it no doubt comes from the persons experiences themselves and how THEY have reacted to other people in their life, to develop that way of seeing, and how they feel about themselves.

[jacmac, as guest]

A thieft always thinks someone is stealing.

[cj]

you mean they project it onto others?

A thieft always thinks someone is stealing.

[cj]

Hmmm, examples I can think of.

Mentally ill people......'not quite right in the head/weird'

I recal watching as a child a programme about O.C.D. Being a kid (not knowing any better), I was laughing at this woman ritually checking her light switch, in how it was turned on off i.e had to be turned off properly. I'm sure my mother, while saying 'its not funny' was trying to suppress laughter, or did laugh. Ok, ignorance is there in people regarding mental illness, but um...*destress* should be easily recognised, whatever the context, no?

I've heard a few comments like this from her actually. One time my neighbour (an agrophobic, with something else going on I'm sure) was hitting her dog on the nose when it was being 'bad', and she trotted out something while reiterating it to me then later me and someone else, along the lines of 'oh, its a shame really, she doesn't really know what shes doing!'. I just got the feeling she was reiterating the story, not becasue she was sympathetic but because it made her sound so.

Ethiopians starving in africa during the Uk's Live aid concert....  'They have their own goverment to take care of them!'

[Gingerpeach]

The day after the World Trade Center destruction, my exNH sat down and wrote a "Letter to the Editor" of our local paper.  

The letter began...."I was walking across the beautifully wooded campus of the seminary where I am an enrolled Masters of Divinity candidate....."

You see?  It was all about HIM !!!!  And he wanted to make sure that EVERYONE in our small town that didn't know that he was in grad school would now know it  (and know how holy he thought he was.)

He gave me the letter for proofreading/editing.  When he saw all of my deletions, (and believe me, there wasn't much content left) he asked me why?  And with my new found (at the time) knowledge of Narcissism, I said,  "Well, it's really not about the tragedy, is it?"  

He turned on his heel and left the room.  I got the silent treatment for at least a week (a relief, actually) and he never asked me to proofread anything again.

Empathy?  I don't think so....... With Ns, it's all about opportunity.  They leave no stone unturned.  There is no tragedy they will not attempt to exploit.  I don't know if ever sent the letter.   I only know that it wasn't printed in the paper.